Ninja Spy II Feedback Thread:

[rimble]

You know, I guess the more I think about it the PrE is pretty attractive. Pure Monks, preferring handwraps, still get significant benefit from it, and other classes, like Rogue, could synergize with the Short Sword as a Ki weapon, making Monk 6 or 12 a possibly fun/attractive choice for a Rogue-ish multi-class.

Heck, I guess even a pure Halfling Monk could step down to 18 Monk/2 Rogue and enjoy a good 3d6 + 19 worth of Sneak Attack, triggered regularly via Radiance Short Swords and/or Unbalancing Strike:

1d6 + 3 from Rogue
2d6 from Ninja Spy
8 from Halfling Guilde
8 from Tharne's Goggles

[Darkrok]

The water striding ablity could pose some interesting things with lava. It says you will only take damage as if you were wading in it as opposed to swiming in it, which usually means a simple resist will negate the damage.

I see I'm not the only one that immediately thought this. You'll be able to run over most lava in the game taking no damage at all as long as you have resist fire and keep moving.

[Darkrok]

You know, I guess the more I think about it the PrE is pretty attractive. Pure Monks, preferring handwraps, still get significant benefit from it, and other classes, like Rogue, could synergize with the Short Sword as a Ki weapon, making Monk 6 or 12 a possibly fun/attractive choice for a Rogue-ish multi-class.

Heck, I guess even a pure Halfling Monk could step down to 18 Monk/2 Rogue and enjoy a good 3d6 + 19 worth of Sneak Attack, triggered regularly via Radiance Short Swords and/or Unbalancing Strike:

1d6 + 3 from Rogue
2d6 from Ninja Spy
8 from Halfling Guilde
8 from Tharne's Goggles

You'd actually have 4d6+19. Ninja Spy II is 3d6 total.

That's an average of 33 damage per sneak (4d6 averages to 14). Dropping the rogue 2 though only drops you do an average of 26.5 on a pure monk (3d6+16). That's a 20% decrease in damage from sneak attacks but you're gaining a ton staying pure including more damage on every hit, more ki generation, etc.

[timewalker]

You'd actually have 4d6+19. Ninja Spy II is 3d6 total.

and whatever bonus Ninja Spy III gives as well presumably as he is would be 18 monk and most PrE lines III is at 18, so it may go up even higher.......although going that far in monk the lvl 20 capstone/maxed fists would look very tempting to finish it.

[Drakos]

You know, I guess the more I think about it the PrE is pretty attractive. Pure Monks, preferring handwraps, still get significant benefit from it, and other classes, like Rogue, could synergize with the Short Sword as a Ki weapon, making Monk 6 or 12 a possibly fun/attractive choice for a Rogue-ish multi-class.

Heck, I guess even a pure Halfling Monk could step down to 18 Monk/2 Rogue and enjoy a good 3d6 + 19 worth of Sneak Attack, triggered regularly via Radiance Short Swords and/or Unbalancing Strike:

1d6 + 3 from Rogue
2d6 from Ninja Spy
8 from Halfling Guilde
8 from Tharne's Goggles

The Ninja Spy Sneek attack would be at least 3d6 (1d6 Ninja Spy I, 2d6 Ninja Spy II). Pluss whatever Ninja Spy III wil give.

[rimble]

They are not doing that. DDO's ninja gets shortsword because popular depictions of ninja involve shortswords.

Your conjecture is not more truthy than mine.

[Darkrok]

The Ninja Spy Sneek attack would be at least 3d6 (1d6 Ninja Spy I, 2d6 Ninja Spy II). Pluss whatever Ninja Spy III wil give.

3d6 more?

Let the speculation begin.

[Trillea]

You know, I guess the more I think about it the PrE is pretty attractive. Pure Monks, preferring handwraps, still get significant benefit from it, and other classes, like Rogue, could synergize with the Short Sword as a Ki weapon, making Monk 6 or 12 a possibly fun/attractive choice for a Rogue-ish multi-class.

Heck, I guess even a pure Halfling Monk could step down to 18 Monk/2 Rogue and enjoy a good 3d6 + 19 worth of Sneak Attack, triggered regularly via Radiance Short Swords and/or Unbalancing Strike:

1d6 + 3 from Rogue
2d6 from Ninja Spy
8 from Halfling Guilde
8 from Tharne's Goggles

Or alternately (12/8 ninja/acrobat using quarterstaff)

4d6+? from rogue
+ DEX mod from acrobat weilding q-staff
3d6 from ninja spy
8 halfling guile
8 Tharne's

while looking cool with the q-staff animation..

[rimble]

The Ninja Spy Sneek attack would be at least 3d6 (1d6 Ninja Spy I, 2d6 Ninja Spy II). Pluss whatever Ninja Spy III wil give.

Ah, indeed, an additional 2d6, so 4d16 + 19. Would that be more fun for me than ToD rings and/or Weighting things to death? Pick up some UMD, Open Locks...

*ponder*

[Angelus_dead]

Your conjecture is not more truthy than mine.

Except in that only one of them makes any sense.

[rimble]

Or alternately (12/8 ninja/acrobat using quarterstaff)

4d6+? from rogue
+ DEX mod from acrobat weilding q-staff
3d6 from ninja spy
8 halfling guile
8 Tharne's

while looking cool with the q-staff animation..

Yeah, just harder for that to trigger Sneak Attacks on it's own...guess you could get the Radiance/Unbalancing Strike off then whip out the Q-staff...might get kinda annoying tho...

Now to start the petition for Vertigo weapons to add to Unbalancing Strike DCs!

[rimble]

Except in that only one of them makes any sense.

Is someone playing the trumpet? I just hear that Charlie Brown WAH WAH WAH noise.

[Trillea]

Yeah, just harder for that to trigger Sneak Attacks on it's own...guess you could get the Radiance/Unbalancing Strike off then whip out the Q-staff...might get kinda annoying tho...

Not so much if you use a weighted 5% q-staff and Stunning Blow...

[timewalker]

Yeah, just harder for that to trigger Sneak Attacks on it's own...guess you could get the Radiance/Unbalancing Strike off then whip out the Q-staff...might get kinda annoying tho...

Now to start the petition for Vertigo weapons to add to Unbalancing Strike DCs!

well given rhals might has deception it might help get sneak attacks off......assuming you party/raid dosent nail you to a cross for using it in the wrong place

[rimble]

Or alternately (12/8 ninja/acrobat using quarterstaff)

4d6+? from rogue
+ DEX mod from acrobat weilding q-staff
3d6 from ninja spy
8 halfling guile
8 Tharne's

while looking cool with the q-staff animation..

Oh wait...you can't get both Ninja Spy and Acrobat...shoulda caught that before, too sleepy.

Good times.

Now someone else take the attention off of me...

[Eladrin]

well given rhals might has deception it might help get sneak attacks off......assuming you party/raid dosent nail you to a cross for using it in the wrong place

Deception, Bluff, and similar effects shouldn't flip bosses around anymore in U5.

[Trillea]

Oh wait...you can't get both Ninja Spy and Acrobat...shoulda caught that before, too sleepy.

Good times.

Now someone else take the attention off of me...

Aww lame! This woulda been a fun build...

[rimble]

Deception, Bluff, and similar effects shouldn't flip bosses around anymore in U5.

Well that's a good little tidbit.

[Trillea]

Deception, Bluff, and similar effects shouldn't flip bosses around anymore in U5.

*Happy dance!!* Now about not being able to take both PrEs mentioned here, anything being done about that? *hopes*

[Coldin]

Deception, Bluff, and similar effects shouldn't flip bosses around anymore in U5.

Cool, but have you looked into increasing the benefit of Improved Feint?