TOD raid club

[moops]

Just think, if you had a good AC intim tank for either Sulu or Horoth, you could bring as many noobs as you want and not have to wait forever to fill your LFMs with people who have uber HP and DPS Those HP requirements are quite high, even for elite for general melees. And I think you might find it useful to have a couple ranged alts on Elite as well.

There is more than one way to skin a cat

Heck we even have a BARD on Sarlona who intims Horoth and the whole group just goes to town on him--oh but he does not meet your requirements. Prob the sorcs who intim the bosses in part 1 do not as well.

[Shade]

One tip for healers that like this raid:

Boots are ok, but the mantle of the world shaper is better.
Why: Protects you 100% from 5 banishments/stuns - and in a good group, that is more then enough.
Boots do not protect against the stun, and I've seen some runs fail due to tanks dying while all healers are stunned.

And there's no real excuse for having boots and not the mantle. Boots can be a week long grind.. Mantle is a 100% guarenteed drop from a questline you can solo at lvl20 in 20-40 min.

Where to get: Threnal - Run west, east then south, and get the end reward, it's always there.

[Murderface]

While I generally dislike being so strict about entry requirements for a group running any content, after you fail a half dozen ToDs because too much of the group can't hack it, seeing Murder's point of view isn't too difficult.

On my end, I've gone a different route lately: I'm running my AC tank through there, and like buddying up with Maddon (AC tank specc'ed much more for AC, Con and Intimidate than my guy who also sports decent DPS; and a real DPS option with GTHF). He Intimitanks Horoth, all the other melee (except one on orthon duty) get on Horoth until Sulu pops, then I tank Sulu and all of the melee but one move over to kill him. The one excepted melee stays on Horoth DPS with Maddon turtled up, taking almost no damage.

We could probably get done faster with 2 pure DPS in place of the two tanks, but this way there is more room for error and healers have used zero resources (no scrolls, no pots).

Still, I'll try to catch one or two of Murder's runs on my way to my 20th ToD (coming up soon).

Murderface, I know you keep trying to rope me in, and that I'm always in something else already--when are you likely to be running ToD next?

[Edit] Overall, I still think the usage of MyDDO for exclusionary purposes is unnecessary; ask questions and go from there. Well-played, knowledgeable people with the resources and will to perform and complete are going to be pretty close to being on par with those who have perfect equipment but less skill or a worse attitude.

look your always welcome

im not as strict as yall think. i did say i take 1 non dps guy and you say you have gthf already so thats suitable dps for me. as far as intim goes its good on sulu not so great on horoth. truth be told i tanked on my fighter with intim but i just dps and throw intim. when sulu popped i just sheild blocked to ensure a win.

when i look at my ddo im not looking for perfect gear. im looking at if they have the hp to survive and also looking at if they have gear on that they got from korthos

dont laugh they actualty do wear that stuff some of them. i sen +2 will save rings on people just the ugliest stuff
people wearing armor from bam. people with 75% fort. casters with 200 hp

im not looking for full sets of tod rings and and 2 to 3 gs gear. im just looking at them being par not above par just par ok.
i dont care if they have a haggle item or voice of the master or mummified bat on when i look thats not a big deal
but if there wearing set rewards from waterworks im gonna pass

One tip for healers that like this raid:

Boots are ok, but the mantle of the world shaper is better.
Why: Protects you 100% from 5 banishments/stuns - and in a good group, that is more then enough.
Boots do not protect against the stun, and I've seen some runs fail due to tanks dying while all healers are stunned

theres spots for clerics to hide and not get stunned its tricky but not impossible. also scarabs work too
i just got one for 30 k plat however you are corret stun does sometimes cause a wipe
that has not happened in a raid with cleric+tank up to par like i said

Just think, if you had a good AC intim tank for either Sulu or Horoth, you could bring as many noobs as you want and not have to wait forever to fill your LFMs with people who have uber HP and DPS Those HP requirements are quite high, even for elite for general melees. And I think you might find it useful to have a couple ranged alts on Elite as well.

There is more than one way to skin a cat

Heck we even have a BARD on Sarlona who intims Horoth and the whole group just goes to town on him--oh but he does not meet your requirements. Prob the sorcs who intim the bosses in part 1 do not as well.

bards have the least requirment. intim on horoth is real tricky. i have had mordekai i think his name was try that
doesnt work as well as high dps. sure theres many ways to skin a cat. but im sure at the slaughter house is the most efficient way to skin this cat and thats the way we do it slaughter house style

Wow...we have this thing on Ghallanda called Guilds.
Your almost talking about the same thing...except Guilds help each of its members.

Shame you have to do this to complete a simple raid like ToD.

This is so sad it makes the baby Jeebus cry.
Maybe you name the Raid-Club "Richards" or something smart like that! You know capture the spirit of your fail.

thats really clever ha but the reality of the situation is this my guild runs raids but not tod on the regular because they have there own grinds(abbot, epic von 6, epic quests, true resurrection leveling). this game has so many grinds that its hard to make a tod guild raid everyday but if you think i dont have guildmates in my raids your sorely mistaken.

see what separates khyber from all the other servers is we have awsome pug community and always have. when i been on khyber for 4 years the friends list is the who list for me i know alot of people on server. ive been raiding pug groups since spine when people were of the same mind with the guild only bs so whatever have your all guild groups doesnt matter for me too much

I can appreciate and understand what you're trying to do, but I hope you're a bit more flexible with your HP requirements. Otherwise, you're eliminating almost every elven character from your raids.

really i have a pure drow pally with gtwf kopesh starting con 12. and guess what i have 500 hp. if i know the person and there playstyle its fine like if your elf ranger has 470 hp then maybe we can make arrangments people keep saying oh thats so strict its really not. like i said ill take a monk finnese rogue or whatever i just make sure i got six massive melee

these requirments are not so we can complete the raid but do it in complete comfort

Lets face it the hardest part of that whole raid is surviving the lag in part 2 to get to 3 and personally I would rather have your sorc kiting in there than all of those high hp high dps toons supposedly needed for the end.

well last night we did a part 2 laggy as all heck but the part boos died in 1 minute and 10 seconds so even the lag cant stop that guy from dying, as far as elite goes your correct with the requirments elite can be done if your killing just horoth and quite easily but sol on elite prolly has the most hp of any boss out there so i wont prolly do elite horoth and sol but horoth alone is not a problem at all.

[Belwaar]

Once Hordiva, now back to bard in her 2TR...warchanter this time, gets back up in level and is reflagged I'm down. MyDDO me after level 11 anytime you want and watch your screen explode ROFL!

Yeah from the uB3r n00B!n3$$

[moops]

l
when i look at my ddo im not looking for perfect gear. im looking at if they have the hp to survive and also looking at if they have gear on that they got from korthos

dont laugh they actualty do wear that stuff some of them. i sen +2 will save rings on people just the ugliest stuff
people wearing armor from bam. people with 75% fort. casters with 200 hp

im not looking for full sets of tod rings and and 2 to 3 gs gear. im just looking at them being par not above par just par ok.
i dont care if they have a haggle item or voice of the master or mummified bat on when i look thats not a big deal
but if there wearing set rewards from waterworks im gonna pass

But how do you know MYDDO.com is accurate--every single one of my alts is wrong on MYDDO, pretty far off in fact---as far as level and stats, and sometimes gear since the levels are wrong. My quest completions are pretty up to date tho.

[Barumar]

One tip for healers that like this raid:

Boots are ok, but the mantle of the world shaper is better.
Why: Protects you 100% from 5 banishments/stuns - and in a good group, that is more then enough.
Boots do not protect against the stun, and I've seen some runs fail due to tanks dying while all healers are stunned.

And there's no real excuse for having boots and not the mantle. Boots can be a week long grind.. Mantle is a 100% guarenteed drop from a questline you can solo at lvl20 in 20-40 min.

Where to get: Threnal - Run west, east then south, and get the end reward, it's always there.

Now there is some excellent advice! My Cleric got 9 runs (and her first Ring ) done before the last mod and the change that has a lot of people avoiding this Raid.

Farming boot ingredients is one thing, but doing so for my Cleric is another - now I have a sustainable option to running this Raid until 20 (second Ring and possibility of my +4 WIS Tome) - as those Scarabs got really expensive and the few I have would not last too many runs...

Also, zerging Threnal sounds almost fun - especially the thought of keeping that knuckle head alive after so many issues with him at level in years gone by!

Barumar

[Cap_Man]

Hey Murderface,

How do you feel about someone that meets your qualifications but has not done the raid before?

I've had the boots for a while but just finished getting flagged recently. **** that New Invasion! It was harder to get than the boots!

[Lorz]

maybe you should go back to Gal-lame-da before you get your feeling hurt... this is Khyber where the men are men and the sheep are nervous! T

Well i can see why you would be nervous over on Khyber considering your SHEEP and you know of the Ghal preference for such beasts. Just remember to keep your backs against the walls you never know where we might turn up next.

[Murderface]

as i said the number 1 thing i look for is hp. if i see umd buffing gear mumified bat or any stuff like that it wont bother me at all
but if i see gear thats not up to there level like stuff from korthos yeah gonna pass. the other thing is mostly i invite people i know and i know alot of people that are very above par

[sephiroth1084]

One tip for healers that like this raid:

Boots are ok, but the mantle of the world shaper is better.
Why: Protects you 100% from 5 banishments/stuns - and in a good group, that is more then enough.
Boots do not protect against the stun, and I've seen some runs fail due to tanks dying while all healers are stunned.

I've heard conflicting reports about the utility of the Mantle and Scarabs; does the Mantle grant immunity to 5 banishes and stuns, or does Blasphemy (or whatever) cause 2 charges to be ticked off? Do they in fact protect against being banished?

look your always welcome

im not as strict as yall think. i did say i take 1 non dps guy and you say you have gthf already so thats suitable dps for me. as far as intim goes its good on sulu not so great on horoth. truth be told i tanked on my fighter with intim but i just dps and throw intim. when sulu popped i just sheild blocked to ensure a win.

when i look at my ddo im not looking for perfect gear. im looking at if they have the hp to survive and also looking at if they have gear on that they got from korthos

That Anger's Step set bonus of +2 stacking bonus to attack is pretty nice...

dont laugh they actualty do wear that stuff some of them. i sen +2 will save rings on people just the ugliest stuff
people wearing armor from bam. people with 75% fort. casters with 200 hp

im not looking for full sets of tod rings and and 2 to 3 gs gear. im just looking at them being par not above par just par ok.
i dont care if they have a haggle item or voice of the master or mummified bat on when i look thats not a big deal
but if there wearing set rewards from waterworks im gonna pass


theres spots for clerics to hide and not get stunned its tricky but not impossible. also scarabs work too
i just got one for 30 k plat however you are corret stun does sometimes cause a wipe
that has not happened in a raid with cleric+tank up to par like i said


bards have the least requirment. intim on horoth is real tricky. i have had mordekai i think his name was try that
doesnt work as well as high dps. sure theres many ways to skin a cat. but im sure at the slaughter house is the most efficient way to skin this cat and thats the way we do it slaughter house style

My post wasn't questioning whether I'd be able to get into the group (my tank certainly meets most, if not all, of your prescribed requirements), or even your methodology necessarily. I was merely presenting my strategy for others who may be bristling at such exacting requirements as you specified. Note my edit: what is your ToD cycle on these days? I'll try to be off timer to join you for one if I can.

Intimitanking Horoth is risky since, if you get stunned just as an intim is wearing off, there is a risk of Horoth turning on the other melees for a few seconds. If the tank is wearing the Mantle or a light side monk is keeping up Grasp that possibility is much slimmer. The real upsides here are that there is no risk of aggro being shifted due to someone with too much DPS (Manyshot, a string of Lightning Strikes or crit smites in Defensive Stance), and because the person is shield blocking with high AC, they are necessarily taking very little damage, which is less of a burden on the healers both in terms of resource usage and focus.

I've done the raid successfully in various ways:
-high HP, high DPS type (barbarian or fighter usually) just builds up some aggro before people move in
-intimitanking
-hate tanking, both in AC mode (in my case S&B and maybe CE on) and DPS mode (in my case a two-hander and PA on)

--and I've found that the intimitanking method has been the safest, most consistent method, if it does take a little longer (usually not much more though).

The other major benefit of intimitanking is that, if for whatever reason the main tank does go down, it's relatively easy to reestablish aggro and settle down, whereas trying to stabilize aggro via pure DPS in that situation tends to be almost impossible.

[Blazer]

really i have a pure drow pally with gtwf kopesh starting con 12. and guess what i have 500 hp. if i know the person and there playstyle its fine like if your elf ranger has 470 hp then maybe we can make arrangments people keep saying oh thats so strict its really not.

Please note that I said "almost", not "100% every elven melee on the server". 500 HP elven rangers are rare, to say the least. My point was to ask you to recognize that your requirements are going to eliminate a lot of quality players from joining your raids. Your original post is full of absolutes such as "must have" and "no lower than" and makes no mention of making other arrangements. If you're willing to take people that don't meet your HP requirements, that's fine. I just would hate to see you decline high quality players simply because MyDDO shows them as having only 500 HP on an elven fighter instead of 550.

Also note that MyDDO shows you as having 462 HP, Bandabras, not 500. If you want to talk about buffed HP, that's a different story.

[Raegoul]

My bard and barb both qualify. That's nice. However *I* have a MAJOR requirement : fun. Could I be guaranteed of such a requirement your raid group?

Truth

[Angelus_dead]

I've heard conflicting reports about the utility of the Mantle and Scarabs; does the Mantle grant immunity to 5 banishes and stuns, or does Blasphemy (or whatever) cause 2 charges to be ticked off? Do they in fact protect against being banished?

The mantle protects from the stun, and uses one charge per casting of Blasphemy. However, I have seen saving throws against Banishment while using the mantle. I do not think it is possible to be banished while your mantle has charges, but have not yet observed a failed banish save while using it.

Note that scarabs lose 7 charges per Blasphemy.

If the tank is wearing the Mantle or a light side monk is keeping up Grasp that possibility is much slimmer.

Horoth casts many more spells than just Blasphemy, and the others will rapidly expend the charges of a Mantle of the Worldshaper.

I've done the raid successfully in various ways:

The topic is not just about completing TOD successfully, but also killing Suulomades.

[sephiroth1084]

The mantle protects from the stun, and uses one charge per casting of Blasphemy. However, I have seen saving throws against Banishment while using the mantle. I do not think it is possible to be banished while your mantle has charges, but have not yet observed a failed banish save while using it.

I've heard varying reports, such as the above, on whether or not the Mantle or Scarabs can prevent banishment.
[quote
Note that scarabs lose 7 charges per Blasphemy.
[/quote] Heard this too.

Horoth casts many more spells than just Blasphemy, and the others will rapidly expend the charges of a Mantle of the Worldshaper.

Yeah, wasn't thinking about that.

The topic is not just about completing TOD successfully, but also killing Suulomades.

Well, the most successful, easy and cheap version of this I've done is with the 2-tank method. When grouping with Maddon I tank Sulu, usually with hate unless I'm either taking too much damage or someone pulls aggro, then I just turtle up and spam intim. Had one group where the DPS was too low for this, but it's been more consistent than with just high HP/high DPS tanks, as both the Sulu tank and the Horoth tank take so much damage that an untimely stun or any other problem that occurs can lead to someone dying.

In a few exceptional groups we've just been able to butcher the hell out of everything, to borrow Murder's phraseology, but that hasn't happened very often.

[Murderface]

My bard and barb both qualify. That's nice. However *I* have a MAJOR requirement : fun. Could I be guaranteed of such a requirement your raid group?

i know some group leaders are very curt and kinda remind you of your boss visiting your cubicle
im pretty easy going i dont bark orders i just do it right. i been in seriously bad pugs like i have never experienced before ddo eu then i might get irate and its deffintly no fun at all. but you havent seen fun till you kill sol in about 3 minutes and horoth in 5 to 6. its fun having flawless victories its so much fun hack and slash i love it!!!!
everyone is pretty friendly.

theres no secret convo on vent and command orders on ddo mic

All that bs and he misses the most important quality in a raid party memeber....

hmm which is what? you know whatever your answer is the obvious answer is yes we have those qualities in our comrades this server is built on coop from different guilds since you cant just command all your guildees to do a raid because other people might be doing something different..

all the best guilds raid together on our server. nothing wrong with doing all guild runs but the scheduling and the fact that people play more then a couple of characters its virtualy impossible to do 6+ tod raids a week all guild

[Quikster]

maybe you should go back to Gal-lame-da before you get your feeling hurt... this is Khyber where the men are men and the sheep are nervous! T

Ba--aa-a-aa--a-aaa.

*looks around nervously while in khyber forums*


Im not Aa--aaa--aaa--aa sheep....

[Quikster]

hmm which is what? you know whatever your answer is the obvious answer is yes we have those qualities in our comrades this server is built on coop from different guilds since you cant just command all your guildees to do a raid because other people might be doing something different..

all the best guilds raid together on our server. nothing wrong with doing all guild runs but the scheduling and the fact that people play more then a couple of characters its virtualy impossible to do 6+ tod raids a week all guild

If you have those qualities, none of the bs you posted matters. You need a group of people that listen to directions, and work as a team. All that bs you posted isnt required to beat the raid in a timely manner.

[Vivalavida]

i thought TOD is not that hard......

or is it because all the smooth runs i had made me think so .....

[sephiroth1084]

i know some group leaders are very curt and kinda remind you of your boss visiting your cubicle
im pretty easy going i dont bark orders i just do it right. i been in seriously bad pugs like i have never experienced before ddo eu then i might get irate and its deffintly no fun at all. but you havent seen fun till you kill sol in about 3 minutes and horoth in 5 to 6. its fun having flawless victories its so much fun hack and slash i love it!!!!
everyone is pretty friendly.

Actually, in one of my 2-tank runs, we ran into an odd problem: with the headstart on Horoth + the best DPS guy in the group still beating on him, Horoth was going to go down before Sulu, even though we had 5 people beating on Sally. Going pure DPS is perfectly valid, but the difference isn't that significant time wise, and resource wise the pure DPS run probably is more taxing, but the better time may end up balancing both out.

If you have those qualities, none of the bs you posted matters. You need a group of people that listen to directions, and work as a team. All that bs you posted isnt required to beat the raid in a timely manner.

That isn't entirely the case. While skill and ability to to follow directions goes a very long way, sometimes not having a build or gear to hack it will cause problems.

In the last run I did, we just didn't have enough DPS to confidently take down both Sulu and Horoth. We could have tried, but with also only 2 clerics, we decided to take a pass.

Lot's of things can go wrong because of a poorly made or equipped character.

[sephiroth1084]

i thought TOD is not that hard......

or is it because all the smooth runs i had made me think so .....

Think my completion rate in the last month is around 40%, and that includes 2 or 3meltdowns in part 3, and not because of people without boots. Well, one of them was, because we had someone kiting Sulu without boots (I wasn't leader, though).

[Edit] 100% w/ the double-tank runs.