Noobs are still clueless!

[Sweyn]

/QFT

This pretty much sums up what Ive seen on Argo. When pugging Ill always prefer to pick up a non squishy melee than take these chances.

635 HP
70+ AC
50 Strength

Is that squishy?

[PopeJual]

Thought i'd add something...
As i've been pugging Korthos - Marketplace lately I can say the stereotypes are back in full force. All the Rangers have been kiter's, the Barbarians THF Axe wielders, Cleric healbots, and Rogues always in sneak mode. Entertaining on a level, yet frustrating.

Dogan
"Put the bow away so we can help!"

As part of the consequences for my altoholism, I've noticed something else, as well.

Rogues with bows.

They have crazy high Dex, because that's what Rogues are supposed to have and they have low Str and Con, so they have concluded (correctly) that they are better off using a bow instead of a melee weapon.

It's a shame that they don't understand that building their character differently in the first place would mean that they weren't nearly as squishy and could last more than 3 seconds in melee combat and they could then actually contribute to the party's success during combat.

[Terelle]

Yes, but are you the exception or the rule?

If you had to bet your paycheck on who does more dps: Pugger X (Fighter 20 or Barb 20) vs. Pugger Y (Ranger 20)
without seeing the guild name, toon, myddo, or any other information, which to you take?

Sure there are Tempest III's that will drink your fighter/barb's milkshake, but that has not been my regular experience with pug rangers.

Good thing is, we don't have to deal with this situation.
Anon -> decline
Guild name -> accept depending on guild
Myddo -> accept based on build/gear or based on account/other characters if you recognise them.

Most groups I just run with whatever, grouping with bad players is a good way to build up your DNG list. In most quests/raids you can drag 3-6 pileons through anyway, barring blatant stupidity - and fortunately there is no correlation between dps and stupidity anyway

[Disavowed]

What I've noticed is Shroud was easier to complete BEFORE the cap was 20.back when it was 16.. Now it's like pulling teeth just to get people to listen or use common sense.. Stupid lvl 20 noobishness!

QFT

Still no plus 1 for you. Need to spread more it says.

[shablala]

Good thing is, we don't have to deal with this situation.
Anon -> decline
Guild name -> accept depending on guild
Myddo -> accept based on build/gear or based on account/other characters if you recognise them.

Most groups I just run with whatever, grouping with bad players is a good way to build up your DNG list. In most quests/raids you can drag 3-6 pileons through anyway, barring blatant stupidity - and fortunately there is no correlation between dps and stupidity anyway

If that is not the typical elitest jerk attitude, I dont know what is NO disrespect :P

[MeliCat]

that we can't get Shroud done unless we're level 18-20 as well.

isn't that more likely 'cos they're lfming at level 20 and it's just spawned that way? i usually had no problems sending a polite tell "heya. lvl 16 fighter but i have harry beaters and a bloodstone - can i come?". when i was ignored i suspect it was more likely they had 20 or so tells and lfms coming their way and they just chose whoever. idc.


my baby monk is lvl 6 - but i'm having real problems playing her i *hope* i'm not one of the 95% of monk players who can't play their monk correctly by lvl 20 but it's not looking good... my handwraps are ok... the only bad part of the build is the person playing her... she's so NOT awesom.

[Merlocke]

635 HP
70+ AC
50 Strength

Is that squishy?

nope.

[PopeJual]

If that is not the typical elitest jerk attitude, I dont know what is NO disrespect :P

no disrespect, but [disrespectful comment]

...there are a lot of good players on DDO. There are a lot of poor players with poor characters and poor gear. Going through quests with those players and characters is more difficult than going with an empty slot.

I'm happy to play with those folks when I'm doing a quest that I find easy and I'll even give/help farm gear for those characters if they're interested.


But I don't want throw away an hour on a failed quest or a failed raid because one or two players sucked up all of the party's available resources.

[Boldrin]

Ran a ToD tonight on my cleric... Mostly veteran players I figured No problemo... Final fight.... HALF THE PARTY GETS BANISHED!!! lol Just glad I didn't waste any pots on them. So veterans can be noobs too.

[Merlocke]

Good thing is, we don't have to deal with this situation.
Anon -> decline
Guild name -> accept depending on guild
Myddo -> accept based on build/gear or based on account/other characters if you recognise them.

MyDDO definatley helps with the guesswork for questionable puggers.
I think eventually they will make it so you will be able to look at a characters stats/build/gear just by examining the toon in the focus orb.

[shablala]

no disrespect, but [disrespectful comment]

...there are a lot of good players on DDO. There are a lot of poor players with poor characters and poor gear. Going through quests with those players and characters is more difficult than going with an empty slot.

I'm happy to play with those folks when I'm doing a quest that I find easy and I'll even give/help farm gear for those characters if they're interested.


But I don't want throw away an hour on a failed quest or a failed raid because one or two players sucked up all of the party's available resources.

Having successfully done raids with 4 or 5 people down (either through disconnects or what not), I cant imagine one or two less than avg player would ruin the raid. I am not saying you should LOOK for sub par people and add them to the raid. But just declining people because you know nothing about them is completely different.

And by the way, weather the raid was a success or not, that hour was thrown away. It is a game, there is very little productivity done playing an MMO.

[MeliCat]

no disrespect, but [disrespectful comment]

...there are a lot of good players on DDO. There are a lot of poor players with poor characters and poor gear. Going through quests with those players and characters is more difficult than going with an empty slot.

I'm happy to play with those folks when I'm doing a quest that I find easy and I'll even give/help farm gear for those characters if they're interested.


But I don't want throw away an hour on a failed quest or a failed raid because one or two players sucked up all of the party's available resources.

I suspect that resource wastage is more a result of poor leadership sometimes than characters without leet raid gear or brilliant twitch skills.

I know I don't have the best gear and have **** twitch. But if given clear instructions I can keep myself out of harms way and contribute where needed.

It's where a TOD hasn't specified clearly what is to happen to trash mobs or how the heals/reconstructs will be handed out that fail and this is poor leadership rather than those players.

I may be an ungeared under-par player but after some TOD raids I swear I am going to lead one just so it can be done the way I think works

And also people *do* learn and *do* get better. I think you should give them a bit more of a chance.

[MeliCat]

And by the way, weather the raid was a success or not, that hour was thrown away. It is a game, there is very little productivity done playing an MMO.

Exactly! If you're not having fun, what's the point?


/says she who stresses out ALL the time. LOL

[Alexander_Illusioni]

Ran a ToD tonight on my cleric... Mostly veteran players I figured No problemo... Final fight.... HALF THE PARTY GETS BANISHED!!! lol Just glad I didn't waste any pots on them. So veterans can be noobs too.

Not only that, but it bugs me to no end, to see Vets without 100% fortification. I can understand it in newer players, but players that have been around 1+years? I see this way too often. Drives me absolutely crazy.

[Vissarion]

This reminds me of a run I joined for Mired in Kobolds the other day on my Dwarven 10 Ranger/2 Monk. The party was all underlevel (11s and 12s), but since it was normal, I figured it wouldn't be that big of a deal.

The final guy who joined was a "tank" on a 12 Fighter who was bragging endlessly about his tanking skills and how good his character was. This was after I told the group leader that I could probably tank the dragon if need be (self-buffed AC to 47). Out of curiosity, I decided to MyDDO the "tank" and found out he had 20 hit points less than me (and I'm wearing the Bloodrage Symbiont), was still wearing vet status gear (Moss Weave Cloak, one of the early level "bauble" trinkets, etc) and had 0% fortification. Amused, I decided to check the other party members, and I was the only one with any fortification (heavy fort, of course, with the Nightforge Gorget. Still acquiring taps for Minos) and the hit point level of the other characters was...underwhelming.

So I'm a pretty easy-going guy and decided to go along with it. Figured if necessary I could brute force the quest and solo-tank the baby dragon. The "tank" tried to intimidate it when we finally got there after a couple hilariously fast deaths, but I pulled aggro each time within about .1 seconds, which was good for the tank since he was always on death's doorstep. The party then wanted to take a crack at Sinvala, so I told the healer to keep me up and I'd do the best I could, but when we engaged her he kept healing the "tank" while he and the other casters foolishly stayed within range of the breath weapon, dying rather rapidly. I did some damage, but there's really only so much a level 12 Ranger can do against Sinvala, effectively solo.

The funniest part was when the "tank" would occasionally express disbelief as to why a Ranger would get into the thick of things and melee. :P

*headdesk*

[k0ukla]

Yeah, Id think twice about accepting a gimped Tempest build.
Especially with Lightning Strike & Holy GS weapons!




I'm just wondering how many of you just tried to hover the mouse over the tool-tips!!!

PS, this is the weaker of the 2 Tempest builds, the other is in the TR grind somewhere

:| i dyed my hair blonde for a reason...u know in my head i KNEW i couldnt do it but still my mouse did it anyway :|

[MeliCat]

This reminds me of a run I joined for Mired in Kobolds the other day on my Dwarven 10 Ranger/2 Monk. The party was all underlevel (11s and 12s), but since it was normal, I figured it wouldn't be that big of a deal.


<snip>

The funniest part was when the "tank" would occasionally express disbelief as to why a Ranger would get into the thick of things and melee. :P

*headdesk*

wot? he didn't get a clue when you *weren't* trying to kite the dragon? :-D

[Renvar]

Maybe I'm reading your reply to DDO talk wrong but I think the QFT statement tells me I'm not. The way I read your statement is you're going to avoid the rogue, monk, ranger classes because of the resons he cited and stick with the go to barb ftr.

i think you did misunderstand me. I was trying to explain why I can understand how folks get a negative view of those classes. While I agree that there are bad fighter and barb builds, they have generally one focus melee dps. Even a fighter stalwart defender can do dps. But the ranger and rogue have paths that can lead to terrible dps and the classes have no toughness enhancments and limited hit dice, which can more easily lead to craptastic HP. There is more margin for error.

All that said, I would never exclude those classes. As I mentioned, I understand what they can do. I enjoy well built rogues, Tempest rangers, and ladies.

On non-raids I usually take the first 5 to hit the LFM. If you get in my group and are an hp/dps/gear/fortification challenged rogue or ranger and seem open to advice, then I will try to coach you on your build. If you are a solid player and build, then I will enjoy running with you.

So, I don't make those exclusions, but when I am looking to join LFM's and I see those exclusions I don't get too upset because I understand why. I just move on and form my own and let them have their fun run.

Sorry if my message got lost in goofing around with bogus stats. I was trying to make it fun.

[Vissarion]

wot? he didn't get a clue when you *weren't* trying to kite the dragon? :-D

Nope, but then again, pretty sure the last thing this guy was capable of was getting a clue. :P

[Nysrock]

Not only that, but it bugs me to no end, to see Vets without 100% fortification. I can understand it in newer players, but players that have been around 1+years? I see this way too often. Drives me absolutely crazy.

Speaking just for myself, there are times when I am lazy and log off with my haggle item on instead of my heavy fort. Or sometimes I just wear a snazzy hat instead of Minos. So MyDDO isn't ALL knowing.