D&D and PVP

[Vynnt]

Okay, so you are asking, have a separate character sheet for PvP?

This way it won't effect PvE.

This new character sheet, arcanes will do much less damage, heavy fort will not block all crits and sneak damage, DCs of spells would be changed, and gear will be equalized.

What about spike damage? like a Monk's Touch of Death that does 500+ damage? or Arcane Archer slayer arrow which does 500 damage? To balance, those would need to be changed. And, guard damage? 600 damage lightning strikes when hit? or GS weapons, same 600 damage lightning strikes would need to be changed.

And then you have cheezy class combos, like self healing evasion WF arcanes. How would a PvP sheet prevent that?

Change, change, change.

What you are asking for is a whole new game with the same engine. Games like Guild Wars was built to support PvP from the bottom up. DDO however isn't.

[Karavek]

Since you won't understand me any other way I will be blunt dnd isnt for pvp NO CHANGES FOR PVP EVER ok understand now.

just so you know I have every right to report you for trolling if you post on a forum that exist to discuss IMPROVING PVP. this forum does not exist to trash on it or those who enjoy it, nor discourage development from it. Anything other then participating in an actual discussion and offering ways to do that is a clear violation of the rules of forum use.

If you dont enjoy pvp or discussions about it cause you distress then stay out of the pvp forums. Coming here you only strive to create conflict and cause distress to those who enjoy pvp in games which has a place here in DDO that could be greatly improved upon if trolls would stop setting a fire to every thread started in this section.

You dont like to pvp great, you dont have to. I spend money on the game, have the right to see any aspect I enjoy improved upon. If that takes a small amount of dev time from pve so be it I and all others who want pvp have a right as a consumer to expect that attention given to it.

Telling me I cant play this game and pvp in a fair and fun pvp enviroment built to accomadate pvpers as numerous MMO have and will all continue to evolve towards is nothing but argumentive and trying to provoke conflict pure and simple.

[Karavek]

I haven't done any PvP in DDO yet, but what is the incentive other than just fighting other PCs?

Is there any reward at the end?

I would think special PvP tourneys with unique rewards - even as mundane as a title or custom doodad for your avatar that is evident to everyone else - would be an incentive to create more PvP styled characters.

Does DDO do this?

If not, you'd think DDO could take a page from the MTG: online game and sell tourney entry tickets where the winner receives a level appropriate item or a block of turbine points.

plus to rep for actually doing what the pvp forum says its for and suggest ways to improve it and make it more enticing to play.

[herzkos]

Though I'm not a fan of PVP at all, those are some
interesting ideas. I'm all for whatever makes this game
more fun for others (as well as myself) to play.

My point of view. If the dev's can implement improvements to pvp
without adversely impacting the PVE aspect of the game: go for it.
If they can't, then they shouldn't.
The only things I don't want to see are loot "earned" in pvp and TP earned
in pvp.
I'd be wary of the rank/title whatever added on as well.

[AyumiAmakusa]

I don't get why PvP needs to be balanced. Let the manyshot archer or the Touch of Death Monk do their 1-hit KOs. Makes you think of creative ways to kill them (like swarm them with friends ).

[Delt]

DDO will never have *balanced* PvP -- so many of our PvE tools are completely unbalanced (or broken). When you can kill a level 20 in one shot/spell, its broken. When you can outright negate important class spells/ability damage with a single spell/item/etc, it's broken. When you can chain no fail holds, it's broken. To make PvE toons balanced in the scope of PvP requires a complete retooling of the basic game mechanics (or disable/nerf a bunch of things in the pvp environment)...and that won't, or at least shouldnt) happen.

That said, DDO could implement Monster Play. They already have working experience with it and while I doubt DDO can handle it to the same level LotRO did, it could work on a smaller scale. Then they can balance from a PvE standpoint, but with PvP mechanics.

[bigolbear]

first off let me say i do like pvp in this game, and i can see ways it can be improved.

pvp in ddo is at its best when its team vs team, either death match or ctf. The bar brawls are too restrictive and the arenas too small in my opinion.

from my experiences with pvp in pen and paper its done for 3 reasons:
1. one party member has an issue with one or more other party members, usualy its a case of alignment issues and such, for example the paladin decides hes had enough of the rogue stealing treasure that should be going to the church. I dont see this option being represented in ddo very well unless its by serious roleplayers who take the time to organise their own events.

2. practicing and training, using non lethal techniques. This happens all the time in ddo, many people go to pvp just to test aspects of their character - saves ac to hit rolls etc.

3. tourneys, jousts and mage duels. This is an area of pvp that could use some work in ddo - in a traditional tourney of skill there would be various categories that players may compete in and find them selves up against other players and various npc's. for example a the folowing party goes to a tourney: grumbar the dwarf fighter, fingers the halfling rogue, mcarthy the human cleric and psiforge the warforge sorc/pally.

There are 4 events taking place: combat, archery, mage duels and gauntlet.we'll look at each event in turn.
combat: one on one duels with a 30 second prep time after which no spell/scroll/item casting is allowed.
archery: aiming at static and moving targets to score points.
mage duel: one on one duels with a 30 second prep time - all spells alowed.
gauntlet: a race through trap and slime infested tunnels to reach the exit

grumbar enters for combat and the gauntlet as he feels he has enough hit points to take the traps.
fingers enters for the gauntlet and the archery as hes good with a repeater xbow.
mcarthy enters for combat and mage duels
psiforge enters for all of them because hes overconfident and warforge are the master race.

now this to me sounds like it may make for a good pvp quest or even a raid with the potential that as well as players going up against npc's they also go up against each other in a series of contests while their freinds cheer them on.

To my mind this would be a good example of pvp in pen and paper, and i see no reason why it wouldnt work in ddo, sure there is a posibilty for exploiting the system but there is with many existing quests.

as regards the balance issue between casters and non casters in pvp its not supposed to be balanced, mages are supposed to be very powerful one on one if preped. Thats why magic scares the pesants and its why traditionaly pvp in pen and paper has always made distinctions between the classes or atleast the party roles.

to your point about pve chars being no good for pvp i simply dont agree. some of the most important skills for pvp are **** handy in pve and most vets will take them, balance and jump are the prime examples im thinking off. hit points and to hit/damage are just as important in pvp as they are in pve. Saving throws are usualy vastly underrated in pve but that is a mistake and dont forget the deathblock and fortification. To be honest ive been building my chars with pvp in mind for some time now and im finding that shoring up those weak points is making my chars much beter in a pve situation.

oh and finaly if some one disagrees with you about something its their right to an opinion, harasment is something different, i would like to see pvp improved but not at any serious cost to pve development, preferably new high lvl non epic content, races prestiges and spells.