Elitism.....or is it?

[shablala]

I keep seeing the word "elitist" being thrown around a lot nowadays. From all of the different contexts it's been used, I gather that you are an elitist if:

1. You have quest/game knowledge and use it.
2. You filter out players when forming a group.
3. You use the word noob.
4. You think MyDDO is a benefit to the game.
5. You don't suck.
6. You have expectations from puggers.
7. Your in a guild that is able to complete difficult achievments that other guilds cannot.
8. You don't suck.
9. You have grinded quests to get specific loot.
10. You get upset with NOOBS not listening to clear directions and let them know.


That is all. Maybe.

1. Sure (otherwise You're just a Elitest wannabe, which is even worse)
2. If it is for an Epic run, then NO not an Elitest. Otherwise yes Elitest.
3. If you use it in a joking or teasing manner then NO not an Elitest. Otherwise yes.
4. NO if used sparingly, YES you are an elitest if you are using to run Shroud on normal.
5. NO cause sucking sometimes means getting a little too confident and causing a wipe.
6. If you have normal expectations then NO, if you expect them to read your mind and think like you every second then YES Elitest.
7. Abosolutely NOT. Very often Newbies or friends of friends get invites to these guilds. Not an accomplishment to get into a raiding guild.
8. YES cause elitest like to repeat themselves.
9. Both Elitest and Newbies grind quests for loot, so NO
10. Absolutely YES. And if you just recall in the middle of the quest and drop group, then you elevate your status to an Elitest Jerk, which is quite an accomplishment.

[Waukeen]

What if your TR8 trying to get completionsit and dont want to solo but also dont want neg10xp every time u do a Stormcleave or Ritual Sacrifice. That mean you still suck for not wanting neg10xp from the guy that has 105 hp and no hvy forst at lvl 14?

Always good for a laugh, right?

I digress,

Having expectations while Pugging does not make anyone an elitist.

Knowing quests, builds, and general common (if you read) DDO knowledge does not make anyone an elitist.

Being a schmuck who expounds how uber your build and skillz are does not make you an elitist, just a /squelch fool.

The only thing that makes someone an elitist is thinking that you are better than everyone else with a touch of immaturity.

There are a few elitists, but we know who they are and chose to group, or not group with them based on their level of annoyingness.

I PuG, and that's my opinion.

[Alter]

This would sum it up.

alter

[phillymiket]

I would say anyone using the term "elite" directed at another player not in jest is about as suspect as anyone using the term "n00b" directed at another player not in jest.

I think in terms of "rude" and "not rude".
Everything else is negotiable depending on the circumstance.

[Bunker]

Here is a quote that I heard this evening:

"How can they tell if I'm an Elite snob? They are on the ground while I'm flying high above on my new ship. "

[phillymiket]

"How can they tell if I'm an Elite snob? They are on the ground while I'm flying high above on my new ship. "

Hey, I saw you flying around up there today!
Remember, I waved and you put up the "we're #1" finger.
(I think that was the finger you put up.)

[Mirmillo]

One of my former friends apparently thinks Ive become an elitist after not waiting for him to do a hound, Hes got it written in his bio even, to try to make me feel bad. Apparently though he has been ticking alot of people off by throwing the E word around.

Myr

[Ssmooth]

1. You have quest/game knowledge and use it.

What exactly do you mean by this? Exploits? Telling others to play a certain way because you think it works best? Then yes.

2. You filter out players when forming a group.

I'd say yes.

3. You use the word noob.

Definately.

4. You think MyDDO is a benefit to the game.

If you mean screening...yes

5. You don't suck.

The fact that this is a mentioned in this context points to a yes in my book.

6. You have expectations from puggers.

Probably

7. Your in a guild that is able to complete difficult achievments that other guilds cannot.

Like what? This game ain't that hard. The fact that you think it takes a good guild to complete any quest....yes

8. You don't suck.

Mentioned twice......now there is no doubt... yes.

9. You have grinded quests to get specific loot.

You found one that I will say no on...grats.
(but if you expect everyone else to, it becomes a yes)

10. You get upset with NOOBS not listening to clear directions and let them know.

Yes. And the fact that you feel you have to give those clear directions makes it certain.



Then there is the fact that you felt necessary to post this to begin with.


But, don't take it the wrong way.....from what I see you are proud of it.

I think you should re-read my post a little closer. I posted this because in the past few weeks/months, I've been in groups where the word 'elitist' was used far more often than I'm used to.

It was directed at me once(I'm so proud!) in a vod group where the barb didn't know he couldn't remove his curse while madstoned. I asked him how long he has had them, and his response was, "You don't have to be an elitist jerk!"

So I replied that knowledge doesn't = elitism. I wasn't a jerk about it, it maybe caught me off guard a little, but as we had 4 barbs in a hard vod, as the leader( on a barb) I said no raging, take care of your own curses.

I'm also sick of the winers(winners has 2 n's ) who keep complaining about not getting into epic groups on their 180hp sorcs and 220 hp rogues. I really don't care, I MyDDO and am glad that I do and will continue to do so.

I MyDDO for EPIC's, not shroud, not madstone, so really get over it.

[BurningDownTheHouse]

I think you're mixing terms a bit in your definitions. There is certainly a distinct difference between being "elite" and being an "elitist". You can be elite and not an elitist. You can be an elitist yet not elite. You can be both or you can be neither.

Elite:
1. You have quest/game knowledge and use it.



5. You don't suck.

7. Your in a guild that is able to complete difficult achievments that other guilds cannot.
8. You don't suck.
9. You have grinded quests to get specific loot.


Elitist:

2. You filter out players when forming a group.
3. You use the word noob.
4. You think MyDDO is a benefit to the game.

6. You have expectations from puggers.



10. You get upset with NOOBS not listening to clear directions and let them know.

This.

And notice that Ren didn't qualify any of the two as "good" or "bad".

Some people want to be elite, nothing wrong with this, that's how they choose to enjoy the game.

Some people people have different standards of which people they choose to group with. Again, nothing wrong with this, you are free to choose. If said people choose not to group with you, just move on.

The problem might arise when you want to group with them, but they don't want to group with you. Then some people choose to create drama on the forums about "elitist jerks". Again, nothing wrong with this, some good old forum drama is good for the soul.

[Uamhas]

I'm a deletist, I admit it! Deal with it all you haters!

[Uskathoth]

I'm also sick of the winers(winners has 2 n's

Whiners has an "h". And while I have experienced grouping with people who don't follow even very clear direction I've also been in groups where the leader either doesn't offer direction or gives it in such a way that it is difficult to understand or is loaded with assumptions. I think a good rule of thumb is to ask "is anyone new or unfamiliar with this quest" at the beginning and, if so (and you are still willing to group with them), provide directions or an overview in text. In my experience it is much easier to follow instructions in text especially if you're explaining something complicated. It also avoids the whole "I sound like I am eating the microphone and don't realize it," situation. It allows you to spell out special qualities of the dungeon like traps, curses, etc or what the plan is if X happens.

To be clear, I'm talking about using text at the beginning to go over important points for new-to-the-quest players; I'm not anti-microphone throughout at all.

[Purgatory]

I would suggest that you don't PUG if you get mad if someone dies.

I have TR guys, I take the first 5 that want to come along, and I deal with occasionally (probably 20% of the time) losing the 10% due to someone dieing...

However, your point is valid... I guess it depends on how you decline them... Also, I would change your LFM... That "no -10% xp" isn't very clear... I would change it to "no deaths" so people know you will not tolerate anyone rolling a 1...

1's dont kill people, people kill people

[vVAnjilaVv]

I find the best way for new players to learn is to let them do. If you don't have the patience for it, don't group with people u don't know.

Noone has the right to expect from people in a pug...with people they know...expectation is fine....with people you don't....well.....you're asking for it and you get what you get.

If u don't like pugging or have an unrealistic expectation of how you think the pug should go that you just joined.....don't join.....if it goes bad it's not worth the time and aggravation. Usually I only pug if I know I can get out of bad situations if it goes bad......so really I expect from myself before I expect from others.

Hope....now that is a completely different story.

[Vint]

I find the best way for new players to learn is to let them do. If you don't have the patience for it, don't group with people u don't know.

Noone has the right to expect from people in a pug...with people they know...expectation is fine....with people you don't....well.....you're asking for it and you get what you get.

If u don't like pugging or have an unrealistic expectation of how you think the pug should go that you just joined.....don't join.....if it goes bad it's not worth the time and aggravation. Usually I only pug if I know I can get out of bad situations if it goes bad......so really I expect from myself before I expect from others.

Hope....now that is a completely different story.

Would I be an elitest if I put up an LFM that said "I must know you"?

[testing1234]

dont relly mind people being elitist same way as i dont mind it greatly if i get a noob in party both has its risks and benefits.

a low amount of noobs take advice while in party while elitists genrally have their playstyle predetremind both has its risks and benefit.

pretty convient to join a group of elitists for a raid, evertings organzied and easy best way to get a fast completion.

[Talon_Moonshadow]

I think you should re-read my post a little closer. I posted this because in the past few weeks/months, I've been in groups where the word 'elitist' was used far more often than I'm used to.

It was directed at me once(I'm so proud!) in a vod group where the barb didn't know he couldn't remove his curse while madstoned. I asked him how long he has had them, and his response was, "You don't have to be an elitist jerk!"

So I replied that knowledge doesn't = elitism. I wasn't a jerk about it, it maybe caught me off guard a little, but as we had 4 barbs in a hard vod, as the leader( on a barb) I said no raging, take care of your own curses.

I'm also sick of the winers(winners has 2 n's ) who keep complaining about not getting into epic groups on their 180hp sorcs and 220 hp rogues. I really don't care, I MyDDO and am glad that I do and will continue to do so.

I MyDDO for EPIC's, not shroud, not madstone, so really get over it.

I was simply responding to the question part of the post. Not trying to judge the whole thing.

Nor am I really trying to judge you, since I don't really know you or what you are like to play with.

And of course there is a difference between elitist and elitist jerk.

But, yes, from what you have written, I think you are probably an elitist.

But you also seem proud of it.

You are certainly allowed to play your way. Just be careful not to become a jerk about it.

I've played with lots of people I consider elitist. But I also know that I do not enjoy that mentality.

Unfortunately, it is real hard to find good players in this game who are not elitists.
I've seen many people who I used to enjoy playing with, get intoxicated by the power of the dark side....

And many of those who are not, seem to have become soloist hermits....

The big thing for me is when you start worrying about what everyone else in you group is doing/building...etc.

When you cross the line from worrying about building and playing your own toon to worrying about what everyone else is doing, is when you become an elitist.

And if you continue down that line and start being mean to other players is when you become an elitist jerk.

[vVAnjilaVv]

Would I be an elitest if I put up an LFM that said "I must know you"?

No, u would be concerned with the satisfaction of ur playing time...which I in no way consider elitist.

[gigundoe]

Elitist not elitist...blah. The quests scale, so if you don't want to play with "new" folks play alone. I'm fine with playing with whom ever, and letting whatever happens, happen.

....and trust me, I hate everyone.

[begbie]

ok...

A person who uses my DDO as a determinant for skill and calibre is an diot.

Why?

well.. myddo only shows equipped items... hmmm are you looking at the person who has haggle wear on and not combat?

hhhmmmm.. my ddo.. says you got 2 min2 khopesh's... well so what.

Having the right gear does not make you a good player. Knowledge, natural aptitude and te ability to work in a team is a better qualifier as a 1337 player then any MYDDO glance will ever be.

On a personal note, I have been in many a quest/raid with well equipped folkes who die so fast (and blame it on the healers) because their bought items never compensate for lack of skillz. I don't need to give my reasons but if you are doing shroud in more then 1 round, well yer either doing a naked run or you just don't have it. If the healers have no mana left in hound on normal before the 1st beholders spawn.. well they suck... and if you are needing a party to do WW on elite at lvl 3.. well my friend.. you are definitely unskilled...

MYDDO is a useless exercise in futility... only the weak use myddo.. I personally use my friend and my squelch lists

[begbie]

Would I be an elitest if I put up an LFM that said "I must know you"?

Only if you're mom is letting you play past 10pm