Virtuosos ever take Skill Focus: Perform?

[Pugsley]

You can either take the feat at 1/3/6 or wait until you can get Extra Song IV at level 10 to qualify for Virtuoso. (or the Negotiator feat, ha ha)

I don't really mind waiting to get the PRC, but I have to wonder if SF: Perform isn't good enough to take in it's own right. I have observed Fascinate being resisted in at-level quests, even with max Drow Cha and Perform. And sometimes, a resist just isn't an option. Especially when groups attack your fascinated guys instead of the ones who resisted.

I'm level 5, and just qualified for level 6.

[Hendrik]

You can either take the feat at 1/3/6 or wait until you can get Extra Song IV at level 10 to qualify for Virtuoso. (or the Negotiator feat, ha ha)

I don't really mind waiting to get the PRC, but I have to wonder if SF: Perform isn't good enough to take in it's own right. I have observed Fascinate being resisted in at-level quests, even with max Drow Cha and Perform. And sometimes, a resist just isn't an option. Especially when groups attack your fascinated guys instead of the ones who resisted.

I'm level 5, and just qualified for level 6.

As a Virt and IMO, Skill Focus is useful to a Virt at lower levels. At higher levels maybe not so much as you max that skill out as you level up.

I have been considering taking it up again at L20 just to hit 100DC on my Songs.

Grab it. Worse case use up your free feat swap to change it out if it does not work for you.

[Crazyfruit]

My characters with virtuoso always do, but I don't usually go up to 10 bard levels on them

At level 10 it's super cheap to change a feat with a lowly imperfect siberys dragonshard. A +3 to perform is a noticable boost all the way into the late mid levels if you rely on your enthralls often, and possibly later depending on the quests you run & gear you have.

I think that +3 also affects your chances of enemies breaking out of enthralls, so over time it can make a large difference if enemies are saving on more than a 1.

[gott_ist_tot]

I have observed Fascinate being resisted in at-level quests, even with max Drow Cha and Perform.

Fascinate's difficulty check comprises solely bard's perform skill added to a D20 roll. So, maxed charisma does not affect the ability being resisted in any way. What you witnessed may have been a result of low perform skill and a roll af 1 on the player side and monster rolling 20 to resist or some similarly extreme numbers.

In case of such (rolling 1 and 20) coincidence, your Perform skill would have to be 20+monster's will save, which at low levels is impossible. And with caster mobs... impossiblerer, even.

The ability is useful well into epics.

[Trillea]

Fascinate's difficulty check comprises solely bard's perform skill added to a D20 roll. So, maxed charisma does not affect the ability being resisted in any way.

This is incorrect. Max CHA adds to the perform skill total, and does affect the total DC of Fascinate. You are thinking of how bards acquire songs, which is by actual ranks in the skill - for example you cannot get the song Inspire Heroism without having 18 actual ranks in the Perform skill.

Edit: BTW a monster roll of 20 will resist anything that allows a save, Fascinate and Enthrall included.

[Anthios888]

Negotiator is a better feat. Since Skill Focus: Perform does something redundant -- no bard should need any more fascinate DC than they come with -- it's just not worth having. But everyone can use extra plat!

(And, perhaps the extra coin can help pay for your feat exchange when you respec to warchanter or spellsinger!)

[Pugsley]

(And, perhaps the extra coin can help pay for your feat exchange when you respec to warchanter or spellsinger!)

Yeah, yeah...

Warchanter >>>>>>> Spellsinger >> Virtuoso

Everyone knows it.

But you underestimate my ability to be horribly underpowered for long periods of time for the sake of an emotional attachment to an idea.

[Rav'n]

But you underestimate my ability to be horribly underpowered for long periods of time for the sake of an emotional attachment to an idea.

ROFL!! Permision for Signature!!

[Pugsley]

ROFL!! Permision for Signature!!

Oh yes, of course.

[AyumiAmakusa]

It's a waste of a feat slot. Your perform will be so high at endgame it won't matter.

[LunaCee]

Hey hey! I have a virtuoso in progress that has the negotiator feat... then again its a straight up haggle bard who going to be having a low 40's haggle at level 7. Mmm... tasty haggle.

[learst]

You can take it a to fulfil the pre-req for the Virtuoso PrE at lvl 6, but then you can swap it out for another feat at higher levels when you gain access to Extra Songs IV.

[gott_ist_tot]

This is incorrect. Max CHA adds to the perform skill total, and does affect the total DC of Fascinate. You are thinking of how bards acquire songs, which is by actual ranks in the skill - for example you cannot get the song Inspire Heroism without having 18 actual ranks in the Perform skill.

Edit: BTW a monster roll of 20 will resist anything that allows a save, Fascinate and Enthrall included.

Still, these 3-4 pts. make little difference on unlucky roll.
But, of course, guilty. Thank you for correction.

[Junts]

Still, these 3-4 pts. make little difference on unlucky roll.
But, of course, guilty. Thank you for correction.

It isn't 3-4 points. My bard recieves a +15-16 modifier to fascinate from charisma, by virtue of having a 40-42 charisma statistic.

It is very meaningful.

[Irinis]

Yeah, yeah...

Warchanter >>>>>>> Spellsinger >> Virtuoso

Everyone knows it.

But you underestimate my ability to be horribly underpowered for long periods of time for the sake of an emotional attachment to an idea.

LMAO! +1 rep

(And, perhaps the extra coin can help pay for your feat exchange when you respec to warchanter or spellsinger!)

Nyah nyah not gonna. (I already have Warchanters and Spellsingers, so my Virtuoso is staying Virtuous - er, Virtuosoish!)