The new player disease

[donotdirect1]

So there is a thread on losing faith in Khyber pugs here, and I wanted to see what some of you think about the "disease".

I'm not completely new to mmo's. I've been playing AD&D and d20 for years. I have a general understanding of how things should work. I've obviously not been here long, and it seems that makes me a leper.

So I thought it was a good idea to let groups know if it's my first time in an area. That worked fine for lower levels, half of those players are perpetually new and never go into the pay to play only areas. It started about level 12, and now at 14 it seems my disease has grown. Some leaders have it posted clearly: NO NEWBIES. The kindest players who still refuse me just drop group. The kindest players that have no intention to teach just zerg ahead.

As a new player, melee dwarf with a 6 charisma and a measly +5 haggle item I really can't afford repairs at level 14. I was trying to save up for a weapon upgrade ML 16 from the pawn shop. So getting eaten up and spit out with near 3k plat repair bills isn't working for me.

So the answer is to get a guild, right? Well I have one, but they've changed up their regular group and leveled beyond my point. I have no intention of leaving the guild, and as a new player what vet guild is going to take me in? No one is the likely answer.

Also, in PuGs I have trouble simply bailing on anyone. Often I'd rather see a quest through, re enter if necessary, and work till it's finished. I've been in some great groups, with vets and TR's that have shown the way. But I'm looking for some help when I run into impatience, arrogance, pessimism and fear of my disease.

So, what's the solution for a group that has no intention to teach the quest? Am I supposed to study the quests online, when the maps are so confusing in the first place? Is there a good way to introduce myself as new to the quest without immediately putting the fear into everyone that my disease will fail us all?!

[Mithran]

In my (admittedly limited) experience with the newer players, I think your background will eliminate much of the disdain you may have seen other new players subjected to. As a new player though, I can give you a few tips:

1. Keep up. The first time you get lost and people have to come back to either rescue or lead you, irritation is inevitable. Stay with the group and you'll be in range of the heals, you'll see the tactics that are employed firsthand, and you'll be avoiding the inconveniencing of veterans that they find distasteful.

2. Search the Forums for builds, rather than using the templates for new players that DDO provides.

3. Find out where the quests are that you want to join, rather than joining and expecting someone to take you in hand. Once you request to join a group, you should be ready for the run.

[DoctorWhofan]

THere is no easy solutions. I personaly hang around at the lower levels to help out people, regardless of guild, skill or newness to the game.

But I am on Thelanis. I have some on Khyber, but I have a guild to run, peeps on THelanis to help and my own game playing, when I can get it in. I dunno if there is anyone on Khyber like me, but I'd bet there is.

[Khellendros13]

What is your character's name and level?

My guild's (Stormreach Thieves Guild/Phoenix Crusaders) have a wide range of levels running. All happy to help keen new players that play smart

Our play times might be odd for you, but I am on holidays so will be on a lot more now.

Look up Angryscrews / Splatsplat / Felgor (lvl 14 TR I am running a lot right now).

I can definitely help you out with some good Dwarven Axes

[Boldrin]

So there is a thread on losing faith in Khyber pugs here, and I wanted to see what some of you think about the "disease".

I'm not completely new to mmo's. I've been playing AD&D and d20 for years. I have a general understanding of how things should work. I've obviously not been here long, and it seems that makes me a leper.

So I thought it was a good idea to let groups know if it's my first time in an area. That worked fine for lower levels, half of those players are perpetually new and never go into the pay to play only areas. It started about level 12, and now at 14 it seems my disease has grown. Some leaders have it posted clearly: NO NEWBIES. The kindest players who still refuse me just drop group. The kindest players that have no intention to teach just zerg ahead.

As a new player, melee dwarf with a 6 charisma and a measly +5 haggle item I really can't afford repairs at level 14. I was trying to save up for a weapon upgrade ML 16 from the pawn shop. So getting eaten up and spit out with near 3k plat repair bills isn't working for me.

So the answer is to get a guild, right? Well I have one, but they've changed up their regular group and leveled beyond my point. I have no intention of leaving the guild, and as a new player what vet guild is going to take me in? No one is the likely answer.

Also, in PuGs I have trouble simply bailing on anyone. Often I'd rather see a quest through, re enter if necessary, and work till it's finished. I've been in some great groups, with vets and TR's that have shown the way. But I'm looking for some help when I run into impatience, arrogance, pessimism and fear of my disease.

So, what's the solution for a group that has no intention to teach the quest? Am I supposed to study the quests online, when the maps are so confusing in the first place? Is there a good way to introduce myself as new to the quest without immediately putting the fear into everyone that my disease will fail us all?!

What is your characters name? I'll send you a little bit of gear that should help you with a dwarven fighter. As far as help in quests, I have no lowbies, and am just trying to catch up myself after almost a year away. You'll find a lot of vets are more generous with gear and plat than their in game playing time.. I would fall into that category, lol. It's sad but true. When I'm on I don't like to have to take things slow unless it's a cakewalk quest that even going slow only takes a few more mins.

[cheever77]

What is your characters name? I'll send you a little bit of gear that should help you with a dwarven fighter. As far as help in quests, I have no lowbies, and am just trying to catch up myself after almost a year away. You'll find a lot of vets are more generous with gear and plat than their in game playing time.. I would fall into that category, lol. It's sad but true. When I'm on I don't like to have to take things slow unless it's a cakewalk quest that even going slow only takes a few more mins.

Thats the thing you will find more often than not OP. Is most want to get the most xp for the shortest time/quest.
I feel the same way at times but am happy to help someone out who is keen to learn. Have sent you a PM to let you know who to catch me on. Please post your toons names here and/or in the PM as I am an officer in a guild that is happy to help you out!!

Can get you some plat and may have some Dwarven axes laying round for you too.

[Corpsebride]

Spyderwolf has a great video walkthrough guide to a large number of quests, you might check it out if you have specific quests you need help with. The videos are much better than maps.

http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=189531

Also, the lost quest guide is a good source of written walkthroughs and tends to say if you need a balanced group, what buffs are helpful, etc. I use both resources when going through a quest I haven't done before, if I feel a need to prep for it.

http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=122192

Hope that helps some.

[k0ukla]

yes i have lost faith in them but there are still good ppl on the server, im at 14 now, and im new to all the quests well all the ones i havent done lol

but still find ppl who are willing to help along the way its been 2 bad pugs and it's just more irritating as a cleric when ppl blame u for a wipe.. dont feel like u cant pug (they aren't ALL bad) and if u have a good guild who are online then u wont need to pug... which is why i changed guilds to one who was online more...dont lose faith in the server totally just follow direction and u will be fine and let them know if u havent done it they will normally accept u and help u along the way

[vVAnjilaVv]

Solo and learn at your own pace is the best advice I can give any newer player.

It teaches u how to be more self sufficient, really points out the strengths and weaknesses of ur build, and allows u to go at your own pace to really explore and learn things.

You can also just lead your own groups and put in the LFM's, slow paced and want to explore....you'd be suprised how many people will join u.

Your not a leper, it's just most people who have been playing the game for years now have only one interest....getting to end game as quickly as possible.

And I know how everyone likes to argue that this is a group based game....but sorry...wakeup and get out of the past...they didn't implement scaling and casual for no reason. I'm not at all saying only solo......but I do endorse doing it to a certain degree. You definately want to still party, as a lot of high end content is very hard to do solo or just downright impossible without huge amounts of resources.

Also I do not endorse using walkthroughs at all unless ur really stuck...half the fun of the game is figuring stuff out.

[jamad1]

You should really try to find a person or group of people who are on at the same time as you. (Consistently)

My wife and I dont ever do pug's anymore at all. We found it to be more entertaining if you can laugh openly at your team mates mistakes( as well as your own) instead of slamming your head on the desk in frustration. You can get to know your group very well and its more rewarding.

Dang that sounds almost mushy.

[Corpsebride]

Also I do not endorse using walkthroughs at all unless ur really stuck...half the fun of the game is figuring stuff out.

I agree and disagree, which is why I linked the two threads above. For me personally, I like the thrill of discovery and tend to try things on my own first even if I can only manage to run it on casual. However, I can sympathize a lot with someone who doesn't feel capable of soloing and/or is nervous of joining groups when they haven't done the quest before. If feeling nervous about something you haven't done before or if not having information about a quest ahead of time is holding you back, then the walkthroughs are a resource that can be helpful. Not everyone is able to solo comfortably, especially if they are playing their first character through the game and don't have a ton of resources to fall back on and twink with.

[vVAnjilaVv]

I agree and disagree, which is why I linked the two threads above. For me personally, I like the thrill of discovery and tend to try things on my own first even if I can only manage to run it on casual. However, I can sympathize a lot with someone who doesn't feel capable of soloing and/or is nervous of joining groups when they haven't done the quest before. If feeling nervous about something you haven't done before or if not having information about a quest ahead of time is holding you back, then the walkthroughs are a resource that can be helpful. Not everyone is able to solo comfortably, especially if they are playing their first character through the game and don't have a ton of resources to fall back on and twink with.

Sure, of course....ultimately it's the individuals choice.....I personally find doing new unknown dungeons one of the best parts about DDO....and I still learn things about dungeons I have done numerous times that I didn't know before even to this day when I go back to level an alt.

But yeah...critical hits in lower levels alone are enough to make many people wary.

[jkm]

1. Keep up. The first time you get lost and people have to come back to either rescue or lead you, irritation is inevitable. Stay with the group and you'll be in range of the heals, you'll see the tactics that are employed firsthand, and you'll be avoiding the inconveniencing of veterans that they find distasteful.

need i remind you of your first time in coal chamber?

[Marr0w1]

I don't agree with people mistreating new players, but neither do I have a problem with it.. it just happens.

I think the reason your circumstance is unusual, is because it sounds like this is your first character on the server.

Most new players (admittedly without DnD experience) will end up rerolling at least 2-3 times when they start playing, so that by the time they get to levels 10+, they are familiar with most the mechanics and such.

[LightInDark]

Run the quest with the group and just stay with the group, this way you will get the gist of the quest, then go back and run on solo (if possible since not all quests can be soloed) , this way you learn the quest so next time you run with the group you will know what to do and expect. I find soloing the best way to learn any quest.
However some builds are harder to solo than others ... Use the group runs to fund repairs for solo expeditions, even if you dont complete the quest you still get what its about.

[donotdirect1]

Really surprised by the complete absence of flame. Seems like you understand this stigma and see how it can be tough.

If anyone would be kind enough to pass down some Heavy Armor or Daxes, as I'm a Daxe specialist (Oversized TWF) I'd love it. I'm Neutral Good btw (I know, I know, should have picked chaotic) and my name is Dwollin.

My gameplan is to grind out this character and TR instead of rerolling a bunch of times. Unfortunately I need to switch out another feat and used my free one already. I'm living with some of my mistakes, saved every shard I've found since the beginning. He survives allot more than some people expect, but he's not the most efficient at killing all types of things. With barbarian speed and +15% sprinters, and 5 expeditious retreats I can keep up often, until there is a winding hallway, pitfall, or some other strange twist that I got no warning about. I mean, no matter how fast you are you can get lost and quick.

Though my build isn't a "solo master" I do top myself off with cure mod wands between battles, and pick people up when they are down. Even though I'm a strength based melee I've pulled back, use my ranged weapon and helped the cleric top people off. I've even intimidated a group off of various targets, kited them around the room while I wanded people. Much more effective than I thought when I decided it was time to sacrifice myself for the group and ended up saving the day without a death.

I'll check out the links you've posted, thanks for all the help.

[Ashurr]

Can't help much with Dwarf specific items ( as I run an Elf only Guild I don't keep much in the way of non-elf specific gear) but as far as the heavy armor goes, catch me in the Wavecrest on Korthos every Tuesday between 3-5 P.M. EST. I give away as many nicely skinned sets of +1 thru +5 Fullplate as I can find. I'll either be logged as Caimbeul, or Connol.

[theb]

First, to address how to get you in shape for joining groups of veterans.

Their priorities are to 1) not lose from your joining, and 2) gain from your joining. 1) requires a) keeping up and b) not dying and giving an exp penalty.

1) How not to make other players regret having you in the party

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a) Keeping up

Have an item of striding and an item of feather fall, on different slots if possible, and have them in your hot bar for when they are not needed. The possible slots are boots and ring, and only one ring slot is swappable, so one slot used will be boots. Striding will not stack with haste, but you will want that ability active most times you are not hasted. A permanent feather fall item is preferable to a clicky but you also want the ability to hae striding and ff at the same time, so if your only permanent items of feather fall and striding are boots (generally easier to find than rings) carry a clicky as well.

The best striding boots available are 30% speed boost (haste has a 40% speed boost). Vanilla 30% boots are minimum level 13, so you will want to buy significantly cheaper 25% boots on the auction house or from a vendor for modified base price.

Haste clickies equip to the armor/robe slot and the glove slot and last for 36 seconds. Try to acquire some from brokers in the market place. Once again, putting them in the hot bar allows rapid switching back to other equipment. You will not be able to effectively swap from a haste robe to armor, but see notes on not dying below.

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b) Not dying

i) armor and fortification

When thinking about both character builds and equipment in rpgs, I always think about the toughest situation my build will be in, and how to survive and excell in that situation. I then take other situations as best I can. I would never take something like whirlwind attack (useful mostly to more quickly clear easy mobs): I would make a build designed for raid bosses and "struggle" with the trash. In DDO, this is relevant regarding armor. Unless your armor is very high, which it amost certainly isn't as a new player with severe financial difficulties, bosses and even most critters will whomp you on a roll of 2. Consequently, there is little downside to abandoning armor class for now and using robes. A Robe bought from the auction house or the broker in house K is your quickest and easiest path to 100% fortification, which will prevent you from being killed in a single critical hit from bosses. A robe will also be swappable with haste robes and robes of different abilities. Prominently, fear robes (of heavy fortification) are fantastic but not ideal if a sorcerer is trying to keep mobs in a firewall, so if you only buy one, let it be a guard (acid is best) of heavy fortification, but if you get two, wear the fear robe (of heavy fortification) most of the time.

The next easiest route to 100% fortification is the Nightforge Gorget from Relic of a Sovereign Past (level 12, free to pala). Turn in adamantine ore found in the mine to the smith in there for a 100% fortification neck item. Incidentally, "farming" this quest for ore to sell on the auction house may be the easiest way for you to make money now.

If you can hack it the Necropolis 4 Orchard (pay to play) is the place to get headgear you will have for a long while, the Minos Legens helm (100% fortification and a stackable toughness feat). Rares are "farmed" for 20 tapestries, which are exchanged for the helm. Groups doing this are blisteringly fast, so make your own and advertise it as "caravan/rats slayer". This means running only two rare spawns that are not bosses but swarms of mobs, you will get a lot of slayer count from this but will be ransacked on the chests before getting enough tapestries for the helm. If you are up to learning one fast, zerged route that is above your level, this is the best one to get a 100% fortification item as well as "farm" to sell the tapestries on the auction house.

Heavy fortification is not optional.

ii) Saves and resistances

Have a cloak of resistance. Have cloaks (or rings) of elemental resistance in your hot bar, particularly one of protection from acid to swap on when hit by an acid arrow. Protection from sonic is not necessary. Cloaks are one time expenses, unlike potions of resist. Have poison, blindness, fear, and disease immunity items swappable: cheap minimum level 5 ones can be bought from brokers in the marketplace. A stash of 10 cure poison potions can go a long way: one for the first time you are poisoned, and no more ever again on that quest since you know to use your resist item. Alternatively, clickies are one time expenses for curing poison, blindness, etc.

Deathblock is most easily acquired on a robe. It only needs to be swapped in when you face enemies who cast death spells. You should still request to be buffed with the death ward spell while wearing this.

iii) Hit points

You should have enhancements into constitution, the toughness feat, toughness racial and fighter enhancement, a +con item, and a +hp item. Don't put your hp item in a swap slot or you will lose the hp when you put it back on.

iv) Common sense

Don't pull any levers and don't melee exploding barrels. Do read on this forum to find out what people's complaints about new players are.

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2) Be useful

You can aid the party by using good tactics. Get on people's friends lists by excelling at your role. Know this though: you're not getting dropped from groups because people don't think you are good enough. People are concerned you will jeopardize the group.

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Second, finances.

Visit the brokers every time you can. Sort by price and scroll to the bottom. I found +7 armored bracers once, bought them at face value, and resold them for what seemed like a fortune.

When looking through the auction house, sort by duration and scroll to the bottom to see items with the longest time to go. These items are just posted and most likely to be bargains. Remember, the auction house is loaded with thing that did not sell. Bargains disappear quickly.

Sell trash to vendors for the most money, repair at vendors for lowest likelihood of equipment breaking, and look through vendors' item lists to find bargains to use or resell.

Rather than heal yourself with potions, use a cheaper hireling and buy wands to give to the cleric to heal you. Potions should be reserved for emergencies.

You mentioned having a +5 haggle item. A robe of command stacks with that for +2 more and costs about 25 plat on the auction house. Try to get a better haggle item from the vendor as well. Don't be afraid to ask a bard to give you greater heroism and a skill boost before selling/buying, or even doing the whole transaction for you themselves outright.

In a true disaster, swap out your most expensive equipment so it doesn't get damaged when you die. It is rare that death is inevitable despite your best efforts yet you have enough time to do this, but it happens.

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I just joined the game a few months ago on Orien. I had some of the same concerns as you so I did my best to mitigate them.

I started on the newest server, where there would be the most new players and the least expectation that everyone would be twinked.

After playing a few lowbie characters, I planned a healer out to level 20, who would be less gear reliant than a rogue (disabling ability gear dependent), tank (armor class based on armor quality), dps melee (whose damage is largely tied to weapon quality and owning a weapon appropriate for every situation), or offensive caster (ability to overcome spell resistance and resists tied to gear). It also made me most desired in groups and invited back even if I made severe mistakes, and let me always follow in quests I didn't know (read: all of them). I took rogue at level one and cruised through mid levels with evasion and maxed out UMD. The use magical device skill let me buy and equip cheap, powerful racially restricted items almost exclusively.

If you decide that the best course of action is to begin a new character (same server or not), I wouldn't feel compelled to build a rogue/umd/evasion cleric. The other option I would consider is a bard because although they are less desired in groups than clerics they have a high haggle. If you don't have 32 point builds, drow is probably best. If you do, a human gets human versatility to boost all skills (read: haggle) and has the most potential as a spellsinger haggle bard. Any bard build that appeals to you would be fine though, you don't really need to build the perfect haggle bard, a part-barbarian, rogue, fighter or whatever warchanter would still have a great haggle.

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More advice by me:

Financial: http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php...44#post2901344
Questing: http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php...98#post2903498

[Lo_Pan]

One quick pointer to all of that, fear is not an optional armor choice....In fact it tends to annoy most vets with half an ounce of sense to them. Even the squishy caster types tend to avoid 'fear' items like the plague. It really doesn't help when the fear that it creates can send the party in 3 different directions at once, all of them away from the clerics.

Primary tip to being helpful: Remember that the rest of the party depends on you to do a job...... Whatever that job is, learn it, gear toward doing it well and don't be stingy with your hard earned plat. If you find yourself lacking in DPS, find useful trade bait and go forth. (Please note that a +1 vanilla weapon is not trade bait, nor is a +1 bursting vanilla weapon!)

[fytorebus]

Everyone starts once, is new to quests once and has to adjust to these situations. I've been with kind veterans, telling that I'm a newbie and just trying to stick with the group. Most people do tell what to do and explain things with voice chat when it's available.

Primary tip to being helpful: Remember that the rest of the party depends on you to do a job...... Whatever that job is, learn it, gear toward doing it well and don't be stingy with your hard earned plat. If you find yourself lacking in DPS, find useful trade bait and go forth.

Learning to do what your character does best is an important thing to remember. Adjusting is the key to survival too. Remember your fortifications and get ready to rumble.