Six suggestions to breathe life back into old quests

[jhorn02]

I saw another post today (http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=255083) noting the repetition we go through while leveling multiple characters. It made me think about several threads I've seen suggesting how to make quests less predictable and thus, more exciting. Here are six suggestions that I think would go a long way toward making quests feel less repetitive. I wish I could give credit to the originators of these ideas, but I can’t even pretend that I can remember. Anyway, take these for what they are: thought provoking suggestions for mechanisms to make this very good game even better.

P.S. For those who would cry “Don’t waste dev time on this. More new content!” – I agree, but I’d imagine (some of) these improvements taking far less dev time than new content and honestly, if I had my choice I’d give up 4 new quests in return for adding new flavor to the 50 quests I’ve run 50+ times (and will have to run several more times while leveling new characters). Just something to think about…

Random trap locations
Add a few additional traps to quests that already contain traps and give each a % chance of appearing in a given instance. Not every quest should have traps, but those that do should have traps and trap boxes appear in different locations on different runs. I'm tired of seeing vets jump up and down beside a blank wall saying "trap box is here"...so unrealistic and makes trap sense virtually useless unless you're running a quest for the first time.

Random trap types
For elemental traps, vary the trap type from one instance to another. This could be achieved by placing 2 or more traps in close proximity with a random generator that determines which (if any) appear. The possibility of having two traps occasionally spawn in almost the same location wouldn't be that bad and, in fact, has already been done (the first shrine in Monastery, among others). Blade traps would be trickier to vary, but could also be done with a little more work.

Randomize monster CRs
Add a small amount of randomness to each monsters CR...about 20% should do. For instance, any mob at CR4 or below would not vary, but a CR 5 mob could range from CR4 to CR6 while a CR10 mob could range from CR8 to CR12. It would add flavor and challenge to the game if you stumbled on a group of 4 CR12 monsters when you were expecting 4 CR10s. As long as the variation isn't too great, it shouldn't overwhelm most parties and would tend to average out over the course of a quest...with a few easier encounters and a few harder ones. Bosses should probably have fixed CRs since they fall outside the normal spectrum of mobs.

Randomize monster types
This would need to be done in moderation and in the right locations, but it would be nice to have spots within some quests where the type of mob changes from one instance to another. We see hints of this with the norm/hard/elite mechanic and in a few other unique spots, but adding more examples of this would increase the challenge and surprise in quests. Imagine a warforged opening a door to face a rust monster or mindflayer instead of a troll. This could reintroduce some PNP-type suspense of never knowing what you're going to find behind a locked door!

Randomize monster locations
Allowing monsters to spawn in slightly different locations within quests would add surprise and realism to the game. Open one door to find a lonely mob. Open the next to find five of its friends. The implementation of this would require careful coding so that parties aren't overwhelmed by too many mobs at once, but varying the spawn points would add a little more realism.

Randomize (some) quest maps
I realize that truly random adventure maps are likely impossible with the amount of crafting that goes into creating DDO dungeons. However, particular areas of particular quests could be randomized. We see hints of this in a few quests, but it would add a little more variety to quests.

[k1ngp1n]

/signed

Unfortunately, I don't hold out hope that this will be implemented, but doing so would indeed unravel a whole new play dynamic. Of course then we'd have a bunch of players screaming, 'OMG! That trap is SO NOT FAIR!'

*sigh*

[JPDefault]

Even if I know this will fall on deaf ears, I'm going to /sign.

Metagaming is an easy button, and Turbine seems to add one of those with every release

[grodon9999]

Agreed - more stuff should be random.

[rdasca]

/signed and double signed. With the exception of the random maps, everything you just put forth would require only a little time and since we know that they make some of these changes for epic, then the Turbine devs could do it if they wanted to.

[Loromir]

What would really be cool, is if this was implemented without warning. Think of all the zergers who run these quests blindly because they have run then 100's of time. All of the sudden, they hit a quest that has random mobs in random locations right after they hit a random trap.....Ding!!!!

I can just hear the fowl language clogging up the servers chat rooms. It would be hilarious!

[LordPiglet]

/signed

Would also be cool if they had random fake trap control panels. I.E. you ran up to the control panel, the moved up and the trap went off because it's actually on the opposite side of the trap, or opposite wall, etc.

[Halbarad]

/signed If they do this, I might actually have to be awake when I'm running those lowbies through STK and Tangleroot!

[kingfisher]

***warning*** This Idea Will Be Nerfed From Orbit In T-15 Seconds To Prevent Hamster Overload And Further Development Of 'lag'. Please Evactuate The Thread Immediately.

[Ormindo]

I would LOVE random monster location for explorer areas. You know, in old D&D, you roll a dice to see your encounter. Same thing.

[~ArthurK]

Those Six little advancements to DDO would bring it that much closer to real PnP and would add the uncertainty that is not there now. In other words.............WHAT A GREAT IDEA !!!!

[jhorn02]

If they do this, I might actually have to be awake when I'm running those lowbies through STK and Tangleroot!

That was my thought exactly. Even harbor quests might suddenly keep my attention.

[iamsamoth0]

the option. For it to be randomized, based on group and level. After it has been completed through it's highest difficulty settings. Similar to what Dungeon Scaling does, but maybe allow different monster types. Hmm?

[jhorn02]

the option. For it to be randomized, based on group and level. After it has been completed through it's highest difficulty settings. Similar to what Dungeon Scaling does, but maybe allow different monster types. Hmm?

That's an interesting idea. Run the quest the way the devs designed it first...then experience the variations.

Of course, if they can code variations in quests and ensure they still offer a balanced gameplay experience, why not just incorporate variation into the quest design for all runs?

[Falco_Easts]

Good ideas. +1

[Kwyjibo]

/signed

But with Turbine continuing to 'dumb down' the game, I'm not sure generating randomness would help the new players and therefore would be against policy.

[jhorn02]

But with Turbine continuing to 'dumb down' the game, I'm not sure generating randomness would help the new players and therefore would be against policy.

Funny. But even new players are going to get tired of running the same quests at some point. I figure a decent percent of WoW converts will create a few characters and level them to 5 or 6. But where is the carrot to encourage players to keep buying new character slots? New classes is on draw, but the repetition in quests weighs against that. I mean, how much difference is there in running low level content as a Ranger, Fighter, Barb, or Pally. Not much.

Think of the TP points Turbine can make if they make low level quests interesting and varied enough to encourage F2P players to run through them with several characters. Right now, once you've run a quest 2-3 times, there's nothing new you're going to see. I bet many new players never make more than a couple of characters because the low level quests get so repetitive and there aren't options for a different starting experience.

[Halock]

Great ideas, for those who cry dont waste time fixing old stuff, make new ones, i'd say sure, just make new stuff with these ideas in mind, they are, imo, what made D&D great, we see hints of it here in the gameworld now and then, duno why it isnt followed up more.

[FluffyCalico]

Random trap locations
.

It's not going to happen. This was requested before the very first mod back when the game came out. They gave VON2 simi-random traps and locations in that maze. People whined and cried so much about not being able to know exactly where every trap was and what type it was that they never did it again until Reavers reach in Monestary and people again cried so much it won't be happening a 3rd time.

They have tried this 2 times and 2 times got to much whineing on the forums over it I don't see them ever doing it again.

What would really be cool, is if this was implemented without warning. Think of all the zergers who run these quests blindly because they have run then 100's of time. All of the sudden, they hit a quest that has random mobs in random locations right after they hit a random trap.....Ding!!!!

I can just hear the fowl language clogging up the servers chat rooms. It would be hilarious!

LOL hate to meet the zergers you run with. Good zergers would go meh and keep going.

[Meetch1972]

I'm all for the spirit of the OP! Great ideas. The only part that should be particularly challenging to developers is map randomisation - retrofitting that to existing dungeons would probably be painful.

One thing I would avoid doing, just for completeness, is randomisation in casual mode. To me, casual == easy == predictable == you're just running Prey on the Hunter for runes and don't want to know about any unexpected traps or mob surprises and let's face it, I don't think many would complain if the maze wasn't random on casual.

The difficulty increase going to Hard then Elite could then up the number of traps/unexpected mobs on a random basis. Going to Elite might not necessarily mean the traps hurt so much more than they currently do on Hard, but of course they would be far less predictable and improve the importance of having someone find them, whether it be the painful or not so painful way.

Plus, more traps randomly placed in the dungeon means more opportunity for components for the Rogue to make traps/grenades as of U5. Imagine being able to turn some of that extra risk into extra throwing damage a little later on...

I do hope the devs can give some feedback on whether there are plans for any of this!