Feedback: Guild Leveling

[MadFloyd]

Some more precise feedback for Madfloyd.

All my characters I brought over to Lamannia are level 19 or 20.

Running low level quests, I've seen several bags that have Heroic Deeds. I saw one chest with Heroics deeds in a rare chest in Kobold's New Ringleader.

Doing a run around the vale with both a level 19 and a level 20, I came across several chests with no renown.

Doing a small group through Subterrane (consisting of mostly level 20s), we picked up two bags that had renown. Between the 5 of us, we recieve one heroics deeds, a few tales of valor, and one person received an "impressive trophy" (the 500 renown item).

One group of high level people ran Coal Chamber, and got some renown. However, they only recieved renown from the various bags that dropped, and it was only some Heroic Deeds, and one Tales of Valor.

Hope that helps.

Very helpful, thanks.

[MadFloyd]

Madfloyd, perhaps you can answer something. You say it's supposed to be more effective to get renown for doing something your level.

Is this because doing something underlevel has a reduced chance of generating renown?

Or is this because doing something your level will generally award larger renown.

Rephrasing the question.

Is there an equal chance of pulling a heroic deed from a harbor quest for both a level 1 and a level 20?

Is the level of renown awarded based on quest/wilderness level?

No, there is not an equal chance. As a level 20, you should not be earning renown from a Harbor quest. Well, technically there might be a small chance (I don't have access to the data right now).

[MadFloyd]

I really think the issue is boiling down to not enough chance of renown dropping in chests and end rewards, and too high of a chance of renown dropping in bags.

As BronwynnBane says, kobolds just drop more bags, and we only see a large amount of kobolds at low levels.

On the surface it does appear that way.

One weird thing is that Kobolds do not drop any more bags than any other monster (or so I am told). You guys clearly think otherwise. Hmm.

[Towrn]

On the surface it does appear that way.

One weird thing is that Kobolds do not drop any more bags than any other monster (or so I am told). You guys clearly think otherwise. Hmm.

I think it's just that in most quests that have kobolds there are big bunches of them and it may *seem* like they drop more.

[Sleepingcap]

On the surface it does appear that way.

One weird thing is that Kobolds do not drop any more bags than any other monster (or so I am told). You guys clearly think otherwise. Hmm.

Kobold Assault dropped about.. 7 deeds for us on one run.
Butcher's Path has dropped a maximum of 4 deeds.
Considering that Butcher's takes an average of 4 minutes to complete - There is no reason why not to farm Butcher over and over again - one full group would earn an average of (assuming that 2 deeds are picked every run) 6*2*(60/4)*50= 9000 Renown per hour.

DDO Daily guild has currently (at the moment of my posting) 26 members online. That would mean (if they all would group up and do butcher's path non-stop for an hour - 26*2(60/4)*50= 39 000 Renown per hour.

There is something really wrong with those numbers. But until these get fixed - I am assuming that we are under the "Clever use of game mechanics" rule and are safe to proceed^^.
Lets face it - thats what renown on Lamannia is all about.

[Therilith]

Just to clarify: Will a level 5 char doing a level 5 quest earn as much renown as a L20 char doing a L20 quest?

[BronwynnBane]

OK, so we just did a 12 man Shroud completion and only 100 total Renown dropped from 2 Heroics from 2 chests. We could have gotten more killing Kobolds.

[Coldin]

Some more data for you Madfloyd.

Just took a 12 man group comprised of mostly level 19s and 20s and a couple 16s.

Out of 12 chests and the end reward, only 2 people pulled heroic deeds. So, 124 chest pulls, and 12 end rewards of fairly high level, and we only received 100 renown.

Even assuming some bad luck from chests, this seems very low to me. Is this the intended amount of renown for completing a Shroud, or would this be below the Dev's intended amount?

On the bright side, we didn't see much DPS lag, and Part 4 and 5 seemed to quite pretty quickly. I'll be interested to see if a higher DPS group will get more lag since we were a tad on the light side.

[Althotas]

No, there is not an equal chance. As a level 20, you should not be earning renown from a Harbor quest. Well, technically there might be a small chance (I don't have access to the data right now).

Well sir. I made a new pally just to test out the renown in the harbor running quests at level. Started on Korthos of course. Korthos island (all quests) on hard dropped zero renown of any sort ( as I suspected anyway).

Harbor quests. Did Butchers, Durks, Info is key, and bringing the light so far just to see what happens. Pally was at level 2 so I did the quests on normal. Treasure bags dropped in all of the harbor quests. ) renown found for an at level toon running the quests at level. ( Remember I ran a level 20 Barb thru on elite on Butchers and found 150 favor). I will continue to runn to see what develops but I suspect the renown is definitely sick as designed. No reason not to run nonstop thru the harbor quests on a capped toon to get the renown as it stands.

Did Kobolds new ringleader on hard at level 2. Got 50 renown from a sack drop from the kobolds and another 50 renown in a sack dropped by Madooroh.


Hope this helps somewhat

[dragonofsteel2]

Seems some respawn do not drop bags at all, Trogs in ADQ1 this was smart otherwise guilds would hit 100 in no time.. Second shroud, this one not so sure matter because tear of dhakaan did let bags spawn, but hell it was till slow. So not sure why was important to take bags out the shroud not like can killing faster makes come faster. ADQ1 totaly understand that one u could just sat there collected thousands of bags fast.

In my thoughts u need renown for beating quest.. Bags should be a kewl way to add to it. Though main way should be beating quest.

[dragonofsteel2]

By the way all the quest ran the best seems to be level 2 quest at the moment ).. Even if do adjust the drop rates of bags you still have the problem of quest dont have that many bags. So basicly limit the best quest to do the ones fast easy and have lots bags droping. unless have all monster drop bags at the same rate which does not happen.

[moops]

Solo'd Sins on my 20 Ranger on Normal, killed over a 100 mobs and not one bag dropped, 0 in any chests, and none for end reward. 20 min run.

Then went to Enemy Within, which usually drops a ton of bags, and it seemed to be dropping a lot less bags, I got one Heroic Deeds for 50 pts. 15 min run.

I then did Kobolds New Ringer Leader and got 2 bags for 50 each in 5 mins.

I then did Kobold assault on Hard and got 3 for 50pts each. 9 min
I did normal and got 5 for 50 Pts each. 9 min

No Heroic Deeds in any end rewards thus far.

I do think there should be a static reward just for finishing quests as well as dropping in bags from baddies and chests and end rewards.

[Sweetsoul86]

So far I've only run a couple of quests on Lamania, I ran a hard kobold assault and a hard butchers path both on my level 12 fighter, in KA I got 5 bags of 50 and butchers I got 4 bags of 50, nothing as end rewards or in chests.

Also, it seems like there in a exploit in the renown system that needs to be fixed before going live. I've heard of some guilds where a party will get together and each player will run a low level quest on a higher level toon and if they find a fair amount of renown all of the other players will go and collect the renown found in the quests of the other party members, then with someone holding the quest open they'll switch toons and go collect the renown again and keep switching toons for a quick pickup of renown. Obviously this was not what was intended for renown collecting and there needs to be a way to make sure that someone who wasn't in the quest when the renown dropped can't pick it up, just like when a chest is opened and a person isn't in the quests they don't get anything from it.

[moorewr]

/facepalm

[Angelus_dead]

One weird thing is that Kobolds do not drop any more bags than any other monster (or so I am told).

Well that's not true, because there are some categories of monsters who don't drop bags.

Monsters with bags: reptile, giant, goblin, orc, gnoll, elemental, undead, some demons.
Bagless monster: human, elf, dwarf, halfling, construct, monsterous humanoid, animal, beast, vermin, ooze, abberation, most outsiders.

Some exceptions:
1. A small number of creatures like oozes and mephits were given bags in the Bounty patch, and they haven't been properly removed, but that doesn't represent the general functioning.
2. Creatures from subterane or menechetarun might have bags added regardless of creature type.

Anyway, of the monster types that do have bags, kobolds are the smallest and thus the most likely to be encountered in a big group, while encounters with eg giants might be with just one. Another factor is that some lamannia testers are premium and can only get into free quests, which makes them more inclined to stick to harbor places with many kobolds.

[Angelus_dead]

Solo'd Sins on my 20 Ranger on Normal, killed over a 100 mobs and not one bag dropped, 0 in any chests, and none for end reward. 20 min run.

Then went to Enemy Within, which usually drops a ton of bags, and it seemed to be dropping a lot less bags, I got one Heroic Deeds for 50 pts. 15 min run.

Well there you're hitting the obvious inequity of creature types having bags or not. Sins of Attrition is mostly outsiders so there won't be bags (except perhaps from the small number of elementals/undead). Devils don't have a collectible associated with them. But Enemy Within is all undead (with a few aberrations and persons), so of course there will be more bags- especially as a few undead respawn indefinitely.

[lunaticcat]

On the surface it does appear that way.

One weird thing is that Kobolds do not drop any more bags than any other monster (or so I am told). You guys clearly think otherwise. Hmm.

They may not drop any more than other creatures, however in a run like Kobold assualt where you get 200 easy to kill monsters, the actual percentage of getting a bag, and a bag with renown go up significantly.

Also, I know its been said before but how about some Renown based on level of quest and completion? Ie 10 renown x level of quest (or 50) - this would make it more worthwhile for a level 20 to complete an upper level quest rather than farm Kobold assualt (where I can pull 200-400 renown per run)...

[dragonofsteel2]

New invasion 1 bag through whole quest, for some reason really lucky got renown from it, end reward 50 total 100... takes me about 30 to 40min to complete quest. Devil area no renown 4 bags all off trogs. Yet another uselss area to hunt renown.

[Solmage]

Chests and End Rewards should be decent sources of the renown objects, especially for high level, very long dungeons.

Any chance you can change things so that certain quests which are actually hard (some epics, elite hound, elite shroud, elite tod, to a lesser extent, elite vod) give a crapload more renown? Or better yet, let the last 'tier' only drop from such quests.

[dragonofsteel2]

Actually now that I think about it, my prior system would be too over powered, so how about this?

Very short = 0.25% exp
Short = 0.50% exp
Medium = 0.80% exp
Long = 1.00% exp
Very long = 1.20% exp

Solo = 0.50% exp
Casual = 0.50% exp
Normal = 1.00% exp
Hard = 1.15% exp
Elite = 1.40% exp

The base exp would be as Quest Level*5*Modifiers

so something like Tower of Despair would on normal = 126 clan exp per person(25) or on elite 193.2 per person(190), this put a incentive on higher more difficult quests to gain renown.(more so if the higher chests have a increased chance of dropping renown and higher amounts of renown)

*whoops, forgot to scale up the level of ToD for elite in that, fixed it*

This my idea of what was going to be coming, bags hunting seems so dumb. If they would scale the length and difficulted of quest. Then work a base of the level it would be great.

level 1= 25, level 2=30, 35, 40, 45, 50, ect...

Then scale the renown for the length and setting of the quest as something like above.