Combat Feedback for Update 5.

[Judo]

ill go ahead and say it


DoOOOoooooOMMMMMmmm!

[Tolero]

I hope you can get this out to Lamannia soon then

Well I'll put it this way, I'm in the middle of Lamannia release notes as we speak. We're going to be doing another wipe of characters on Lamannia to allow people to copy over their most recent characters, so I highly recommend hitting lamannia and getting into some combat, since it will have a two fold effect - feeling out the combat, and trying out some of the new guild-related features (will have a dev diary with more information about the guild part of things).

[Coldin]

I will add that in general, I like the dual strike ability, with or without the attack speed changes. I'd like to see combat styles that focus on one weapon not be so far behind TWF in terms of damage.

Well I'll put it this way, I'm in the middle of Lamannia release notes as we speak. We're going to be doing another wipe of characters on Lamannia to allow people to copy over their most recent characters, so I highly recommend hitting lamannia and getting into some combat, since it will have a two fold effect - feeling out the combat, and trying out some of the new guild-related features (will have a dev diary with more information about the guild part of things).

Yay!

[maddmatt70]

sigh your post acknowledges twf is getting a nerf and the best melee will be thf SOS users. In game in my observations it appears that thf SOS were doing just fine in competition with twf already. The second nerf appears to be to fighters. Oh poor Norg, my fighter ,has been in the doghouse for 2 years from mod 4ish to mod 9 it sure has been a fun 9 months after update 1 well I guess its back to the doghouse again.

[Bladedge]

Fighter Alacrity (capstone) now grants a +10% bonus to double attack with the main hand instead of a 10% speed increase.

Leave leave Fighter Alacrity capstone the way it is and introduce a second fighter capstone lets say Fighter Double Attack and have the players decide if they they want one or the other.

[Sirea]

So when is this supposed to hit Lamannia? I'm much better at actually trying things out than deciphering technically mumbo-jumbo. I'll base my final judgement on what I see on Lamannia.

EDIT:

Well I'll put it this way, I'm in the middle of Lamannia release notes as we speak. We're going to be doing another wipe of characters on Lamannia to allow people to copy over their most recent characters, so I highly recommend hitting lamannia and getting into some combat, since it will have a two fold effect - feeling out the combat, and trying out some of the new guild-related features (will have a dev diary with more information about the guild part of things).

OK, so maybe a week or two at the most?

[grodon9999]

I'd rather have the lag than these proposed changes. hell no. If you do this please give me Green Steel Deconstruction so I can un-gimp my toons from this horrible nerf. Do you want us to play anything other and THR barbs.

This is ********

[Darth_Sizzle]

The thing I love most about this game is the combat system. I do not think I'm alone in that. What you are proposing gives me a feeling of impending doom.

I don't understand why you are making this so complicated. Why not just make the one physics detection for both attacks and leave everything else the same?

[totmacher]

if you do do this (which it seems like you will), it would be nice to see these numbers reflected in the ddo character sheet, maybe with the glancing blow proc rate. the rules that govern your character shouldn't be hidden

[Daehawk]

That is correct.

That's pretty sexy.

[Dwarfo]

I'd rather have the lag than these proposed changes. hell no.

i agree with him.

[sigtrent]

Fantastic post! Really great detail and honesty.

Well, there are few things here....

1. Reducing lag by dropping the physical detection on the off hand
Great idea! I'm all for it.

2. Changing attack speed bumps to double hit chances.
Also a great idea, I'm all for it.

I can definitely see how this reduces lag and server load, and also makes for a better game feedback system. Great ideas. It also is a great mechanic you can use to target specific characters having issues or needing a boost. Be sure to be clear on stacking... use typed bonus names?

3. Nerfing two weapon fighting by changing the effective dps of the off hand attacks... aka GTWF was +100% swings and now is less than that...
Perhaps biting off more than you want to chew just now...

Yes there DPS difference is there, but it would be better to bring others up (sword and board especially) than to bring TWF guys down. Of course you expect opposition here no doubt. But its not like mobs don't have enough hit points, taking characters down a notch doesn't solve that much disparity. I find things decently balanced in game except for shield users who still have a hard time justifying life in a party unless they are coated in raid gear.

I'll take the nerf and smile, it doesn't bother me much personally but you know that folks invested a lot in these characters so be sure to make them feel like they are still getting value for their build choices.

[Gnorbert]

if you do do this (which it seems like you will), it would be nice to see these numbers reflected in the ddo character sheet, maybe with the glancing blow proc rate. the rules that govern your character shouldn't be hidden

This! absolutely.

[Ukenburger]

And of course this means Zeal, Fighter Alacrity, and Monk Wind Stance (Insight Portion) no longer help ranged attacks, meaning this partly nerfs ranged attacks. Can we expect double-shots (or heck, triple shots for the shuriken in wind stance) at a later date?

[JayDubya]

random thoughts:

• if skipping the physics check is the big resource hog, it seems like you could skip that, assume that you're still in range, and then handle the off-hand attack normally
• is this going to reduce the overall sequence for TWF to a max of 8 attacks per sequence, or would you have the theorhetical chance of 8 main-hand and 4 off-hand strikes (for a total of 12)?
• If you stay with your model, those proc %ages seem low - it seems to me the #s should start at 40% for no-skill, and build up from there
• There should be a S&B enhancement to increase double-strike as well, if you want to further improve the balance there

[Daehawk]

Well I'll put it this way, I'm in the middle of Lamannia release notes as we speak. We're going to be doing another wipe of characters on Lamannia to allow people to copy over their most recent characters, so I highly recommend hitting lamannia and getting into some combat, since it will have a two fold effect - feeling out the combat, and trying out some of the new guild-related features (will have a dev diary with more information about the guild part of things).

Very nice. Look forward to copying over my new updated characters over there to test all the changes...hmm if only it couldn't me as premium on Lam =( then I could test my rogue, paladin, wizard, and monk.

[Hutoth]

3. Nerfing two weapon fighting by changing the effective dps of the off hand attacks... aka GTWF was +100% swings and now is less than that...
Perhaps biting off more than you want to chew just now...

Yes there DPS difference is there, but it would be better to bring others up (sword and board especially) than to bring TWF guys down. Of course you expect opposition here no doubt. But its not like mobs don't have enough hit points, taking characters down a notch doesn't solve that much disparity. I find things decently balanced in game except for shield users who still have a hard time justifying life in a party unless they are coated in raid gear.

/signed

[countesscrow]

Eladrin,

I agree that under your new proposed mechanics would definately decrease dps lag. This seems like a good idea.

However, there is already a problem with monks trying to keep up with dps in raids. Currently the main reason a monk even gets invited to ToD raid is for the anti stun buffs for final fight.

I think that your proposed change would make the monk class even more ineffective in combat.

Wouldn't it be better to leave the actual swings per minute at the same place and just piggy back the roll off fo the main hand?

Why the change to damage also?


Chaotics

[Siskel]

So if I understand this correctly THF paladins will possibly see a dps increase with zeal? Not sure how zeal haste increases DPS by 10%, but zeal double strike looks like a straight 10% increase on main hand attacks. Zeal will benefit THF more than TWF. Am I seeing this correctly?

[Schmoe]

Fantastic post! Really great detail and honesty.

Well, there are few things here....

1. Reducing lag by dropping the physical detection on the off hand
Great idea! I'm all for it.

2. Changing attack speed bumps to double hit chances.
Also a great idea, I'm all for it.

I can definitely see how this reduces lag and server load, and also makes for a better game feedback system. Great ideas. It also is a great mechanic you can use to target specific characters having issues or needing a boost. Be sure to be clear on stacking... use typed bonus names?

3. Nerfing two weapon fighting by changing the effective dps of the off hand attacks... aka GTWF was +100% swings and now is less than that...
Perhaps biting off more than you want to chew just now...

This sums up my thoughts perfectly.