Picky

[Kaeldur]

(sorry if this is a bit large, but I am actually asking for advice)
I have been thinking about a "heavy pick" focused melee build while playing the game, having seen a few enhancements and stuff. My first idea was a pure barbarian, but then I discovered the "Critical Rage" line was dropped. Still just the thought of having a x6 multiplier is absolutely insane... I then thought how could I effectively TWF, so I thought taking some ranger levels to get ITWF without having to spend points in DEX. But I was brought back to the pure barb idea because Death Frenzy (FBIII) can increase by 1 your threat range and FBIII itself increases the multiplier. I finally refined to 18brb/2fgt and am in doubt between several class splits (or pure). I have listed the possible splits and their respective pros & cons (in my opinion). Keep in mind I would like to TWF with picks...

20 Barbarian
Pros: Mighty Rage, Capstone
Cons: 7 feats, needs 15 DEX (and +2 tome for ITWF/GTWF)

18 Barbarian / 2 Fighter
Pros: 2 extra feats, fighter haste (15%), Fighter strength (+1 STR)
Cons: Misses mighty rage (-2 STR & CON), misses capstone (-2 STR), needs 15 DEX (and +2 tome for ITWF/GTWF)

18 Barbarian / 2 Ranger
Pros: Free TWF, no need to spend points in DEX (more STR & CON)
Cons: Misses mighty rage (-2 STR & CON), misses capstone (-2 STR), lowest attack speed

12 Barbarian / 6 Ranger / 2 Fighter
Pros: Free ITWF, Ram's Might, no need to spend points in DEX (more STR & CON), Tempest I, 2 extra feats, fighter haste (15%)
Cons: Misses mighty rage (-2 STR & CON), misses capstone (-2 STR), misses FBIII (consequently death frenzy)

[Goldeneye]

My advice: stay pure. Barbarian capstone will most likely outweigh whatever 2 of another class can offer.

In terms of 12/6/2 build: FB III is a HUGE increase in damage, especially for a heavy pick wielder.

Small note: You will want TWF, ITWF, and GTWF:

2 ranger gives you TWF
6 ranger gives you TWF and ITWF

you will still have to meet the dex requirement for Greater Two Weapon Fighting.

[FauxSho]

G***

tee hee

OMGTWFBBQ!

[Kaeldur]

My advice: stay pure. Barbarian capstone will most likely outweigh whatever 2 of another class can offer.

In terms of 12/6/2 build: FB III is a HUGE increase in damage, especially for a heavy pick wielder.

Small note: You will want TWF, ITWF, and GTWF:

2 ranger gives you TWF
6 ranger gives you TWF and ITWF

you will still have to meet the dex requirement for Greater Two Weapon Fighting.

Yes... The two worst splits were with ranger levels, they were discarded, I just listed them to illustrate how I reached the other splits. The fighter split was taking into account GTWF. My greatest fear is the lack of feats staying pure barb rather than going 2 fighter.

Considering a dwarf build (I don't have WF), what would your ability scores be? I thought 18 STR, 15 DEX, 17 CON (32 pt build). Would you consider any other race instead (if so, why)?

[sigtrent]

Considering a dwarf build (I don't have WF), what would your ability scores be? I thought 18 STR, 15 DEX, 17 CON (32 pt build). Would you consider any other race instead (if so, why)?

Human gets a free feat, can bump Str once, but your con would take a hit. The extra feat may make pure barbarian work better feat wise. The human healing enhancement may well be better than the extra con in the end. Dwarves do have the nice spell save bonuses though.

Those stats look good though.

[Goldeneye]

IMO: Dwarf only makes sense if you are going Dwarven Axe, or Greataxe.
Also: As a dwarf or wf, you only have 7 feats:

1 - TWF
3 - Power Attack
6 - Cleave
9 - Improved TWF
12 - Improved critical
15 - Greater TWF
18 - Stunning Blow (since you are using a weapon that relies on crits for it's DPS, Stunning Blow is a no-brainer over Toughness)

Human gives you the extra feat, and would allow you to pick up Toughness... so you would actually end up having more HP then a dwarf.

btw - make Earthgrab GS picks ASAP!

[unbongwah]

18 Barbarian / 2 Ranger
Pros: Free TWF, no need to spend points in DEX (more STR & CON)

Ranger 2 only gets you TWF; you would need to get ITWF & GTWF separately, which still require DEX 17. The only way to bypass the TWF DEX req entirely is to go ranger 11. But bear in mind Tempest I requires Dodge / Mobility / Spring Attack which require DEX 13.

[Kaeldur]

Ranger 2 only gets you TWF; you would need to get ITWF & GTWF separately, which still require DEX 17. The only way to bypass the TWF DEX req entirely is to go ranger 11. But bear in mind Tempest I requires Dodge / Mobility / Spring Attack which require DEX 13.

Maybe I shouldn't have posted my primary thoughts... It's just there to illustrate where I began (I didn't even spend 10 minutes thinking on ranger) and the advantages/disadvantages. My real doubt lies between Brb20 or Brb18/Fgt2. I think the first will be better, belief that has been reiterated by some replies.

IMO: Dwarf only makes sense if you are going Dwarven Axe, or Greataxe.
Also: As a dwarf or wf, you only have 7 feats:

1 - TWF
3 - Power Attack
6 - Cleave
9 - Improved TWF
12 - Improved critical
15 - Greater TWF
18 - Stunning Blow (since you are using a weapon that relies on crits for it's DPS, Stunning Blow is a no-brainer over Toughness)

Human gives you the extra feat, and would allow you to pick up Toughness... so you would actually end up having more HP then a dwarf.

btw - make Earthgrab GS picks ASAP!

Hmm. Interesting point you make here. I was almost sure for going Dwarf, now you put me back into a stalemate. Stunning Blow really helps indeed! The problem with human will be my saving throws. As a dwarf I can dump dex and wis without worrying too much. As a human it turns on the yellow light... DPS isn't too good while you're incapped or dead.

[Goldeneye]

Dwarf vs. Warforged vs Human is an interesting argument based on who you talk to.

I couldn't care less about Dwarf saves. IMO: end-game, for a fighter, saves can be ignored.
My level 20 WF fighter could care less about saves. Get the right items, and you don't need to adjust your build.

Human

+1 STR / +1 CON (AP)
Extra feat (toughness)
more skill points
healing amp

Dwarf

+con
Tactics!
saves stuff :P

WF

Power attack +3 damage
healed by arcanes
immunities
Tactics!

In an argument against 18/2 fighter - what 2 feats would you choose? Barbs are short on feats... but they have just enough to get the job done.

[Kaeldur]

I have only reached lvl 18 up to now. On a fighter build but I have good saves and I thank myself for investing in saving throws. Why do you not care about saves? I'm interested in learning about that, mainly because I have appreciated all your replies, they helped me a lot and I like the way you think.

[Goldeneye]

I have toons with saves in the 30's, and I have toons whose saves are barely double digit. In my opinion, many people disagree with me, in end-game quests, through buffs, and items.... I don't have problems saving.