Make Tenser's Transformation = Combat Expertise

[zukt]

I find this argument lacking. If clickies weren't so prevalent, players would cast this spell. It's not that the spell sucks, it's just that clickies are better. Furthermore, since this game is so god aweful monty haul, the enhancement bonuses are a non-factor.

No. Its that this spell sucks and clickies are better. If clickies didn't exist no one would still use this spell.

A better solution is simply change the stat bonuses to something that stacks with enhancement. The restriction on casting should remain.

And no one would still use this spell.

[mournbladereigns]

I like that idea.

You become a virtual fighting machine—stronger, tougher, faster, and more skilled in combat. Your mind-set changes so that you relish combat and you can’t cast spells, even from magic items.

You gain a +4 enhancement bonus to Strength, Dexterity, and Constitution, a +4 natural armor bonus to AC, a +5 competence bonus on Fortitude saves, and proficiency with all simple and martial weapons. Your base attack bonus equals your character level (which may give you multiple attacks).

You lose your spellcasting ability, including your ability to use spell trigger or spell completion magic items, just as if the spells were no longer on your class list.

How about changing it to spells cost 25 more sp (its as taxing to cast as a maximized spell while under its effect)

You gain a +2 insight bonus to STR, DEX, and CON, a +4 natural armor bonus, a +5 competence bonus on Fort saves. Proficiency with all simple and martial weapons (and full BAB as a fighter of your character level)

So it becomes more like a stance benefit. And its counter productive to nuking due to the 25 sp cost. So good compromise. CL just adds duration like current DP.

[mournbladereigns]

You are still talking about tensor's transformation right? The level 6 spell? The one that currently gives absolutely no benefit to damage whatsoever?

^THIS^

speaking as someone who runs a Tukaw build on DP clickies. Your melee is still gonna be less awesome, even mega-buffed/hasted/DP's and with Titan's grip, 36 str, full WF PA. My melee damage is only 2nd tier (some would say 3rd tier). Thanks to taking Water Savant II, my nuking is average, but with a significantly smaller pool and no DC's. My DPS drops when meleeing rather than just pure nuking. So not really gonna be a major bonus to damage.

It will just let melee-casters/spellswords/swordmages etc use an arcane spell for full BAB instead of a DP clicky/scroll. Which is just fine with me.

[FranOhmsford]

According to AD&D 2nd Ed. Player's Handbook Revised Printing.

Tenser's Transformation
{Alteration, Evocation}

Range: 0
Duration: 1 rd/lvl - 6 seconds/lvl
Area of Effect: The Caster

Tenser's Transformation is a sight guaranteed to astound any creature not aware of it's power, for when the wizard casts the spell he undergoes a startling transformation.

The size and strength of the wizard increase to HEROIC PROPORTIONS, so he becomes a FORMIDABLE FIGHTING MACHINE; the spell causes the caster to become a BERSERK FIGHTER! The wizard's HIT POINTS DOUBLE and all damage he sustains comes first from the magical points gained; once these points are eliminated, all SUBSEQUENT DAMAGE IS DOUBLED.

The wizard's AC is 4 better than that possessed prior to casting the spell.

All attacks are as a fighter OF THE SAME LEVEL as the wizard.

The wizard can use either a DAGGER or a QUARTERSTAFF when attacking. A dagger can be used twice/round, and each successfull attack inflicts an additional 2 pts of damage.
A staff can be used only once/round but with a +2 bonus to ATTACK and DAMAGE.

The wizard fights in melee in preference to all other forms of attack and continues attacking till all opponents are slain, he is killed, the magic is dispelled or the spell duration expires.

The material component is a potion of HEROISM/SUPERHEROISM that is consumed during spellcasting.

[fyrst.grok]

I like that idea.

How about something similar for bladesworn transformation? Healing would still be a problem though.

[parvo]

No. Its that this spell sucks and clickies are better. If clickies didn't exist no one would still use this spell.



And no one would still use this spell.

So out in monty haul monkey zerg world a spell isn't used because you can easily get gear that surpasses it. The cure is not further mudflation.

For six years there have been gobs of spells not used. So what.

[samthedagger]

The simplest fix I can imagine is to allow a caster to dispel any spells upon himself by double clicking the icon for the spell at the top of the screen.

[zukt]

So out in monty haul monkey zerg world a spell isn't used because you can easily get gear that surpasses it. The cure is not further mudflation.

For six years there have been gobs of spells not used. So what.

And even if you couldn't get gear that did divine power clickies no one would use it because there's no reason to play a toon with a blue bar if you can't use it.

Out in the monty haul monkey zerg world is where most of us actually play. Don't like it, play something else. For most of us, having a spell that we would actually be able to use is more fun; For you, its apparently just another complaint about the game.

[parvo]

And even if you couldn't get gear that did divine power clickies no one would use it because there's no reason to play a toon with a blue bar if you can't use it.

Out in the monty haul monkey zerg world is where most of us actually play. Don't like it, play something else. For most of us, having a spell that we would actually be able to use is more fun; For you, its apparently just another complaint about the game.

What prevents you from casting other buffs first?

[Gkar]

What prevents you from casting other buffs first?

Nothing.

Doesn't mean you don't want to cast other things during combat. Fighting in an AOE spell is pretty handy, as is tossing out the odd wail or finger.

And for 90%+ of the player base who don't play your little sub game, the divine clicky IS freely available and its stupid that using a divine spell is better than using an arcane one for an arcane. The current version of the spell is worth it in PnP, but not in this game.

As for "there are lots of useless spells so what"...its a good thing if we actually make spell choices useful.

[jcTharin]

For six years there have been gobs of spells not used. So what.

This is a bad thing that needs to be fixed. One spell at a time.

[parvo]

Nothing.

Doesn't mean you don't want to cast other things during combat. Fighting in an AOE spell is pretty handy, as is tossing out the odd wail or finger.

And for 90%+ of the player base who don't play your little sub game, the divine clicky IS freely available and its stupid that using a divine spell is better than using an arcane one for an arcane. The current version of the spell is worth it in PnP, but not in this game.

As for "there are lots of useless spells so what"...its a good thing if we actually make spell choices useful.

I agree. That's why in my little sub game we don't use brokers and auction. A clicky like that is special.

[parvo]

This is a bad thing that needs to be fixed. One spell at a time.

Yea. Like they fixed Solid Fog.

[noinfo]

This is a bad thing that needs to be fixed. One spell at a time.

Exactly right which is why they have the spell pass. There should be NO useless spells in game.

[noinfo]

What prevents you from casting other buffs first?

So anyone you play with actually use this spell? Just curious.

[jcTharin]

So anyone you play with actually use this spell? Just curious.

What he said. I have never heard of someone who actually uses the spell.

[scottmike0]

What he said. I have never heard of someone who actually uses the spell.

i kinda use it to show off since it looks sooo cool!

[jcTharin]

i kinda use it to show off since it looks sooo cool!

I would probably UMD it on a rogue for that if i didn't kill my ability to umd stuff.

well...... if a had a rogue.

[parvo]

So anyone you play with actually use this spell? Just curious.

In my circle, there is only one mage/warrior and that is mine. He's level fifteen and the second oldest character I have. There are only a handful of us at that level, so our groups are not well-rounded. I have to self heal. If there was another arcane in the group that could cast reconstruct on me, I would use it. After I cast my buffs, the only thing I cast between is haste, fire shield (if I have mana to waste) and reapir anyway. I have cast it before and it makes a big difference because I hit much more often. The same character has a divine power clickie, but that is saved for big fights not trash.

It's a totally different game I play. I get that. But it's not like arcanes are stuggling in the normal game.

[Chai]

If you want a viable epic melee build, than build one. Don't build a gimp and cry to Turbine to save your gimp build. I don't use Tenser's often (in permadeath play) because it turns me into a fighter without spell capability, as it should. You talk as if it's unfair that a properly built specialty class can outdamage a warrior-mage in melee. Given the huge buff of Tenser's added to the capability of casting spells (at double cost), there would be zero reason for a warrior-mage not to have it on all the time. Mobs are going to die twice as fast, the warrior mage takes half the damage and therefore the only thing they need to cast while Tensered, (repair) will be cast half as often, meaning SP cost is a wash, but the character is doing lots more damage.

I'm not here to say the game should be balanced. That battle is lost. Turb decided a dead fish should be able to easily conquer the game. But let's at least hold the line somewhere.

Mobs will die twice as fast as what? Rounding up 15 mobs and casting one wail, and watching 10-12 of them fall over dead after one cast? No, mobs will not die twice as fast with a caster in tensers mode. Mobs die alot faster with a caster playing as an actual caster, and not as a melee wanna be.

The major reason why I see NOT allowing this is due to SLAs. 2X mana cost on SLAs is hardly noticed with a 2500 mana having caster who is now decent in melee combat. Tukaw style savants would be running around meleeing and rotaing through SLAs. How OP is this? Some would say not really, due to the fact that if you compare it to a traditional sorc, who can pretty much steamroll everyone elses DPS at this point, its not really game breaking.