Sorcerer Tips

[Visty]

I've done it all too and WF is good but if you are a min maxer,they just don't cut it.Even with litany and almost every other caster stuff, your wail won't land in amrath.A human sorc can get to 39 umd without any effort.That's 100% on heal and with the concentration it's just as reliable as the spell (not as fast of course...) and leaves your sp pool for what it really is,destroy everything you come across.

Spell pen?Sure go with no spell pen you'll only see a blue shield on every devil orthon and every other mob on anything higher than casual / normal.UMD is superior since it allows you to bypass every requirement in game for weapons or equipment.


Please stop saying what you think and making it sound like the only truth because anyone that has played half as much as you will know it's all fluff.

You're right about dc being 1 difference,drow would have 2 with WF,not human.

In any case,think 1dc doesn't make a difference?That would make the napkin useless now wouldn't it?

As a 20 wf you will NEVER succeed with just wail in Amrath.

As a 20 human you will sometimes succeed with wail

Both without energy drain tested extensively life 2 was WF life 3 human.

feel free to deny this but it's actually true.

WF have one purpose - Nukers able to withstand damage.Any time you're talking dc,they aren't there.

and if realistically you would change +4 tome to +3 human would effectively be 2dc ahead of wf.

we are getting somewhere

also its wrong that a wf will never succeed with wail.
i have a lvl19 wizard who is missing like 6 int for max, thats 3 less then your wf and he indeed does succeed
also my 38wis cleric has like 50% successrate in amrath if not more
i just think your perception is flawed

[Mentor61]

we are getting somewhere

also its wrong that a wf will never succeed with wail.
i have a lvl19 wizard who is missing like 6 int for max, thats 3 less then your wf and he indeed does succeed
also my 38wis cleric has like 50% successrate in amrath if not more
i just think your perception is flawed

It could be but I have all the sorcerer gear except for upgraded ring sets and shroud exceptional.
Litany,check
Abbot Staff - Check
Skill focus necro - check

Had same gear layout as 2nd life sorc (wf) and dc sucked.To think 1 dc doesn't make a difference is wrong.Just like 1 umd makes a huge difference.


And can we stop comparing a wizard to a sorc for dc purposes?It just doesn't make any sense.If comparing races at least,stick to the same classes.

[Visty]

And can we stop comparing a wizard to a sorc for dc purposes?It just doesn't make any sense.If comparing races at least,stick to the same classes.

rofl

tell me what wizard 19 gets dc wise what sorcs dont get
exactly, nothing

i even mentioned his lvl so you dont come with the capstone

[Mentor61]

rofl

tell me what wizard 19 gets dc wise what sorcs dont get
exactly, nothing

i even mentioned his lvl so you dont come with the capstone

Visty,I just missed he was 19.In the end who cares?We can both be right.i am right for the fact nobody has +4 tomes or just about

And you'd be right if everyone had +4 tomes.

So it's a wash.At least i can admit to where i was wrong - even if only partially wrong.


I also like that you left out where you make no sense IE 1 dc doesn't matter but that's ok,You just wanna argue the point you could possibly get away with.

[Siskel]

So I have been trying to follow the thread. Max difference in DC for Sor depending on race is 2DC? So that equates to 10% difference in effectiveness. Assuming you can land the spell, but don't rolls of 1's always fail? Does that 10% really make it so WF can't use spells with a DC? Now if we are talking +30% difference then I can see where that will effectively push a reasonable success below 50%. I imagine what we really are arguing is the difference in DC between a human/Drow with some of the best DC gear to a WF sor with average DC gear. Given all things equal though we can assume a difference of 10% which in my opinion is a small sacrifice for the benefits of being WF. Not trying to stir the pot more, but I just don't see how a 10% penalty is making the WF gimp with wail and such.

[vVAnjilaVv]

I would have to say as far as survivabilty goes the WF'ed is superior on all fronts....however there also was a thread written when Amarath first came out showing how a 1-2 DC difference ended up meaning a lot more than a 5-10% difference in spells landing.

And u can say whatever u want about ur UMD and Heal scrolls, but there is just no way at all that a UMD'ed heal scroll is going to save ur life like a quickened reconstruct, especially under heavy fire when ur concentraion check is going to fail ocassionally.....and it will fail.

So I guess the real question is, would you rather have a higher probabilty of ur spell landing or a no fail life saving recon?

I guess it depends on ur playstyle and what u like to do...I just think it's a joke that people are even comparing a UMD'ed Heal scroll to a WF'ed cast Reconstruct.....especially with quicken...there simply is no comparison....Recon wins...end of story.

BTW...My level 20 Sorc is a drow......so this is not a biased view. It's true I can more easily get a higher DC, but it is also true that I can more easily die

[Mentor61]

I would have to say as far as survivabilty goes the WF'ed is superior on all fronts....however there also was a thread written when Amarath first came out showing how a 1-2 DC difference ended up meaning a lot more than a 5-10% difference in spells landing.

And u can say whatever u want about ur UMD and Heal scrolls, but there is just no way at all that a UMD'ed heal scroll is going to save ur life like a quickened reconstruct, especially under heavy fire when ur concentraion check is going to fail ocassionally.....and it will fail.

So I guess the real question is, would you rather have a higher probabilty of ur spell landing or a no fail life saving recon?

I guess it depends on ur playstyle and what u like to do...I just think it's a joke that people are even comparing a UMD'ed Heal scroll to a WF'ed cast Reconstruct.....especially with quicken...there simply is no comparison....Recon wins...end of story.

BTW...My level 20 Sorc is a drow......so this is not a biased view. It's true I can more easily get a higher DC, but it is also true that I can more easily die

The debate is not about umd versus reconstruct if you bothered to read it.And with stoneskin and displacement up,i don't see how and where popping a heal scroll is difficult.In fact my human sorcerer sucks so much he routinely soloes amrath quests.


And if your spell lands and kills,healing is not as necessary.

[bashemgud]

As a pure evoker, you won't need spell pen and necro focus. I don't use wail or FoD, and don't care about debuffs. But I do care about my DC, I will take evocation focus if possible and max cha. I don't wail or FoD devils, I burn them to the ground using lightning ^^

Wiz play vs sorc play, simple. This is 1 playstyle only, so take this into consideration.

[AtomicMew]

The debate is not about umd versus reconstruct if you bothered to read it.And with stoneskin and displacement up,i don't see how and where popping a heal scroll is difficult.In fact my human sorcerer sucks so much he routinely soloes amrath quests.


And if your spell lands and kills,healing is not as necessary.

^Definitely agree with the above. Quickened reconstruct is highly overrated and the only time that you need it is if you're tanking. And you should really only be tanking if you're CON based. If quickened reconstruct were so important, you'd hear wizard PM's lamenting about how much they die. Of course, you don't because PM's are tough sons of xyzzy. The spike healing is simply not necessary on an arcane with all the passive and active damage mitigation they get.

Also, for the person saying that the difference is only 1 DC ; no, not really, that's BS. Under ordinary circumstances, it's actually a difference of +3, since human ends on an even and WF ends on an odd, and humans have room for Arcane initiate (or at least an extra spell focus).

House D pots you say? If you want to be ridiculous, sure. Good luck wasting time farming collectables. But then, you also forgot Abishai cookie set, which puts WF back on odd.

[Urjak]

rofl

tell me what wizard 19 gets dc wise what sorcs dont get
exactly, nothing

i even mentioned his lvl so you dont come with the capstone

loooooooooooool lvl19 wizard either gets +2DC in one school and +1 DC in another (if he goes AM), or +2 DC to necromancy and +1DC to all other schools if he goes PM and uses lich form (with lvl 19 lich form is available since it only requires lvl 18)

so yes wizard gets a whole lot of stuff at lvl 19 a sorc does NOT get. Additionally a wizard can probably fit in more of those shiny spell focus/greater spell focus feats, which increases the offset between the two classes even more ....sooo .... you couldnt be more wrong ;p

** EDIT .... oups seems i followed the lemmings in the necro trap ... sry for that necro^^ ...