New Dice notation. Do not like.

[Missing_Minds]

This thread is laden with too many attacks and insults to allow it to stay open. We were very clear on what is and is not acceptable feedback regarding the changes. You are welcome to try this again so long as the posts are within the forum guidelines. I'll be very blunt when I say telling players "you're too stupid to learn D&D" is pretty much not acceptable on these forums in any way shape or form.

Tolero... That is exactly what Turbine is telling us by keeping that notation.

In any rendition of DnD I've ever played, it was always roll the dice. 5d6, 10d6, 1d20, etc. Your sum result is the outcome. It is part of the heritage of the game.

[Goldeneye]

It's for the ex-WoW players

[R0cksteady]

You guys are really this upset about a change in description?

[kingfisher]

also tolero, please explain why we are not allowed to call a spade a spade. your making this change because new players complain that the 40 yr old d20 system is too hard to understand. we complain about that change for that reason and are told that its not allowed. do you want our opinion or not?

[bradleyforrest]

You guys are really this upset about a change in description?

It's an affront to the franchise.

[Gnorbert]

You guys are really this upset about a change in description?

Yes, the d20 system is a staple of D&D... this change is just one move along the slippery slope that turns "Dungeons & Dragons Online" into "Generic medieval fantasy online".



Also do NOT like!

[Sylvurdragon]

I wanna /sign this. Being as professional as I can be with the situation...

I, like many others, play DDO because this is a D&D game. We are fans of the PnP style of gameplay that D&D offers. Taking away xDy or making it an afterthought, takes away from what many of us are here for. If we wanted to play WoW or EQ or Insertrandommmohere we would. We play DDO because it is D&D.

I know I don't speak for everyone and there are some who have never touched a d20 system...but even they get it. This is a change for the worst...and honestly, I haven't seen this kind of /attack since the offer wall...this is not a good move.

/mild rant off

[Patience]

we complain about that change for that reason and are told that its not allowed. do you want our opinion or not?

We absolutely want feedback on the change, but it should be done civilly, please. This is a community and a public space, so we'd appreciate it if people remembered that when providing feedback.

[REALb0r3d]

1d3+3 /= 1 to 6

/signed

[Missing_Minds]

You guys are really this upset about a change in description?

Does it encourage me to quit in any fashion? No.

Does it irrationally irritate me to no end? HECK YES!
Does it also rationally irritate me knowing that Turbine made the decision to pay one of their developers to go through and chance every single dice comment which adds NOTHING to the game? YES.

[kingfisher]

You guys are really this upset about a change in description?

would wrigley be the same without the ivy? fenway without the monster?

[Cendaer]

I would prefer for the new annotation to be placed at the end of the description, or behind the dice notation.

Something along the lines of:

2d6 (this means 2-12)

would be a not-so-bad comprimise, IMO, if the new notation can't be moved to the footnote position (where you've moved the dice notation) instead.


After so many years playing, you have already trained me to the dice notation (whether I was/am a DnD player or not). This change has resulted in descriptions having a sort of ... jarring ... effect on my reading comprehension in-game.

I appreciate and applaud your efforts to make dice rolls easier to understand for new players which might not be familiar with dice rolls, but this feels very disruptive to my eyes and brain. I am far too trained to reading the dice roll notation, and seeing it in a particular position on the description; having it changed and moved is not feeling comfortable at all.

[R0cksteady]

They're not even changing the die system. They're just changing the explanation. They tell you how much damage it can do in the description, then put the dice info at the bottom.

It's not like they're using static damage or something.

[dunklezhan]

This game trades on its D&D heritage. It attracts lots of new players because of that heritage. Now, it also attracts players because its F2P, and of course they must be catered for, but if they're not sure what the dice shortand means, well:

There are tips on the loading screen explaining what this means.
If someone asks in advice what it means they'll be told.
If someone asks in guild they'll be told.
If someone asks in general they'll be told
If someone asks in trade they'll be told.
If they ask on the forums they'll be told.
If they search on the unofficial wiki they'll be told.
If they bother to RTFM that comes with the game download its in there.
Even if someone only asks in party there's a good chance someone will be able to tell them.

They will then, mostly, learn. And those that don't probably either won't get the '1 to 8 points of damage' type notations or weren't bothered enough to ask in the first place.

If you must contain an explanation as well as the dice notation in the tool tips, please make the dice notation the most prominent of the the two.

This is not broken. Please do not fix it.

thanks

[bradleyforrest]

It's not just the fact that moving the dice to be an afterthought bugs me, it's that knowing what dice are being rolled will give a better idea of what to expect. Yes, 2d6 is 2-12, but you're only going to see a 2 every 36 rolls. 2-12 implies that you'll see a 2 once every 11 rolls.

[Vhlad]

2d6 gives you a probability distribution
2-12 gives you a min and a max. It is not accurate.

[Cyr]

They're not even changing the die system. They're just changing the explanation. They tell you how much damage it can do in the description, then put the dice info at the bottom.

It's not like they're using static damage or something.

They are dumbing down the game more and more. Nerfgate hits top end toons and makes the harder content in the game easier to complete with not so good toons. This is all about cattering to the crowd that yells "elitist" this and "elitist" that. This change makes descriptions longer and more wordy. It was also a massive waste of time considering the vast number of vague, incomplete, and incorrect descriptions in game.

[R0cksteady]

Yeah, but the dice info is still there.

[rest]

We absolutely want feedback on the change, but it should be done civilly, please. This is a community and a public space, so we'd appreciate it if people remembered that when providing feedback.

It's not that public. You have to sign in to see this stuff


I don't like it. Since I can't say you're dumbing it down.... I guess I would have to say that what you're doing is...





Yeah really I have no other way to say it. Dumbing it down to the lowest common denominator. You reap what you sow. You want to get people who are unable to understand the d20 system, well... you'll get em. Assuming you want them. I guess if they pay you money, you do want them.

[Mockduck]

I agree with folks who say that it's not about a description (honestly, that's a minor thing to me), it's about the underlying philosophy of what this change represents. To me it's a violation of the D&D license and I'm really upset by this. I realize I'm getting all nerd ragey over what ultimately has little impact in terms of gameplay, but shifting the idea of dice to be a second-class citizen in DDO feels wrong to the core.