Point Blank Shot Needs A Boost!

[Turial]

PBS isn't fine because its bonuses are slight and difficult to benefit from.
...

If there was a melee feat that gave +1 Attack and Damage would you say the same thing?

How about if you had to be in sneak mode to gain the bonus?

[Turial]

Ranged RoF = S&B swing-speed + Manyshot = fine

So are you saying its only fine if manyshot brings ranged ROF up to S&B ROA or it will still only be fine when manyshot can be used?

[Aesop]

PBS and the sneak attack range are too short as it stands. I've been caught in cleaves while standing at ranged sneak attack range.

It should be increased. Not a huge amount but, as it is now, its too close. If its 30 ft then they must be measuring from far sides of the target to the far side of the character.

Aesop

[Angelus_dead]

in DDO it is fairly difficult to clearly identify the 30 ft. mark, and even more so to remain both within that range and outside of melee range of many monsters

Incorrect. It is easy for a moderately competent player to be within that range, and indeed it happens without really trying. To stay outside of that distance would cause typical dungeon terrain to obstruct your line of sight.

To double the distance would make the PBS bonus something trivially available in every combat except true long-touch sniping.

Have you ever tried playing a ranged character with some sneak attack?

Yes, that's how I know how easy it really is.

[Turial]

Incorrect. It is easy for a moderately competent player to be within that range, and indeed it happens without really trying. To stay outside of that distance would cause typical dungeon terrain to obstruct your line of sight.
....

Correct me if I'm wrong on this one. The haste circle is roughly the PBS/ranged sneak attack distance.

[sephiroth1084]

Incorrect. It is easy for a moderately competent player to be within that range, and indeed it happens without really trying. To stay outside of that distance would cause typical dungeon terrain to obstruct your line of sight.

Simply being within range isn't the issue, but being both outside of melee range and within range.If you're going to stand close enough for the monsters to hit you, why bother using a bow?

And if you've no problem dancing around at the 30 ft. mark all the time, then more power to you, I'll admit your superior prowess in this regard. I, for one, cannot maintain that kind of dual proximity and distance with any regular success.

Correct me if I'm wrong on this one. The haste circle is roughly the PBS/ranged sneak attack distance.

Yes.

[Bacab]

wow that is really small...the 30 feet equaling the Haste Circle.

So PBS is worthless...just like MANY other Feats that are PRE-REQS for better feats. Do you think I wanted to take Weapon focus on my Bard? Do you think every Tempest RNG really wants to HAVE to take DODGE MOBILITY SPRING ATTACK? Think every every Barb wants to take Cleave? I get it...some feats suck ass. Heck I have even known people to not take certain feats early on (looking at you CLeave) then take way later to open up a PrE.

Baisically this how DnD works...

Fighter gets no job abilities, but gets a zillion feats. You get to make your toon how you want to.

If you level any Class OTHER than Fighter...you are "Feat Starved". Except certain classes get to bypass Stat requirements. You can have a 18 STR/8 DEX RNG with "Superior TWF (Tempest 3)". Think about that for a second. Since AC ends up being a wash on about 80% of the builds...you can consider DEX a dump stat for most builds...except that they need the pre-reqs for 2WF...so they need usually a 15 Base dex (then eat a +2 tome).

Now for PBS, look at what a RNG gets for FREE as far as that goes. In fact just look at "Bow Strength". A ranger gets this for free. WHile a FTR has to "burn" 3 feats to get it. Its the way the game is balanced man.

If it was not this way I would make the Following build.

20 Barb with the following feats.

1. Greater 2 Handed Fighting

3. Great 2 Weapon Fighting

6. Superior Weapon Spec Slashing

9. Power Attack

12. Toughness

15. Stunning Blow

18. Superior Weapon Focus Slashing


Now as you can see...this would be BROKEN...

you have to have those non-optimal feats as pre-reqs. Though I will admit...this would be a fun build to play lol.

[Ganolyn]

Originally Posted by Turial
Correct me if I'm wrong on this one. The haste circle is roughly the PBS/ranged sneak attack distance.

Yes.

There is no way that is 30'. That circle can't be more than 10' in diameter the way they draw it in proportion to your character.

[Kyrn]

There is no way that is 30'. That circle can't be more than 10' in diameter the way they draw it in proportion to your character.

Is that in halfling feet or warforged feet?

[Ganolyn]

There is no way that is 30'. That circle can't be more than 10' in diameter the way they draw it in proportion to your character.

I take it back. I just went in and did a proportional measurement. At full extended zoom out my elf was 3" tall. I measured the diameter of the haste circle from top down view and the inside diameter was about 12". Assuming my elf is about 6' tall the diameter of the circle is about 20'-30'. So if they are using the radius of that to indicate PB/SA range it is only half (or less) of what it should be.