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  1. #1
    Community Member jhorn02's Avatar
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    Default Requesting critique on Wizard build

    Cynder was originally created on the day DDO launched back in 2006. This is my first True Reincarnate, so I'm excited about moving from a 28pt to a 34pt build. This build is pretty vanilla, but I want to make sure I'm not missing anything.

    Three of my questions are:
    1. Is there any good reason at end-game to have UMD on a warforged wizard with a low charisma? I can't think of any compelling reason, since you can easily get rez clickies now and I'll never be able to reliably shoot off heal scrolls. I have plenty of Skill points, but it seems like a waste
    2. I tossed in Empower as my last feat, but I'm not sure that I'm missing something else. Should I opt for a spell focus instead and if so, should I take it earlier?
    3. Is True Neutral still the alignment of choice for access to Litany and avoiding Evil-aligned damage?
    ---------------------------------------------------

    Edit: Updated to add end-game skills

    Code:
    Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.32
    DDO Character Planner Home Page
    
    Cynder 
    Level 20 True Neutral Warforged Male
    (20 Wizard) 
    Hit Points: 282
    Spell Points: 1755 
    BAB: 10\10\15\20
    Fortitude: 13
    Reflex: 16
    Will: 13
    
                      Starting          Feat/Enhancement
    Abilities        Base Stats          Modified Stats
    (34 Point)       (Level 1)             (Level 20)
    Strength             10                    12
    Dexterity             8                     8
    Constitution         18                    22
    Intelligence         18                    30
    Wisdom               10                    12
    Charisma              8                     8
    
    Tomes Used
    +1 Tome of Intelligence used at level 3
    +2 Tome of Strength used at level 7
    +2 Tome of Constitution used at level 7
    +2 Tome of Intelligence used at level 7
    +2 Tome of Wisdom used at level 7
    
                      Starting            Ending          Feat/Enhancement
                     Base Skills        Base Skills        Modified Skills
    Skills           (Level 1)          (Level 20)          (Level 20)
    Balance               1                 10                   10
    Bluff                -1                 -1                   -1
    Concentration         8                 29                   30
    Diplomacy             1                 10                   10
    Disable Device        n/a              n/a                   n/a
    Haggle               -1                 10                   10
    Heal                  0                  1                    1
    Hide                 -1                 -1                   -1
    Intimidate           -1                 -1                   -1
    Jump                  2                 12                   12
    Listen                0                  1                    1
    Move Silently        -1                 -1                   -1
    Open Lock            n/a               n/a                   n/a
    Perform              n/a               n/a                   n/a
    Repair                8                 21                   21
    Search                4                 10                   10
    Spot                  0                  1                    1
    Swim                  0                  5                    5
    Tumble                0                  9                    9
    Use Magic Device      0                 10                   10
    
    {\b {\ul Notable Equipment }} \par Minos Legens \par Rahkir's Sash \par  \par Level 1 (Wizard)
    Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Extend Spell
    Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Wizard
    Feat: (Selected) Toughness
    
    
    Level 2 (Wizard)
    
    
    Level 3 (Wizard)
    Feat: (Selected) Past Life: Arcane Initiate
    
    
    Level 4 (Wizard)
    
    
    Level 5 (Wizard)
    Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Maximize Spell
    
    
    Level 6 (Wizard)
    Feat: (Selected) Insightful Reflexes
    
    
    Level 7 (Wizard)
    
    
    Level 8 (Wizard)
    
    
    Level 9 (Wizard)
    Feat: (Selected) Mental Toughness
    
    
    Level 10 (Wizard)
    Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Heighten Spell
    
    
    Level 11 (Wizard)
    
    
    Level 12 (Wizard)
    Feat: (Selected) Spell Penetration
    
    
    Level 13 (Wizard)
    
    
    Level 14 (Wizard)
    
    
    Level 15 (Wizard)
    Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Improved Mental Toughness
    Feat: (Selected) Quicken Spell
    
    
    Level 16 (Wizard)
    
    
    Level 17 (Wizard)
    
    
    Level 18 (Wizard)
    Feat: (Selected) Greater Spell Penetration
    
    
    Level 19 (Wizard)
    
    
    Level 20 (Wizard)
    Feat: (Wizard Bonus) Empower Spell
    Enhancement: Wizard Master of Magic
    Enhancement: Wizard Improved Heightening I
    Enhancement: Wizard Improved Heightening II
    Enhancement: Wizard Improved Maximizing I
    Enhancement: Wizard Improved Maximizing II
    Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
    Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
    Enhancement: Racial Toughness III
    Enhancement: Racial Toughness IV
    Enhancement: Wizard Concentration I
    Enhancement: Wizard Lineage of Elements I
    Enhancement: Wizard Lineage of Elements II
    Enhancement: Wizard Lineage of Elements III
    Enhancement: Wizard Lineage of Deadly Elements I
    Enhancement: Wizard Elemental Manipulation I
    Enhancement: Wizard Elemental Manipulation II
    Enhancement: Wizard Elemental Manipulation III
    Enhancement: Wizard Elemental Manipulation IV
    Enhancement: Wizard Force Manipulation I
    Enhancement: Wizard Spell Penetration I
    Enhancement: Wizard Energy of the Scholar I
    Enhancement: Wizard Energy of the Scholar II
    Enhancement: Wizard Intelligence I
    Enhancement: Wizard Intelligence II
    Enhancement: Wizard Intelligence III
    Enhancement: Wizard Wand Mastery I
    Enhancement: Warforged Constitution I
    Enhancement: Warforged Constitution II
    Enhancement: Warforged Construct Thinking I
    Enhancement: Warforged Construct Thinking II
    Enhancement: Warforged Damage Reduction I
    Enhancement: Warforged Hardiness I
    Enhancement: Warforged Healer's Friend I
    Enhancement: Warforged Inscribed Armor I
    Last edited by jhorn02; 03-28-2010 at 01:20 PM.
    ************************************************** *******
    Cynder - 17(TR) Wizard | Airborne - 12(TR) Ranger | Scruffy - 17/3 Barbarian/Fighter | Rapscalian - 6(TR) Artificer | Revive - 11 Cleric

  2. #2

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by jhorn02 View Post
    Three of my questions are:
    1. Is there any good reason at end-game to have UMD on a warforged wizard with a low charisma? I can't think of any compelling reason, since you can easily get rez clickies now and I'll never be able to reliably shoot off heal scrolls. I have plenty of Skill points, but it seems like a waste
    2. I tossed in Empower as my last feat, but I'm not sure that I'm missing something else. Should I opt for a spell focus instead and if so, should I take it earlier?
    3. Is True Neutral still the alignment of choice for access to Litany and avoiding Evil-aligned damage?
    ---------------------------------------------------
    1. if you don't put the points in UMD, what's next skill? I think using raise dead scroll is better than clickie in cost and in inventory slots. As a WF, you may make a +5 cha skills with wis +6 and blindness immune item rather than a +6 cha skill with rez clickie as your mana item. besides, getting some chance to throw a heal scroll or at least using CSW could be handy for waking up an unconscious party member

    2. imho, in leveling up, there is no big deal to use empower or not. but for end game epic contents (that i suppose a TR caster should be aimed at), empower is a must.

    3. yes
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  3. #3
    Community Member Poffel's Avatar
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by jhorn02 View Post
    Three of my questions are:
    1. Is there any good reason at end-game to have UMD on a warforged wizard with a low charisma? I can't think of any compelling reason, since you can easily get rez clickies now and I'll never be able to reliably shoot off heal scrolls. I have plenty of Skill points, but it seems like a waste
    2. I tossed in Empower as my last feat, but I'm not sure that I'm missing something else. Should I opt for a spell focus instead and if so, should I take it earlier?
    3. Is True Neutral still the alignment of choice for access to Litany and avoiding Evil-aligned damage?
    1. The best reason for UMD on a wf wizard would be that you have plenty of skillpoints, which should be more than sufficient to max every skill that's even remotely useful to you. Remotely useful is the key though... restoration scrolls come to mind, and even though you'll probably not be subject to neg levels yourself (unless you use the DQ bracers), it's always nice to be able to help out some party members.
    2. In my opinion, Empower is a very important feat for a caster. Although it's not exacty SP-efficient, there are more than enough situations where the ability to take out an enemy as fast as possible has precedence over SP conservation.
    3. Yes.

    On a sidenote, if I had to do it, I would invest the two buildpoints you put into WIS in more STR. The basic reason is that I like to carry a lot of stuff with me, and 12 STR is not quite enough to get a basically limitless carrying capacity, while 14 is. Saving an item slot (or a spell slot if you instead cast Bull's on yourself) is more important than +1 will save to me. Obviously, this is only a very minor concern, and it may or may not apply to you, depending on how much stuff you have in your inventory.

  4. #4
    Community Member jhorn02's Avatar
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    Default

    Thanks to both responders so far.

    I wasn't considering Restoration scrolls and such. I guess that is more helpful than putting points into Repair and Swim . I moved skill points to max out UMD as well.

    I'm still debating moving two points from Wis to Str. There are only a few Will saves for Warforged that aren't handled by their immunities, but +1 to Will saves when I need it is hard to sacrifice just to carry more stuff. You can carry several sets of Full Plate with a 12 strength.

    I'll hang on to Empower as my final feat unless I hear a good argument for taking it earlier or exchanging for another one.
    ************************************************** *******
    Cynder - 17(TR) Wizard | Airborne - 12(TR) Ranger | Scruffy - 17/3 Barbarian/Fighter | Rapscalian - 6(TR) Artificer | Revive - 11 Cleric

  5. #5
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    Woot my first post on the forums!!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by jhorn02 View Post
    Cynder was originally created on the day DDO launched back in 2006. This is my first True Reincarnate, so I'm excited about moving from a 28pt to a 34pt build. This build is pretty vanilla, but I want to make sure I'm not missing anything.

    Three of my questions are:
    1. Is there any good reason at end-game to have UMD on a warforged wizard with a low charisma? I can't think of any compelling reason, since you can easily get rez clickies now and I'll never be able to reliably shoot off heal scrolls. I have plenty of Skill points, but it seems like a waste.
    The exact question I had about umd and a pure wiz WF!!

    My build is a 32-point build

    str: 10
    dex: 8
    con: 18
    int: 18
    wis: 10
    cha: 6

    My questions is what skills do i want. It looks to me like you are using haggle and diplomacy??

    I so far i'm thinking:

    concentration (obviously)
    balance
    listen
    search
    tumble
    umd

    could someone critque those and tell me why some of my choices are newbish Perhaps tumble is idiotic *shrug*.

    Thanks everyone!

  6. #6
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    Also what enhancements were you thinking?

    Thanks again!

  7. #7
    Community Member jhorn02's Avatar
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    I added my enhancements to the original post. You'll see that I spread the points around a bit rather than maxing out any one area.

    With a +2 Int Tome, I will be able to max all the following skills:
    Concentration
    Balance
    Diplomacy
    Haggle
    Jump
    Tumble
    UMD

    I also dropped a few points into Repair and Swim. (I had nothing else worth putting them into)
    ************************************************** *******
    Cynder - 17(TR) Wizard | Airborne - 12(TR) Ranger | Scruffy - 17/3 Barbarian/Fighter | Rapscalian - 6(TR) Artificer | Revive - 11 Cleric

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by jhorn02 View Post
    I added my enhancements to the original post. You'll see that I spread the points around a bit rather than maxing out any one area.

    With a +2 Int Tome, I will be able to max all the following skills:
    Concentration
    Balance
    Diplomacy
    Haggle
    Jump
    Tumble
    UMD

    I also dropped a few points into Repair and Swim. (I had nothing else worth putting them into)

    Whoops i missed the enhancements at the bottom Thanks for the advice. I realize you were asking for it, but you made almost the exact wizard I am working on. I was actually making an attempt at the build in the planner and came here looking for more answers.

    Thanks again,

    Deratech

  9. #9
    Community Member jhorn02's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deratech View Post
    Woot my first post on the forums!!!!



    The exact question I had about umd and a pure wiz WF!!

    My build is a 32-point build

    str: 10
    dex: 8
    con: 18
    int: 18
    wis: 10
    cha: 6

    My questions is what skills do i want. It looks to me like you are using haggle and diplomacy??

    I so far i'm thinking:

    concentration (obviously)
    balance
    listen
    search
    tumble
    umd

    could someone critque those and tell me why some of my choices are newbish Perhaps tumble is idiotic *shrug*.

    Thanks everyone!
    Your ability points are well placed.

    There is no valid reason in DDO to put points into Listen. You'll find Jump and Balance to be far more important. Jump is obvious. Balance lets you get up faster after getting knocked down.

    Also, by the time you reach higher levels, you won't have a high enough search to do much. It will help in the first few levels, but feel like a waste after that.

    Tumble is a personal choice. If you like the Shift-strafe maneuver, go for it. I use it sometimes in lieu of Jumping around after I drop a firewall.
    ************************************************** *******
    Cynder - 17(TR) Wizard | Airborne - 12(TR) Ranger | Scruffy - 17/3 Barbarian/Fighter | Rapscalian - 6(TR) Artificer | Revive - 11 Cleric

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