Wizard lvl 8: What are the best spells to kill mephits & renders?

[Baloran]

Hi, I'm currently leveling my first arcane caster (wf wizard, lvl 8). I was duoing Deleras (norm); Tangleroot (norm) with a guildie (ranger) and it was great fun and very easy (Haste, Blur, Heroism & lots of firewalls). We decided to do the Sorrowdusk Chain afterwards. First part went very well, second part got tough. The two of us wiped in the second last quest of Co6, where you have to destroy the summoning fires.

My main problem was that we always got swarmed by air and fire mephits and they respawned at the summoning fires as well. Standart tactics (i.e. firewall, web) did not work on the fire mephits. I tried Ice Storm (with sup glac clicky), it worked, but I could not kill the fire mephits fast enough. I tried Charm Monster (landed only 50-70%) which took some aggro off me for the duration of the spell, but it didn't reduce the amount of enemys.

So my question is: which spells (in my level range) work best for the combined swarms of fire and air mephits?

Is there a spell which quickly can destroy the summoning fires?

And since I want to do Ruins of Threnal as well, what spells work best on renders?

Thanks for your input!

Cheers

Baloran

[Nigglor]

Probably acid blast or frost lance at that level.

Frost lance will do double damage against the fire ones but for taking out a large number of mephits at once acid blast is better. They are both lvl 3 spells.

Another thing you could try is hypnotize the mephits and then beat down the fires with melee weapons. The hypnotized ones get in the way of new ones that spawn so they can't swarm you as easily.

[Phidius]

I normally use Repair Serious, or just rely on Repair Critical wands to conserve spell points.

[TekkenDevil]

A sufficiently powered Frost Lance should obliterate any fire monsters.

[William_the_Bat]

firewall is an easy button.. against fire monsters you kinda have to do things the "hard" way.

That is to say, cast acid rain and watch them all die. (added bonus, the acid sticks to them, you don't have to try to keep them in the area of effect)

Acid blast is also good, though you may have to cast a few times to kill them all. (alternately turn on maximize + empower)

Frost lance does awesome damage, but only to one target.

[t0r012]

firewall is an easy button.. against fire monsters you kinda have to do things the "hard" way.

That is to say, cast acid rain and watch them all die. (added bonus, the acid sticks to them, you don't have to try to keep them in the area of effect)

Acid blast is also good, though you may have to cast a few times to kill them all. (alternately turn on maximize + empower)

Frost lance does awesome damage, but only to one target.

you mean you have to do things the "real" way not the "hard" way.
If they every get a decent AI for mobs that makes they actively try and avoid firewalls and Blade Barriers as they should I know a lot of casters that think they are gods will have to learn the true arts of mana conservation and how to fight casting "real" spells.

[shagath]

you mean you have to do things the "real" way not the "hard" way.
If they every get a decent AI for mobs that makes they actively try and avoid firewalls and Blade Barriers as they should I know a lot of casters that think they are gods will have to learn the true arts of mana conservation and how to fight casting "real" spells.

True and well said. +1 rep.

I went there a bit later(lvl9) and used cone of cold to kill them. I would have used hypnotize or acid blast as a lower lvl.

[Baloran]

Thanks for the advice. I was thinking about acid blast, but I don't have any superior corrosion items for its level and I'm not acid specced. So I guess I should give Hypno a try, but I don't have heighten yet, so I don't know if it will stick.

Any suggestions for the summoning fires?

Cheers

Baloran

[Therigar]

If your ranger friend is range focused then your only plan for the summoning fires is to beat on them until your puny DPS destroys them. If your ranger friend is TWF DPS focused then just turn him loose on them -- they should go down fairly fast to cold or construct bane weapons, especially if you keep him hasted.

There are 2 mephit types that spawn. Firewall works fine against the air types. Keep fire resists and protections up and focus on the summoning fire. Once it is done you can deal with any remaining mephits. They will die fast to the ranger if he is TWF focused. Just keep yourself healed & keep the fire pro/resist up.

Also, the cold version of the fire shield should be available to you. That will help against the fire mephits that actually attack you.

[BuyerSeller]

I know this does not help you now, but when you get cloudkill then mephits will die incredibly fast. That is normally what I throw up and they die in seconds. I just add this since you will be fighting a lot of mephits throughout leveling.

[Baloran]

I know this does not help you now, but when you get cloudkill then mephits will die incredibly fast. That is normally what I throw up and they die in seconds. I just add this since you will be fighting a lot of mephits throughout leveling.

Oh, good to know I didn't suspect as much. According to the description of cloudkill it mostly affectes low hit dice monsters http://compendium.ddo.com/wiki/Spell:Cloudkill and I didn't think that the mephits have less than 6 HD for the "save or die" effect to be working. I just realized it also deals 2d6+CL acid damage - is that over time as long as in the cloud or just once when they enter the cloud?

Have to try it out once I have it.

Thanks for the advice!

Cheers
Blaoran

[AaronB]

By the way, you probably know this but make sure you both have a high fire resist (20+), damage reduction for their regular melee damage, and moderate (or heavy) fortification to avoid their sneak attack damage. You should be able to get it on a robe or something. That way, it'll be much harder for them to kill you.

[shagath]

I just realized it also deals 2d6+CL acid damage - is that over time as long as in the cloud or just once when they enter the cloud?

Damage over time. So every time they enter it or stay there long enough. It also gives concealment 20% which is same as blur. Works even on raid bosses(some) as a concealment even thought you aren't getting any damage in.

[domecek1]

its easy, just charm one or two and run away.../ (spell named charm monster)

[Tyrande]

My suggestion:

Depending on the DC of your spells, you might want to try:

1) Glitterdust (extend) the area so that any mephits entering the area will be blinded and have 50% miss chance against you two. It also reveal hiding mephits.
1a) You can also try #1 spell in combination with hypnotic pattern. I prefer hypnotism, however; but you got to be careful not to hit hypnotized mephits.
2) Have Fire Resist and Lightning Resist up on you two.
3) Standard blur & haste.
4) Icy burst for mephits/construct bane weapons for the summoning fires for the ranger.
5) Phantasmal Killer (if your DC is good enough. At level 8, I was shooting for 26 INT; with an illusion bracer = 10 + 4 + 8 + 1 = DC 23).
6) You can also try Suggestion to conserve spell points. I like this better than Charm Monster due to the repeated saves every 15+ seconds in Charm. Basically, you want to charm the air mephits to fight the fire mephits, or the fire mephits to fight the air mephits; but not fire against fire, or air against air.

You can also try invisibility on the ranger, and have the ranger sneak in and stealth kill the summoning fires.

[MrWizard]

Hi, I'm currently leveling my first arcane caster (wf wizard, lvl 8). I was duoing Deleras (norm); Tangleroot (norm) with a guildie (ranger) and it was great fun and very easy (Haste, Blur, Heroism & lots of firewalls). We decided to do the Sorrowdusk Chain afterwards. First part went very well, second part got tough. The two of us wiped in the second last quest of Co6, where you have to destroy the summoning fires.

My main problem was that we always got swarmed by air and fire mephits and they respawned at the summoning fires as well. Standart tactics (i.e. firewall, web) did not work on the fire mephits. I tried Ice Storm (with sup glac clicky), it worked, but I could not kill the fire mephits fast enough. I tried Charm Monster (landed only 50-70%) which took some aggro off me for the duration of the spell, but it didn't reduce the amount of enemys.

So my question is: which spells (in my level range) work best for the combined swarms of fire and air mephits?

Is there a spell which quickly can destroy the summoning fires?

And since I want to do Ruins of Threnal as well, what spells work best on renders?

Thanks for your input!

Cheers

Baloran

Depends on your build, but I am more into the control and conquer. Taking spell pen feats, enhance and items ensures spells always land on those types.

Heighten increases your DC, get it.


Hypnotize stops all of them immediately, charm helps them change aggro for the party benefit.
Hold monster is effective to insta death them and Phantasmal Killer works wonders too.

If you do not have the spell pen and High DC, then direct damage is probably best, something without a saving throw. Take a lot of mana though.


Edit: okay, read the thread. Geez, doesn't anyone ever realize just how powerful hypno is?
If you want cloudkill, first off, you have read the wrong description as to the HD though you linked to the right page. Cloudkill no longer works on renders though.


for co6, charm helps change aggro a lot, but at some point you will have to deal with the stuff. You are level 8 and that quest is 10 I believe, so it should be very hard.

wait til you get to the end battle.....think you might want to be a bit higher level for that one.

[Jubbers]

Just for the record...

Spell Penetration feats/enhancements ONLY WORK ON STUFF WITH SPELL RESISTANCE.

Other then that the rest of your sugestions are good to go.

[Tyrande]

For the renders (and reavers) though, you might want to wait until you two are level 9 (or 10) or above. At level 9, you get dismissal, cloud kill, cone of cold. At level 10, you can get the heighten meta-magic feat as a bonus feat for your wizard.

Believe the quest is level 10 for the last quest in the chain for normal.

BTW, cloud kill works very well along with other fortitude save spells, like glitter-dust; stinking cloud (a poor man's cloud kill), phantasmal killer, etc.

You can also buy lots of scrolls of enervation to level drain them first; so that they (mephits or renders/reavers) don't save as often. Stone-skin wands can also be bought so that you two have DR 10/adamantine; so as not to get damaged too often in combination with blur and glitterdust.

[Baloran]

Depends on your build, but I am more into the control and conquer. Taking spell pen feats, enhance and items ensures spells always land on those types.

Heighten increases your DC, get it.


Hypnotize stops all of them immediately, charm helps them change aggro for the party benefit.
Hold monster is effective to insta death them and Phantasmal Killer works wonders too.

If you do not have the spell pen and High DC, then direct damage is probably best, something without a saving throw. Take a lot of mana though.


Edit: okay, read the thread. Geez, doesn't anyone ever realize just how powerful hypno is?
If you want cloudkill, first off, you have read the wrong description as to the HD though you linked to the right page. Cloudkill no longer works on renders though.

First of all, thank you very much for your advice, it is appreciated.

Ok, I got the HD description from the ddowiki, since DDO is vague in its spell description. But as far as I understand by now, Cloudkill works like firewall, enemys get damaged as long they are in the cloud. I just don't understand the concept of Hypno here. When I hyno a bunch of mosters first and then cast a spell like Cloudkill, won't I wake them all up again? So with Hypno, tactics should perhaps be: Hyno all, Hold Monster / Phantasmal Killer one by one? Meaning I have first to hypno and then to use another spell on each single enemy? Might take a lot of sp as well. Other option might be: Hypno and run...

for co6, charm helps change aggro a lot, but at some point you will have to deal with the stuff. You are level 8 and that quest is 10 I believe, so it should be very hard.

wait til you get to the end battle.....think you might want to be a bit higher level for that one.

By now I could finish the chain (solo on norm with my level 8 wiz). But it was really hard. Buffed with resists, blur, heroism, haste, displacement, jump, master touch. At first I tried to kill the mephits, but the respawn rate at the summoning fires - which I had to take down with my mediocre dps (no construct bane weapon) - is too fast. I then decided to charm one of them to get some aggro off me and just concentrated on the fires. Repair Wand whipping bunny hopping to the next fire, same procedure. Got more and more mephits on my tail, taking constant damage, running out of sp (mostly emergency repairs, charms, haste) quickly. Was empty when I reached the last summoning fire. After that it was a battle against time - what goes down quicker my health bar or the health bar of the summonig fire? It came down to a heartbeat final - I died about half a second after the summoning fire was destroyed, but the quest was completed.

In comparison, the last quest of the chain was a cakewalk: firewalls for the scorpions and casters, frost lances for the fire reavers and a final maximized and extended firewall for the boss, in combination with maximized frost lances.

I guess I did it brute force with a lot of luck (and dungeon scaling) in the second last part. It would be interesting to learn the more advanced art of using magic to do this quest with less risk.

I will solo this chain again, just to get a feeling for what spells work.

Oh and if anyone can point me to a thread where sophisticated wizard tactics are discussed, I would appreciate it.

Cheers

Baloran

[tjcombo5000]

I didn't see anyone mention this, but you can use dismissal and banishment on both the reavers and the mephlits (outsiders). Works great, saves mana and buh bye to the mobs.