Dwarf sword and board evasion rogue

[Usquen]

This is a probably a bad idea, but because of the recent update I decided to try my hand at an evasion favored soul, focusing on healing with a dwarven axe and shield. I've never played a favored soul or a rogue but just though I'd try to blend the two together. No idea what to take for enhancements, thought I might figure it out on the way. Post your thoughts!

Edit: Forgot my skills, I've got 10 base open lock so I plan on getting a +15 item to make it 25, sound good?

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.34
DDO Character Planner Home Page

Level 20 Chaotic Good Dwarf Male
(2 Rogue \ 18 Favored Soul) 
Hit Points: 280
Spell Points: 1480 
BAB: 14\14\19\24
Fortitude: 14
Reflex: 14
Will: 14

                  Starting            Ending          Feat/Enhancement
Abilities        Base Stats         Base Stats         Modified Stats
(32 Point)       (Level 1)          (Level 20)           (Level 20)
Strength             16                 21                   21
Dexterity            10                 10                   10
Constitution         16                 16                   16
Intelligence          8                  8                    8
Wisdom               16                 16                   16
Charisma             10                 10                   10

                  Starting            Ending          Feat/Enhancement
                 Base Skills        Base Skills        Modified Skills
Skills           (Level 1)          (Level 20)          (Level 20)
Balance               4                  5                    9
Bluff                 0                  0                    0
Concentration         5                 23                   23
Diplomacy             0                  0                    0
Disable Device       n/a               n/a                   n/a
Haggle                0                  0                    0
Heal                  3                  3                    3
Hide                  0                  0                    0
Intimidate            0                  0                    0
Jump                  7                  9                    9
Listen                3                  3                    3
Move Silently         4                  4                    4
Open Lock             4                 10                   10
Perform               n/a               n/a                   n/a
Repair               -1                 -1                   -1
Search               -1                 -1                    1
Spot                  7                  7                    7
Swim                  3                  5                    5
Tumble                4                  4                    4
Use Magic Device      n/a               n/a                   n/a

Level 1 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+4)
Skill: Concentration (+2)
Skill: Jump (+4)
Skill: Move Silently (+4)
Skill: Open Lock (+4)
Skill: Spot (+4)
Skill: Tumble (+4)
Feat: (Selected) Toughness


Level 2 (Favored Soul)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Feat: (Diety) Favored by the Sovereign Host


Level 3 (Favored Soul)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Extend Spell


Level 4 (Favored Soul)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Concentration (+1)


Level 5 (Favored Soul)
Skill: Concentration (+1)


Level 6 (Favored Soul)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Feat: (Favored Soul Bonus) Energy Resistance: Fire
Feat: (Selected) Maximize Spell


Level 7 (Rogue)
Skill: Balance (+1)
Skill: Open Lock (+6)


Level 8 (Favored Soul)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Concentration (+1)


Level 9 (Favored Soul)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Quicken Spell


Level 10 (Favored Soul)
Skill: Concentration (+1)


Level 11 (Favored Soul)
Skill: Concentration (+1)


Level 12 (Favored Soul)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Feat: (Favored Soul Bonus) Energy Resistance: Cold
Feat: (Selected) Toughness


Level 13 (Favored Soul)
Skill: Concentration (+1)


Level 14 (Favored Soul)
Skill: Concentration (+1)


Level 15 (Favored Soul)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Empower Spell


Level 16 (Favored Soul)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Concentration (+1)


Level 17 (Favored Soul)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Feat: (Favored Soul Bonus) Energy Resistance: Electricity


Level 18 (Favored Soul)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Feat: (Selected) Empower Healing Spell


Level 19 (Favored Soul)
Skill: Concentration (+1)


Level 20 (Favored Soul)
Ability Raise: STR
Skill: Concentration (+1)

[Matuse]

Instead of taking Toughness twice, consider taking Exotic Weapon Proficiency: Dwarven Axe.

[Usquen]

Instead of taking Toughness twice, consider taking Exotic Weapon Proficiency: Dwarven Axe.

But dwarves get the proficiency I though?

[Matuse]

Only classes who get all martial weapons (fighter, barbarian, paladin, ranger) get dwarf axe for free.

Perhaps someday, there will be a dwarven FvS diety who gives axe proficiency.

[andreascott89]

Well if you are looking for evasion, a monk has a lot more synergy with FvS than a rogue.

Off the top, here are the reasons why 2 monk levels have synergy (compared to 2 rogue levels):

-Monks get a bonus feat at level 1 and 2...FvS are a feat starved class

-Evasion is valuable when you make a reflex save...2 levels of monk give +3 to all saves

-Evasion only works when wearing light armor. Light armor generally has terrible AC, except when you are a monk! Monks get to add their wisdom modifier to their AC when they are wearing robes. Did I mention wisdom is the primary casting stat for FvS?

On the downside, you would have to drop the shield to get the wisdom AC bonus. If that is critical for flavor, then that point is less important.

A rogue splash does allow for better UMD, so perhaps that is important?

I haven't thought too much about it, but I think a rogue splash would be stretching yourself very thin...

Who knows, maybe you can find a way to make it work though

GS

[Usquen]

Well if you are looking for evasion, a monk has a lot more synergy with FvS than a rogue.

Off the top, here are the reasons why 2 monk levels have synergy (compared to 2 rogue levels):

-Monks get a bonus feat at level 1 and 2...FvS are a feat starved class

-Evasion is valuable when you make a reflex save...2 levels of monk give +3 to all saves

-Evasion only works when wearing light armor. Light armor generally has terrible AC, except when you are a monk! Monks get to add their wisdom modifier to their AC when they are wearing robes. Did I mention wisdom is the primary casting stat for FvS?

On the downside, you would have to drop the shield to get the wisdom AC bonus. If that is critical for flavor, then that point is less important.

A rogue splash does allow for better UMD, so perhaps that is important?

I haven't thought too much about it, but I think a rogue splash would be stretching yourself very thin...

Who knows, maybe you can find a way to make it work though

GS

All of these are very interesting, the one problem I'm worried about is the new updates to TWF so I wasn't sure if I wanted to go that way. If I were to take the monk levels would you suggest I take them at level 1 and 7 like I did with the rogue?

[Usquen]

Only classes who get all martial weapons (fighter, barbarian, paladin, ranger) get dwarf axe for free.

Perhaps someday, there will be a dwarven FvS diety who gives axe proficiency.

Ahhh I see, thanks for clearing that up! I will add it in now.

[Usquen]

This is what I get with the suggestions and monk levels instead of rogue, I had to rework maximize spell and weapon prof but I think it looks alright... Any tips?

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.34
DDO Character Planner Home Page

Level 20 Lawful Good Dwarf Male
(2 Monk \ 18 Favored Soul) 
Hit Points: 284
Spell Points: 1480 
BAB: 14\14\19\24
Fortitude: 17
Reflex: 14
Will: 17

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
Abilities        Base Stats          Modified Stats
(32 Point)       (Level 1)             (Level 20)
Strength             16                    21
Dexterity            10                    10
Constitution         16                    16
Intelligence          8                     8
Wisdom               16                    16
Charisma             10                    10

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                 Base Skills         Modified Skills
Skills           (Level 1)            (Level 20)
Balance               4                    10
Bluff                 0                     0
Concentration         7                    26
Diplomacy             0                     0
Disable Device       n/a                   n/a
Haggle                0                     0
Heal                  3                     3
Hide                  0                     0
Intimidate            0                     0
Jump                  3                     5
Listen                3                     3
Move Silently         0                     0
Open Lock             n/a                   n/a
Perform               n/a                   n/a
Repair               -1                    -1
Search               -1                     1
Spot                  3                     3
Swim                  3                     5
Tumble                4                     4
Use Magic Device      n/a                   n/a

Level 1 (Monk)
Feat: (Selected) Stunning Blow
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Toughness


Level 2 (Favored Soul)
Feat: (Diety) Favored by the Sovereign Host


Level 3 (Favored Soul)
Feat: (Selected) Extend Spell


Level 4 (Favored Soul)


Level 5 (Favored Soul)


Level 6 (Favored Soul)
Feat: (Favored Soul Bonus) Energy Resistance: Fire
Feat: (Selected) Exotic Weapon Proficiency: Dwarven Waraxe


Level 7 (Monk)
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Toughness


Level 8 (Favored Soul)


Level 9 (Favored Soul)
Feat: (Selected) Quicken Spell


Level 10 (Favored Soul)


Level 11 (Favored Soul)


Level 12 (Favored Soul)
Feat: (Favored Soul Bonus) Energy Resistance: Cold
Feat: (Selected) Maximize Spell


Level 13 (Favored Soul)


Level 14 (Favored Soul)


Level 15 (Favored Soul)
Feat: (Selected) Empower Spell


Level 16 (Favored Soul)


Level 17 (Favored Soul)
Feat: (Favored Soul Bonus) Energy Resistance: Electricity


Level 18 (Favored Soul)
Feat: (Selected) Empower Healing Spell


Level 19 (Favored Soul)


Level 20 (Favored Soul)

[Jackmorse]

Using axes with a monk splash would cause you to become uncentered afaik and then loose your bonuses to ac etc.

[Matuse]

Nothing to be done about that. All monk splashes deal with being uncentered, more or less (there might be some whirling steel strike sovereign host builds that include it after update 5).

You don't take a splash of monk to be centered...you take it for 2 feats in a very feat starved class, and for the evasion.

[pappo]

Nothing to be done about that. All monk splashes deal with being uncentered, more or less (there might be some whirling steel strike sovereign host builds that include it after update 5).

You don't take a splash of monk to be centered...you take it for 2 feats in a very feat starved class, and for the evasion.

That was something that drove me crazy when I tried a FvS/Monk. The screen always saying I was not centered. I thought that was a very bad thing. Are you saying it is Ok to run around "not centered", because the only thing you are using from the monk splash is the bonus feats and evasion ?

[Nyvn]

Using axes with a monk splash would cause you to become uncentered afaik and then loose your bonuses to ac etc.

Not using monk weapons still gives you your Wisdom to Ac... you just have to not be wearing armor or a shield. And it's definitely "ok" to be uncentered.

[Matuse]

Uncentered means that you cannot be in a stance, so you don't get the +2 dex from air, or +2 wis from water.

It also means you don't retain any Ki, so your ability to activate monk special attacks is limited to nonexistant (this is just the 1d6 of element damage, with only 2 levels you're not going to pull off any kind of real finishing move).

And lastly, the AC bonus from wisdom goes away. Nuisance at low levels where AC can help, but it rapidly becomes unimportant.

After that, you just have to deal with the little ZOMG, YOU'RE UNCENTERED! icon in the top right.

[Nyvn]

Uncentered means...
And lastly, the AC bonus from wisdom goes away. Nuisance at low levels where AC can help, but it rapidly becomes unimportant.

Untrue, You only loose the Wisdom to Ac if you wear armor or a shield. Your weapons have no effect on it.

[Matuse]

Ok, fair enough. Enjoy your +2 wis then

[Nyvn]

You retain the wisdom to Ac when you are uncentered. No +2 from any stance or Ki regen exactly as you stated.

The monk wisdom (and class) bonus to armor class should essentially function "by the book". This bonus should be lost if wearing any armor, using a shield, or encumbered. It does not check for ki weapons however - it's less restrictive than the monk abilities that require one to remain centered.

Edited: added Eladrin's Quote

[richieelias27]

Ok, fair enough. Enjoy your +2 wis then

Nyvn is referring to the AC bonus to wisdom, not the +2 from the stance. By not wearing armor, even with a base wis of 16 you are looking at +5 AC with just an easily obtainable +4wis item, and +7AC with enhancements and +6 wis item. Couple that with the generally better magic enhancements on robes and you're much better off wearing cloth than heavy/medium armor anyway.