Rogue help

[KingOfCheese]

It can also affect sneak attacks and attacks against constructs later on besides just DD, and search.

INT does not affect sneak attacks. It does affect the assassinate ability DC. Except for very specialized builds--which few people choose to play and I can't recommend to a new player--boosting INT for the assassinate ability is not worth it.

I'm not sure what you are referring to about constructs. Is this referring to the wrack construct ability? If so, I do not know a single rogue that has found this ability useful.

[GhoulsTouch]

Please post what you think all of the starting stats should be for a drow Rogue, I would love to have more STR and more INT, but cant find a way to do it without sacrificing somewhere else, but if I could see your build maybe you would convince me.

Really Improved two weapon fighting was a let down for me. There are better feats a rogue can take to be better at what he does.

I actually went lower on Con and MC with barbarian to make up for HP and increased my fort save a ton not to mention other perks such as rage when I need more strength and faster movement.

I ate a plus 2 strength tome besides what is mentioned here. Ogre power is plus two, charisma and intelligence is plus one from items, and I don't have all the stat enhancements available to me at present.

I wanted a tough rogue that can do traps and stay in the fight. Eventually a 7 barbarian/13 rogue.

http://my.ddo.com/character/thelanis/kreecha/

[Loromir]

For a Drow Rogue (or any rogue) I recommend a fighter splash rather than Ranger because with Fighter you will get more HP's, and 1 or 2 feats, if you take 2 levels of ranger you will get two weapon fighting on the 2nd level which is good, but you can take that with the fighter plus at 2nd fighter level you get another feat. However if you are wanting to create a Ranger it is very effective to have 1 level of Rogue splashed on, but that benefit is mostly for UMD, although with a high enough INT you could get your trap skills up too, its just a lot harder to do.

I agree if you are only going to take a splash, fighter is a better choice than ranger. But my suggestion is to only take 1 or 2 levels of Rogue and the rest ranger. 19 Levels of Ranger will help you keep your rogue skills up, with Fighter not much hope of that. Won't you get more HP's & TWF skills with a 19/1 Ranger/Rogue than a 19/1 Rogue/Fighter? That was the OP's goal wasn't it? TWF with Rogue skills. I just think a 19/1 Ranger/Rogue would be a little more Battle hardy than a 19/1 Rogue/Fighter.

But like I said, I'm still new and learining.

[KingOfCheese]

Really Improved two weapon fighting was a let down for me. There are better feats a rogue can take to be better at what he does.

I actually went lower on Con and MC with barbarian to make up for HP and increased my fort save a ton not to mention other perks such as rage when I need more strength and faster movement.

Improved two weapon fighting is a prerequisite for greater two weapon fighting--which is generally considered a highly important aspect of maximizing damage output.

[Psyker]

I agree if you are only going to take a splash, fighter is a better choice than ranger. But my suggestion is to only take 1 or 2 levels of Rogue and the rest ranger. 19 Levels of Ranger will help you keep your rogue skills up, with Fighter not much hope of that. Won't you get more HP's & TWF skills with a 19/1 Ranger/Rogue than a 19/1 Rogue/Fighter? That was the OP's goal wasn't it? TWF with Rogue skills. I just think a 19/1 Ranger/Rogue would be a little more Battle hardy than a 19/1 Rogue/Fighter.

I mentioned using a ranger build with a rogue splash in case that was what the OP preferred, I chose the Rogue build because I like it better, (thats not to say its more powerful, its just what I like), I haven't rolled up a ranger toon in a long time, you should outline a build for the OP in case that is what he prefers.

[GhoulsTouch]

Improved two weapon fighting is a prerequisite for greater two weapon fighting--which is generally considered a highly important aspect of maximizing damage output.

By the time you can take either you can get your dex to 17 without eating tomes no matter all I am saying. I guess with little chance to hit with real damage you need all the hits you can get though. Outside of sneak attacks of course.

[KingOfCheese]

By the time you can take either you can get your dex to 17 no matter all I am saying.

Again. That's not correct.

The only thing that counts toward the 17 are level up raises (which should all go into STR in the build posted above) and tomes.

So even at level 20, a starting 14 will require a +3 int tome to get to the 17 needed to qualify for gtwf (even though the actual dex may well be 30+ at that point). +3 tomes cannot be counted on. Thus, a 15 should be the minimum a twf character--especially a new player--goes with.

[Psyker]

By the time you can take either you can get your dex to 17 without eating tomes no matter all I am saying. I guess with little chance to hit with real damage you need all the hits you can get though. Outside of sneak attacks of course.

It should also be noted that on a DROW going from 16 to 14 DEX will only give you 2 ability points, because DEX is one of the drows favored abilities, and to raise STR from 16 to 17 it takes 3 ability points, so even if we drop DEX 2 we can not raise STR 1.

[KingOfCheese]

I guess with little chance to hit with real damage you need all the hits you can get though. Outside of sneak attacks of course.

????

A starting STR of 16 (which the build posted above recommends) allows a STR-based rogue to be a rather big hitter--sneak attack or not.

Easy to reach str:

16 Starting
5 level ups to 21
2 +2 tome to 23
6 +6 item to 29
1 +1 fighter STR to 30
2 rage from spell, clicky or pot to 32

Not too difficult to get at cap with some grinding:

+3 exceptional (ToD rings) to 35
+1 +3 tome (added on to +2 from above) to 36
+1 Litany of the dead Abbot trinket to 37

Long grind

+7 STR epic item to 38
+1 +4 tome to 39

Boosts

Madstone to 41
Double madstone to 43
Harbor glove clicky to 49

[GhoulsTouch]

It should also be noted that on a DROW going from 16 to 14 DEX will only give you 2 ability points, because DEX is one of the drows favored abilities, and to raise STR from 16 to 17 it takes 3 ability points, so even if we drop DEX 2 we can not raise STR 1.

So I left charisma at 10.
Here is my drow barb/rogue. http://my.ddo.com/character/thelanis/kreecha/
Though having UMD capped for stat he is no specialist in it...nor do I feel needs to be.
Now tell me this guy doesn't have the DPS, the HP, and Trap skills.
Not the best equipped for optimum but I am fairly new.
If need be I can rage for higher Str and HP even for the toughies which is a plus since at the moment I do not have finesse, and am debating on whether to take it or not having my sight on dwarven axes.

Let it also be noted that intelligence is also a favored skill of drow, and essential to rogues. Which was kind of my point of lowering dex to raise intel.

[Razcar]

Ability points give you rogue or elven or halfling dexterity...
Do you play any of these races or even the rogue class?
I don't see how you couldn't know that.
You need 15 dex for TWF, starting with 14 dex you can qualify for TWF by level 2.

Lol.

+1 to KingofCheese for being such a gentleman, and a voice of reason against the other... voices.

[KingOfCheese]

So I left charisma at 10.
Here is my drow barb/rogue. http://my.ddo.com/character/thelanis/kreecha/
Though having UMD he is no specialist in it...nor do I feel needs to be.

That's a good approach. Rogues can use points everywhere--putting them in charisma tends to be too costly. Starting 10 works fine. You'll be able to get your UMD (if you are investing full levels into it) to 39 if you care to, to be no-fail on heal scrolls--even with the starting 10.

23 ranks
3 +6 charisma item to 26
1 +2 tome to 27
4 greater heroism to 31
2 luck (head of good fortune) to 33
3/5 (Delera necklace, Abbot gloves, or Titan gloves) to 36/38
1/3/6 Shroud charisma skill item (I, II, or III tier) to 37-44

[Hedorah]

thanks for all the replies guys - alot more response than I was hoping for ^_^ , but don't start fistfighting please
I have decided to try out the rogue/fighter build that psyker posted and see if this is something I like playing, so special thanks to him

[Delt]

http://my.ddo.com/character/thelanis/kreecha/

Let it also be noted that intelligence is also a favored skill of drow, and essential to rogues. Which was kind of my point of lowering dex to raise intel.

I'm not gonna bash your build, because I don't take any pleasure making fun of newbies. I just think you have a lot of opinions set in stone that you seem determined to explain to others...which is an interesting stance for someone so clearly new...

If I am not mistaken, you also have:

http://my.ddo.com/character/thelanis/aetheriala/

Any other builds, or just those 2?

[GhoulsTouch]

Edit

[GhoulsTouch]

I'm not gonna bash your build, because I don't take any pleasure making fun of newbies. I just think you have a lot of opinions set in stone that you seem determined to explain to others...which is an interesting stance for someone so clearly new...

If I am not mistaken, you also have:

http://my.ddo.com/character/thelanis/aetheriala/

Any other builds, or just those 2?

How about you asking the people I have played with how "Newbie" these builds have played out.
I have a pure cleric I have been playing too. http://my.ddo.com/character/thelanis/leaundra/

The only weak thing about Kreecha is his will save. See but I can admit that, I am not a fool. Fools overlook their shortcomings. If I can't play, know how to, or don't know what I am doing...let those who have partied with me answer for themselves.

I am a nice guy, I look out for everyone...except for when it comes to flamers who really don't need to be pointed out.
Aether is going to be a Rogue 12 Monk 7 Cleric 1 For Acrobat 2, Master of Wind,wholeness of body, and Devoted Trap Monkey thus by not being able to keep up with UMD I took a level of cleric so I wouldn't have to bother.

Taking a class for merely an extra feat say fighter, will give you a feat sure...but not 100 percent usage of divine wands which I figured out early enough to post and get flamed for and lo and behold here you are, lots of single levels of cleric/FS popping out.

A strong barbarian element on a rogue entitles improved trap sense just the same but also rage for strength and con, and overall higher hp...making up for a drows weakness. I wanted a tough guy that had a good sneak but was able to stay in the fight when confronted. So bash away.

[Lorien_the_First_One]

That's BS. Take the enhancement and look at your character sheet. Oh Amazing your dex just raised! Who would have thought?
I do this all the time when I don't take weapon finesse as a feat and want to use the kopesh or dwarven axe instead of rapiers and shortswords.
With people like you spreading all this disinformation no wonder there are so many poor rogues running about.
Even then you could up your dex later one point without relying on enhancements. You don't need a plus 3 tome.

You might want to pull back on your attitude. You are giving out wrong info, people are politely correcting you, and for that you are acting like a bit of a jerk. Try listening to what people are trying to tell you.