Epic Antique Greataxe or Greensteel Min II GA

[Talesin]

Has anyone done a DPS comparison between the Epic Antique Greataxe (with good damage attached) vs. the standard Greensteel Min II Greataxe on a FB III Barbarian?

Most importantly I'd like to know the DPS difference on bosses like Harry or Sulu and against Held (in otherewise auto-crit) epic mobs.

I'd figure all this out myself but I can't make heads or tails out of the DPS calculator.

If it makes a difference my Str is usually hovering around the 58 mark (I expect to be hovering around mid 60's once properly geared up).

Thanks for your help

[Junts]

for bosses, they are pretty much identical

for autocrits, the antique is a little better (base damage being multiplied by 3)

vs mobs that take the acid damage, the min2 can be a little better in general.

If you have the tokens and stuff to do the epic axe, you might as well make it and then craft a lit2 or something instead of a mineral.

[Symar-FangofLloth]

EAG is 2d12+6 19-20/x3 with Force Burst (1d6 +2d10 on crits)
Min2 GA is 3d6+5 19-20/x3 with Holy (2d6)... the Acid doesn't apply against devils which is what you're asking.
Both bypass DR.

Assuming hit on a 2, no Fortification, and a Str of 60 (for a +25 damage)

EAG average 55.025 damage per swing

M2GA average 53.225 damage per swing

The extra damage from Holy helps make up for the lake of base damage on the Min2, but the Force Burst pulls the EAG ahead on crits.
If we were talking an autocrit state on a devil, the EAG would pull ahead even more.
If you fight something that takes damage from acid, I'd imagine the Min2 would pull ahead.

So it's pretty close. The benefit of EAG, if you're capable of making one, is it'll save you Larges on building a Min2.

[Junts]

The disadvantage of the EAG is that, after around +50 to damage or so, falchions are better than greataxes and the margin is increasingly wide .. there is no epic antique falchion.

[Talesin]

Well in this case I already have my Epic Antique Greataxe and a Min II Greataxe (mine is Good Burst, Acid, and Acid Blast). I picked Greataxe primarily because of the fact that I'm a dwarf and I like big numbers (x3 crits instead of x2)

I will be TRing into a WF however so I guess I'll make my next weapon a Lit II Falchion.

[Boldrin]

The disadvantage of the EAG is that, after around +50 to damage or so, falchions are better than greataxes and the margin is increasingly wide .. there is no epic antique falchion.

Xuum it's not a DR bypasser, but it tears things up.

[Junts]

Xuum it's not a DR bypasser, but it tears things up.

Its also far, far harder to make than the ega: i have 2 epic ega and could easily have 4 if I'd taken pieces I didn't need.

I run dq on timer, and I've never even seen a xuum shard. Epic xuum and sos are not a substitute for min2 weaponry the way the greataxe is clearly designed as a bridge item.

[Junts]

Well in this case I already have my Epic Antique Greataxe and a Min II Greataxe (mine is Good Burst, Acid, and Acid Blast). I picked Greataxe primarily because of the fact that I'm a dwarf and I like big numbers (x3 crits instead of x2)

I will be TRing into a WF however so I guess I'll make my next weapon a Lit II Falchion.

if you made a good burst min2, then the ega is clearly better becuase good burst is bad.

[oweieie]

Make both. Make the antique +7 for epics and use the min ii for DR bypass in ToD etc.

[BigButter]

I was 2 lg scales away from finishing the third tier of my MinII GA (holy, acid burst and was going for acid blast) when I pulled the components to make the EGA farming epics while I was on Shroud timer. Having played with both for a few days in Amrath and on auto-crit epics, I'm hard-pressed to commit the larges right now to finish the MinII off when I have other Tier3 needs on other gear (18 Shroud completions currently). I will say that I've got Improved Critical: Slash which I was planning to drop when I finished the MinII so that I could play with another feat so that is a fairly significant consideration. I'm going to throw Good damage on the EGA and play around with them both some more. If I delay finishing off the GS GA, at least I've got an awesome stoneskin clickie that still is a great boss beater.

[Carpone]

Make both. Make the antique +7 for epics and use the min ii for DR bypass in ToD etc.

This. Many of the mobs in Red Fens don't take Holy damage, but some like the wisps are susceptible to Force damage.

[tgun]

If I delay finishing off the GS GA, at least I've got an awesome stoneskin clickie that still is a great boss beater.

A tier2 mineral GA is not a great boss beater since it doesnt bypass dr.

[LeLoric]

Make both. Make the antique +7 for epics and use the min ii for DR bypass in ToD etc.

This makes no sense why if you have the eag already would you make a min II. The dps is pretty much even and both bypass dr of any raid boss in game except hound which neither bypass. Use those larges and make a lit 2 or more equipment.

[LeLoric]

EAG is 2d12+6 19-20/x3 with Force Burst (1d6 +2d10 on crits)
Min2 GA is 3d6+5 19-20/x3 with Holy (2d6)... the Acid doesn't apply against devils which is what you're asking.
Both bypass DR.

Assuming hit on a 2, no Fortification, and a Str of 60 (for a +25 damage)

EAG average 55.025 damage per swing

M2GA average 53.225 damage per swing

The extra damage from Holy helps make up for the lake of base damage on the Min2, but the Force Burst pulls the EAG ahead on crits.
If we were talking an autocrit state on a devil, the EAG would pull ahead even more.
If you fight something that takes damage from acid, I'd imagine the Min2 would pull ahead.

So it's pretty close. The benefit of EAG, if you're capable of making one, is it'll save you Larges on building a Min2.

You haven't included the slicing on mineral II which would put the min II slightly ahead of the EGA but not by enough to make any sort of substantial difference when acid is resisted. When mobs take all damage from a min II holy/acid burst/acidblast its a 5 point advantage for the min II. If you have the stuff to make the EGA which is not hard to get make it and save your large ingreds for something better.

[Symar-FangofLloth]

You haven't included the slicing on mineral II which would put the min II slightly ahead of the EGA but not by enough to make any sort of substantial difference when acid is resisted. When mobs take all damage from a min II holy/acid burst/acidblast its a 5 point advantage for the min II. If you have the stuff to make the EGA which is not hard to get make it and save your large ingreds for something better.

Ah, right, forgot it had that. I don't have a Min2 built yet (working on it).

[BigButter]

A tier2 mineral GA is not a great boss beater since it doesnt bypass dr.

I was thinking more of the mini-bosses like at the end of Weapon Shipment and Garos where the Holy on the Tier1 of the minII was making a difference versus the EGA.

[maddmatt70]

I can not help but say it but wielders of the antique greataxe have a somewhat less then stellar rep. You will get a lot of those peeps who think it works the same as a min2 before they upgrade the axe with tokens. I actually joined a vod raid on hard where the wielder used his antique greataxe (unupgraded) instead of his min 2 because it was awesome according to him. Needless to say I had to turn off pa, not smite/ds, not cast zeal or divine favor on my level 17 pally in order for him to hold aggro on his level 20 wf thf barb.

[Khellendros13]

I can not help but say it but wielders of the antique greataxe have a somewhat less then stellar rep. You will get a lot of those peeps who think it works the same as a min2 before they upgrade the axe with tokens. I actually joined a vod raid on hard where the wielder used his antique greataxe (unupgraded) instead of his min 2 because it was awesome according to him. Needless to say I had to turn off pa, not smite/ds, not cast zeal or divine favor on my level 17 pally in order for him to hold aggro on his level 20 wf thf barb.

I've seen this lack of agro with more than a few capped barbs. Some of the better barbs on Khyber have the Antique axe upgraded and say it is noticably better dps than min2 on ToD bosses etc...so I'm still getting parts for mine to see.

[maddmatt70]

I've seen this lack of agro with more than a few capped barbs. Some of the better barbs on Khyber have the Antique axe upgraded and say it is noticably better dps than min2 on ToD bosses etc...so I'm still getting parts for mine to see.

The better barbs on khyber already have min 2 and with the lack of quality gear out of the carnival series do not waste time in those quests. They are currently working on their red ferns gear, desert gear, if they still do not have epic sos von gear etc. Besides I would rather grind shrouds then carnival quests the other gear is better not too mention +3 tomes and cleansers to boot.

P.S. it is not better do the math as others have.

[Khellendros13]

The better barbs on khyber already have min 2 and with the lack of quality gear out of the carnival series do not waste time in those quests. They are currently working on their red ferns gear, desert gear, if they still do not have epic sos von gear etc. Besides I would rather grind shrouds then carnival quests the other gear is better not too mention +3 tomes and cleansers to boot.

P.S. it is not better do the math as others have.

These people already had red scale, esos, etc before Red Fens came out, and now farming the claw set. One of them would have the full epic claw set if the seal actually dropped. They had the pink axe before Red Fens.

My point was, they have the pink axe and min2, and use the pink axe in raids VS Devils, both have told me it feels like more dps.

I am well aware of the maths behind the game, such as greataxe VS falcion, min2 VS Antique Greataxe etc.
Numbers don't lie, but the DDO game engine isn't mathematically neutral

Using non DR bypassing pink axe vs min2 is obviously stupid, no question there.