Twitch was not fixed by removing glancing blows.

[Angelus_dead]

Increased player skill leading to increased DPS, this kind of thing has never been implemented before!

You'll have to make a more specific suggestion than that. Telling the developers that player skill should be important doesn't convey the idea of pressing movement keys at specific places in the THF swing animation.

[Angelus_dead]

What? It was a way to fight a horde on the run man. Point blank.

But you haven't yet justified the idea of THF twitch attacking.

As just explained, if the developers give you a bonus to attacking while moving then they're trying to give you a bonus to attacking while moving. The word "moving" means you are in the process of travelling from Point A to Point B. It is not an attempt to reward players for standing in one place but spazzing their feet.

[GhoulsTouch]

But you haven't yet justified the idea of THF twitch attacking.

As just explained, if the developers give you a bonus to attacking while moving then they're trying to give you a bonus to attacking while moving. The word "moving" means you are in the process of travelling from Point A to Point B. It is not an attempt to reward players for standing in one place but spazzing their feet.

You are moving. Why are you trying to remove attack speed while moving or the intial attack anyway? If you slow down one you got to slow down the other. Are you saying casters can't cast jumping around too?

It's a poor argument setup to invoke grief on a certain playerbase, I don't see any other reason why you are arguing this.

[Angelus_dead]

You are moving. Why are you trying to remove attack speed while moving or the intial attack anyway? If you slow down one you got to slow down the other. Are you saying casters can't cast jumping around too?

It's a poor argument setup to invoke grief on a certain playerbase, I don't see any other reason why you are arguing this.

So, are you going to try to come up with a suggestion as to why THF twitch attacking would be a good idea to add to a game that doesn't have it yet?

Here, I'll try to do the first part and you can fill in the rest:
Hi devs, I think it would be a good idea if you let characters holding a two-handed weapon get a higher number of attacks per minute if they tap one of the WASD movement keys before the end of the attack chain because ...

[KillEveryone]

How do you know this?



How do you know this?

I see no other reason for them to remove glancing blows while moving.

It doesn't reduce DPS since you stand still and you get youre glancing blows.

I'm thinking they are trying to remove the twitch play style.

You think this is good for twf too?

I don't know. I haven't tried to do that with my fighter. I do move around a lot and try to get behind the character when I'm swinging.

CSW pots are a joke with 400 hit points, I don't have the UMD to be able to use a Heal scroll, nor do I have the gear to make AC meaningful to avoid damage...any damage at all...so I move. I have spring attack line on my fighter just to be able to move without penalty, but my fighter has plenty of feats.

Are you saying casters can't cast jumping around too?

I think I read somewhere that they want to remove this ability. It may have just been another forumite comminting on things but it may have been something else. I can't rember. I don't like this idea either though. Movement is very necessary with a caster because of so few hit points. Stand still and you are dead.

[theb]

BTW, answering that question would be against the forum rules. No one is allowed to tell you.

Which rule would prevent all true and relevant responses to this question, regardless of OP's sources or lack thereof?

[FluffyCalico]

Increased player skill leading to increased DPS, this kind of thing has never been implemented before!

Please explain exploiting a borked swing timer mistake as player skill?

[Nezichiend]

Please explain exploiting a borked swing timer mistake as player skill?

Because exploiting said exploit requires skill.

[mediocresurgeon]

Please explain why removal of glancing blows kills twitch? It doesn't. These players spend their 3 feats on something else, and continue twitching. A lot of these guys swear by twitch and will take it to the grave. We know who they are, and they are not going away. But this is a discussion for another time, and another thread.

For players & Devs who stay "just stand still and attack":

Nobody does this. NOBODY. I beleive the OP mentioned this. Removing glancing blows while moving WILL NOT STOP PLAYERS FOR MOVING. It will just cause them to deal less damage while moving, until they Lesser Reincarnate their THF characters into a combat style that gives them full DPS while moving (like TWF).

Most players took the 3 THF feats to get glancing blows while moving, not for the slight increased damage (a negligable difference) on glancing blows. Turbine made a serious mistake in removing glancing blows while moving:
1) It did not make combat more fun or exciting
2) It does not promote build diversity (we're back to a "Go TWF or go home!" game, like Mods 6-8 were)
3) It did not increase server performance
4) It did not enhance the gaming experience of the players.

[Razcar]

Because exploiting said exploit requires skill.

Or a macro.

[Monkey_Archer]

But they removed glancing blows to stop twitch play.

No, they did not.
They removed glancing blows while moving to nerf moving THF dps.
Nothing about that change is specifically targeted at twitching. Nothing has been posted by any dev saying the change was targeted at twitching. The change makes absolutely no sense from a "lets nerf twitching" perspective.
The only real way to nerf twitching (if that is their intention) is to change the animations.

Twitching is now mandatory for all THFs who want to do real dps. The removal of glancing blows while moving just made twtiching the only viable way to move in combat. Any THF character that runs around using the standard moving animation is now a gimp that should reroll as a TWF, or learn to twitch.

[FluffyCalico]

The only real way to nerf twitching (if that is their intention) is to change the animations.

:

Since the animations for twf no longer match up with swings at all they dont even need to change the animations for thf just the timeing.

[Dazalarian]

Those that are not good enough to keep up with twitchers should just suck it up.

Evolve or die.

LoL are you for real, programming your G15 keyboard to twitch for you is called evolving? Let me guess you honestly think twitching is working "as intended"? it was made to be like this from the scratch to enable "teh 1337z0rZ playah's" to get more DPS out of their builds? OR that its an unfortunate side-effect from how the attack-chain works for THF?

zzZz
-Daz

[vVAnjilaVv]

Removes twitching...LOL....ok.....how about this.....while we are at it........once you engage an enemy you are locked in place and cannot move until one of u dies.....heck why not remove being able to use potions, wands, and scrolls while your at it.

Totally agree....if you can't twitch go play another game or get better at this one. Twitching is a completely legitimate playstyle...don't crucify the people who are good at the game because you aren't.

[Dazalarian]

Removes twitching...LOL....ok.....how about this.....while we are at it........once you engage an enemy you are locked in place and cannot move until one of u dies.....heck why not remove being able to use potions, wands, and scrolls while your at it.

Totally agree....if you can't twitch go play another game or get better at this one. Twitching is a completely legitimate playstyle...don't crucify the people who are good at the game because you aren't.

Awsum!

I'm gonna go buy that keyboard this afternoon and program it for Twitch attack-style. I wanna be good at thsi game too.

-Daz

[vVAnjilaVv]

Awsum!

I'm gonna go buy that keyboard this afternoon and program it for Twitch attack-style. I wanna be good at thsi game too.

-Daz

I doubt it will help.

I twitch just fine and I do not have my keyboard setup to do it for me. Like I said...don't crucify the people who CAN play because of the people who CAN'T.

[Lissyl]

I doubt it will help.

I twitch just fine and I do not have my keyboard setup to do it for me. Like I said...don't crucify the people who CAN play because of the people who CAN'T.

Good lord.

The 'twitch playstyle'? Are you kidding me? After I heard of 'the twitch playstyle' it took all of about 4 seconds to figure out how its done, and about 20 to get the rhythm for it. It doesn't make you any 'better' at the game, it just makes you a better exploiter. Yay.

I swear some of you people are bound and determined to slit your own throats just to prove you're better at suicide. Quit being so flippant about running players out of the game. Teach them if you prefer (although don't pass on smarmy attitudes like 'if you dont twitch, you suck you gimp!!11!1one11!') but quit killing off revenue streams that keep the game open, okay? The ones who refuse to learn at all will drift away, but people in /a are sending folks to these forums to learn about the game. And THIS is what they see when they arrive?

I agree with the previously-mentioned suggestion about speeding up the 3-4 attack cycle and slowing the 1-2 to get rid of this. Turbine spent the time creating the attack animations for a reason, but perhaps they haven't noticed that the effect is contrary TO the reasons. They're redoing paths because the community pointed out many, many times just how bad those paths truly were, this is just something very similar. With Update 5 being (as I have heard, at least) just the beginning of an overall revamping of the combat system, perhaps the fix with doublestrike/twitching animations is already on the drawing board as we type. Let us hope so.

[BlackSteel]

Please explain why removal of glancing blows kills twitch? It doesn't. These players spend their 3 feats on something else, and continue twitching. A lot of these guys swear by twitch and will take it to the grave. We know who they are, and they are not going away. But this is a discussion for another time, and another thread.

For players & Devs who stay "just stand still and attack":

Nobody does this. NOBODY. I beleive the OP mentioned this. Removing glancing blows while moving WILL NOT STOP PLAYERS FOR MOVING. It will just cause them to deal less damage while moving, until they Lesser Reincarnate their THF characters into a combat style that gives them full DPS while moving (like TWF).

Most players took the 3 THF feats to get glancing blows while moving, not for the slight increased damage (a negligable difference) on glancing blows. Turbine made a serious mistake in removing glancing blows while moving:
1) It did not make combat more fun or exciting
2) It does not promote build diversity (we're back to a "Go TWF or go home!" game, like Mods 6-8 were)
3) It did not increase server performance
4) It did not enhance the gaming experience of the players.

well said

personally I'm in the process of a long TR chain with my old barbarian. If by the time I finish they've managed to revamp THF and make it somewhat competitive again, he'll end up as a THF barb again (planning 3-4 TR's) if not then it'll be as a TWF and possibly not even a barbarian in that scenario.

[BlackSteel]

Awsum!

I'm gonna go buy that keyboard this afternoon and program it for Twitch attack-style. I wanna be good at thsi game too.

-Daz

really? have fun programming it to do a slight twitch to the right for when you want to turn the mob, and another one for the left. Then another one that slowly backs you up out of enemy AoE, then another foward. Oh yeh, still need it where it keeps you almost stationary. How about another one for when you're slowed, or hasted and for each direction while slowed or hasted.

sounds like more keys and a burden to use your fancy keyboard than it is simply to do it yourself with the game's movement keys. If all you ever do is the same little dance on every single mob then you're doing it wrong. But sure, if you want a keyboard to help you autoattack and go /afk then I guess that could work.

[nibelung]

programming your keyboard won't work, I tried it and got massive lag...almost crashed. Just watch Shade's video and figure out the timing