Improving PvP

[CrescentCalling_5]

Just a note, if you can't bother to actually read my post all the way through before you shoot it down, don't post at all. I don't want to hear anyone who hasn't read and I doubt the other thousands of players want to hear your automatic no either. Thank you those who are polite enough to read through my suggestion

I'd also like to list the following alterations to this idea considering what everyone else is saying:

1. All PvP rewards should be PURELY cosmetic for bragging rights (emotes, emblems, dyes, etc.) and ABSOLUTELY NOTHING that can be traded, sold, or moved from character to character (no profit or other benefit except bragging rights).
2. This should not be implemented until ALL prestige enhancements, base classes, and other planned PvE features are implemented (I said it below and I'll say it again).
3. No changes will be made to PvE to accomodate PvP gameplay, that's unfair to people who do not PvP and like PvE the way it is.
4. Some spells and abilities should be restricted in PvP gameplay ONLY, that means rule 3 is followed and some balances are enforced in PvP to make it fair.
5. No Duelling System which is just annoying, at best a seperate duelling arena or no PvP at all outside of the arenas.
6. To be continued if anyone else makes a valid point regarding PvP.

Before I actually state my idea I'd like to make one thing clear first. If this gets implemented before ALL the prestige enhancements and races are in, balanced, and debugged the developers should remove them before I lead an angry mob to their hq :3
So to the point, this is a suggestion for AFTER we have the content and races (half-orc, druid, all prestiges, etc.) shoved and balanced into the game.

Edit as of 8/31/10 when I read a post, located on Page 7: http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=271195&page=7

I will only quote parts of it btw :P since it argues in favor of and against PvP. The full quote can be read on Page 7 of this thread.

So on that note, here is all that needs to be known and or done about making PvP better in DDO.

Arenas are a poor venue for those who enjoy PvP.

The only solution PvP needs in DDO is to make a copy of one outdoor adventure zone and enable it for PvP in the same way they enable the Arena’s for PvP. Since common areas are already load balanced, you use the same code to load balance the PvP zone.




Don't worry at all about class balance.

It would indeed be a waste of resources as no matter how finely tuned a game's PvP balance is there are always "The best" classes and builds and the "most gimp" classes and builds.

and my way of removing the e-peen chat crud that is likely to appear from it (once again, only partially quoted):

I actually like your idea of PvP, it simply involves copying a single map (or a few maps), recoding a few parts of it, and leaving all the environmental effects in (for a bit of flavor). Low resource cost, low effort, me like

I may have an idea how to remove some of the PvP chat with it:

Make a PvP entrance area (not the tavern) that is completely seperate from the other chat channels. Removes the majority of the **** (and we all know that there are idiots who will go around bragging about their tavern brawls in DDO today, so a majority is all we really need xD)

Also I'm adding in the following quote because it asked the question that was on my mind

I have a hypothetical question that I am curious about.

Say Turbine did have an infinite amount of resources. Do the people who disagree with the OP still feel that no resources should be put towards PvP?

3 qualifications to the above:
1) PvP changes do not affect PvE gameplay
2) Nothing can be earned in PvP beyond cosmetic/trophy style rewards. Certainly an e-peen stroker, but there is no character build advantage to PvP'ing.
3) The focus of DDO remains PvE gameplay

The impression that I get is that a decent number (up to perhaps a vast majority) of people feel that PvP does not belong in DDO. I guess I don't really understand this. The sentiment that PvP needs to be taken out of DDO seems odd to me. As with anything, it is only an option. If you hate it, there is a very simple solution of choosing not to participate.

[Visty]

no

[rimble]

no

[CrescentCalling_5]

It took me longer to re-read this than it took you two to post no.

Did either of you actually consider this at all or did you just say no the second you read "Improving PvP"?

[rimble]

Did either of you actually consider this at all or did you just say no the second you read "Improving PvP"?

Hey, I got through the "after races and classes" bit, but still, there is never, ever, a scenario where I'd prefer resources put towards PvP over ANY other aspect of the game. It doesn't belong in D&D, and it doesn't belong in DDO. I thought 'no' seemed appropriate to not pollute your thread too bad. You're entitled to your opinion and suggestions, and the devs will implement as they see fit (I think they would need to be convinced that it increases subscriptions/money though), I just wanted to 'cast my vote'. Every game can't be every thing. And one of those things rightly left off of DDO is PvP.

[Pape_27]

remove pvp from ddo

fixed

[AltheaSteelrain]

I'd go for yes.

But then here comes the big resounding of NO.

[jcTharin]

It took me longer to re-read this than it took you two to post no.

Did either of you actually consider this at all or did you just say no the second you read "Improving PvP"?

they just flat out said no. i haven't even read what you said yet and i agreed with them.

here read this. it says pretty much anything i could say. http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=266787

now I'm going to read what you said then give feedback

[Trillea]

Hey, I got through the "after races and classes" bit, but still, there is never, ever, a scenario where I'd prefer resources put towards PvP over ANY other aspect of the game. It doesn't belong in D&D, and it doesn't belong in DDO. I thought 'no' seemed appropriate to not pollute your thread too bad. You're entitled to your opinion and suggestions, and the devs will implement as they see fit (I think they would need to be convinced that it increases subscriptions/money though), I just wanted to 'cast my vote'. Every game can't be every thing. And one of those things rightly left off of DDO is PvP.

Amen brutha! Well said, and 100% correct.

[Ebuddy]

DDO is not a PvP game.

[krud]

PvP rewards should only be nominal and/or cosmetic at most. They should never be anything meaningful, otherwise it will just be open for abuse; i.e gank some friends to build up points, then hop on your other gank toon and return the favor.

Level restricted areas is about the only other suggestion that makes sense. That should be very easy to implement without taking dev time. Anything else is too much.

[cdbd3rd]

Tis no secret I am a confirmed card-carrying member of the anti-PvP faction. However, you put some thought into your suggestion, and presented it well. For that I commend and +rep your OP.

However, I still disagree with PvP in DDO.


If any thought from the Powers were being directed at any sort of PvP stuff, perhaps taking a cue from the success of PvP in LOTRO where it's Freeps vs. Creeps - where players can play certain races of mobs against raids of top level player characters....

[CrescentCalling_5]

Okay seriously enough.

If you didn't even take the time to read through my post fully before you cast your vote then go back and read the -insert curse word here- Post fully. You honestly don't deserve a say unless you actually paid attention to what I said.

[r3dl4nce]

The Thing That Ties it All Together: Arena Points

BIG GREAT ENORMOUS NO
You want PvP? You have PvP. But NO KIND OF FARMING OR REWARDS should come from PvP. DDO is PvE game. If you want a PvP game, there a lot.

[rimble]

You honestly don't deserve a say unless you actually paid attention to what I said.

That is very incorrect.

[CrescentCalling_5]

BIG GREAT ENORMOUS NO
You want PvP? You have PvP. But NO KIND OF FARMING OR REWARDS should come from PvP. DDO is PvE game. If you want a PvP game, there a lot.

I respsect this opinion cause you actually read it :3

That aside, I'll admit I want some PvP in the game. I don't want it "based around" PvP but I want to give players who are getting bored a reason to continue playing. PvP alone won't do it, there needs to be something to be earned from PvP, preferably just something cosmetic (definately nothing that gives you an edge over others in the arenas or in PvE though, or it'd be unbalanced).

[CrescentCalling_5]

That is very incorrect.

Actually it's widely accepted as good manners to hear other's out before you state your own opinion, but perhaps I was a little harsh. I just hate it when rude people enjoy shooting down other's ideas without actually hearing them out first and at least attempting to judge them with an open mind.

[r3dl4nce]

I respsect this opinion cause you actually read it :3

I read it, yes, but the problem is even if you give cosmetic rewards or rewards of little utility from PvP, that will be the first ePeen PvP match in DDO. From then, people will want even bigger rewards and so on...

That aside, I'll admit I want some PvP in the game

Sorry, it's time for you to change game.

I don't want it "based around" PvP but I want to give players who are getting bored a reason to continue playing.

New alts, new build, epic equip, TR. You have completed your characters? Sure?

[rimble]

Actually it's widely accepted as good manners to hear other's out before you state your own opinion, but perhaps I was a little harsh. I just hate it when rude people enjoy shooting down other's ideas without actually hearing them out first and at least attempting to judge them with an open mind.

'no' was admittedly very brief (I admit, I was just mimicing Visty), but I feel I've been very civil. I wasn't going to participate in the thread any more, as I said, you're entitled to your opinion--and I just wanted to unobtrusively inject my own dissenting opinion. However, you need to accept that I read enough of your post to know I was against it...even if that's just the title and first three sentences. I am set firmly against PvP in DDO. There is no permutation or improvement of PvP that would be acceptable to me in DDO--ok, maybe the LotRO critter thing, but I don't think of that as PvP per se.

Anyways, you want more/better PvP, I don't. You're cool, I'm cool.

Post on!

[CrescentCalling_5]

I read it, yes, but the problem is even if you give cosmetic rewards or rewards of little utility from PvP, that will be the first ePeen PvP match in DDO. From then, people will want even bigger rewards and so on...

Sorry, it's time for you to change game.

New alts, new build, epic equip, TR. You have completed your characters? Sure?

1. Yea I'll admit that players will probably beg for better stuff, to counter that the best method is probably to state when implementing it that "any request for material rewards that give more than a cosmetic or fun effect will be ignored and removed." Worked in a few other games I tried out before loving this game :P

2. I don't see why. I've watched D&D PnP games where the DMs would basically split the players up and make them fight each other. D&D is supposed to be a versatile and evolving game, not some static PvE only thing that never improves or changes.

3. Unfortunately my main is level 7 :P I'm saying this on behalf of all the level 20s out there who complain in general chat that they've finished everything. I can see myself where they are eventually :/

thanks for the critique btw c: