Ye Olde Neophyte Querries!!

[Ninetoes]

A friend of mine commented that I only ever play melee characters in MMO's (or anything other than PnP, really), and he's correct. I typically find caster classes boring and "not my bag", however, he got me thinking. I decided to take a stab at Sorcerer, and it went horribly. I was out of SP halfway through the second quest, couldn't hit anything with Niacs (cool, it's like an ice laser, right?) and in general created a totally bad character. So, I started over. I've done a bit of research, and this is what I've come up with so far.

(Actual questions after Copy/Pasta.)

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.18
DDO Character Planner Home Page

Insecticide Dispersal Technician
Level 3 True Neutral Warforged Male
(3 Sorcerer) 
Hit Points: 44
Spell Points: 358 
BAB: 1\1
Fortitude: 5
Reflex: 1
Will: 1

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
Abilities        Base Stats          Modified Stats
(32 Point)       (Level 1)             (Level 3)
Strength             10                    10
Dexterity            10                    10
Constitution         18                    19
Intelligence         10                    10
Wisdom                6                     6
Charisma             16                    18

Tomes Used
+1 Tome of Charisma used at level 3

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                 Base Skills         Modified Skills
Skills           (Level 1)            (Level 3)
Balance               0                     0
Bluff                 3                     4
Concentration         8                    10
Diplomacy             3                     4
Disable Device        n/a                   n/a
Haggle                3                     4
Heal                 -2                    -2
Hide                  0                     0
Intimidate            3                     4
Jump                  0                     0
Listen               -2                    -2
Move Silently         0                     0
Open Lock             n/a                   n/a
Perform               n/a                   n/a
Repair                0                     0
Search                0                     0
Spot                 -2                    -2
Swim                  0                     0
Tumble                n/a                   n/a
Use Magic Device      5                     7

Level 1 (Sorcerer)
Skill: Concentration (+4)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+2)
Feat: (Selected) Empower Spell
Spell (1): Master's Touch
Spell (1): Repair Light Damage
Enhancement: Sorcerer Energy Manipulation I
Enhancement: Sorcerer Elemental Manipulation I
Enhancement: Sorcerer Energy of the Dragonblooded I
Enhancement: Warforged Construct Thinking I


Level 2 (Sorcerer)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)
Feat: (Automatic) Defensive Fighting
Feat: (Automatic) Sunder
Feat: (Automatic) Trip
Spell (1): Acid Spray
Enhancement: Sorcerer Force Manipulation I
Enhancement: Sorcerer Charisma I
Enhancement: Warforged Inscribed Armor I


Level 3 (Sorcerer)
Skill: Concentration (+1)
Skill: Use Magic Device (+0.5)
Feat: (Selected) Extend Spell
Spell (1): Charm Person
Enhancement: Sorcerer Lineage of Energy I
Enhancement: Warforged Constitution I

So far, all I've needed are Master's Touch, Light Repair, and something to swing. I'm not dumb enough to think that this will last past lvl 3-4 or so, but it's been pretty effective for solo. FAR more than taking niacs or MM (blech), or some other damage spells.

I added acid splash at 2 to soften up the groups of kobolds/whatever that mobbed up on me. At 3, I added charm person, passed myself a +2 cloak from my main, and it became 10 times more fun. I can't even describe how hilarious butcher's path was with charm person. Watching kobolds slaughter each other while yelling "KOBOLDS SHOULD STICK TOGETHER" was a thing of beauty.

So, right now my strategy is to just hit a couple of mobs with charm, let them group up in a big ball of hilarious mayhem, spray them with acid once if I have the SP to spare, and then mow them down with a +2 greataxe.

If I stupidly run out of SP, the archivist's set gives me enough to master's touch my way to a shrine with a couple of repairs left to spare.


So the real questions is: What do I do with the upcoming undead quests? Obviously charm won't work. Should I just man up and hack my way though it, and save my sp for repair light?

More to the point, I'm aware that this playstyle isn't really what I'll be doing forever. Will playing a mele sorc early on hurt me later? I'm sure I'll pick up a few bat habits, and whatnot. I fully expect to replace those lvl 1 spells, at least master's touch.


I guess what I'm really asking is "how do I play a REAL sorc, once I need to stop acting like a paladin" (Buff buff swing). Do I need to start practicing now, or can I laze through it with an axe and some CC/Buffs/cone AOE's until lvl 8?

Also, any other caster tips are more than welcome. In my reading of these forums, EVERYONE has their own different idea's about how to play an arcane caster. I welcome all of your input. Try to keep the infighting, racial preferences, etc. to a dull roar

<3 Toes

[PyrosianFelicity]

I guess what I'm really asking is "how do I play a REAL sorc, once I need to stop acting like a paladin" (Buff buff swing). Do I need to start practicing now, or can I laze through it with an axe and some CC/Buffs/cone AOE's until lvl 8?

Also, any other caster tips are more than welcome. In my reading of these forums, EVERYONE has their own different idea's about how to play an arcane caster. I welcome all of your input. Try to keep the infighting, racial preferences, etc. to a dull roar
<3 Toes

Weeeelll, normally I consider myself not experienced enough to respond to questions, but since you asked...

*points to sig*
That's my current character, and he's actually ready to hit 9, but I've got to wait for Update 3 to remove leveling sigils, or find a sigil for it.

Not having Warforged unlocked and thus never having played one, the following advice is limited:
I've played my Halfling Sorc as a real caster's caster, maxing Cha with all available boosts, putting a medium amount into Con, and leaving everything else fairly low. You know, the stereotypical, "Can't take damage, but give him a round or two and he'll fry everything" type of caster.
To say the least, it's been a blast.

After doing my reading on the forums, I generally tried (past-tense. Firewall is a game-changer) to think of myself as the utility character, the problem-solver, with regards to monsters, not locks or traps.

Lots of mobs coming up? It's my job to spray some Webs around to trap and and make it easier for the melees, or Hypno them if it's a party that won't go around and snap them all out of it at once.

Boss monster coming up at the end of a quest, with the party low on HP? Turn on Empower and Maximize, and knock it out with one or two Niac's shots.


The thing I've found that's really important is knowing where the shrines are in a quest, since that lets you use your metamagic efficiently. You're a Warforged with less Cha than my Halfling, so you'll have less SP, but I've never found problems with running out of SP once I knew where the shrines were. I've found I cast more conservatively, or lean more towards Crowd-Control than direct damage, if the shrines are few and far between. If there are lots of shrines though, I'll turn on the Metamagic and blast away, leading the kill count.


As for how to play at different levels...
You're going to want to do stuff before level 8. But then again, apparently I level really slowly compared to some people here, because I just hit level 8 last week after playing the character for around a month.

-Hypnotism has been really fun to use, I'd definitely pick that up. It's an Area Effect that'll keep most monsters helpless as long as they aren't attacked, and it's useful for Kobolds that have a Reflex save too high for Web or Niac's.

-Metamagic is gooood. Metamagic is nice. Make sure you grab Extend and Haste by level 6, because all parties will expect you to have it. Then it can get kinda dull, because you're expected to keep the entire party Hasted at all times, and may not have much SP for other things, but Haste is really nice because the DPS boost to the SP cost is great.

-Web is nice, and a great Crowd-Control spell, especially for skeletons that are immune to your Niac's. You can still help out against them by ensnaring them. I haven't found MM to be very SP-efficient, at least on a caster not specc'd for Force. I'd definitely pick up Web as a 2nd-level spell though.

-Niac's. I love it for low levels, personally, and found it to be useful until around level 6 or so. Empower and Maximize can make for hits of 130+ at levels 3-4 or so, which is great when there's a boss Ogre or something with a low Reflex save coming up, and you've still got lots of SP. You can wow your party by killing it before it even gets to them, and at the same time deplete your entire SP reserve in a few shots. Another bonus? Zombies generally have a fairly low Reflex save, and more often than not would fail their Niac's save for me. Your DC will be lower than mine, with the Warforged Cha penalty, but I'd think it'd still be a good zombie-killer.


Undead Quest Suggestions:

Wraiths:
When your party struggles to hit them because no one has Ghost-Touch weapons, you can reliably plunk out damage every time it appears by spamming Magic Missile.

Skeletons:
Web is your friend. Too much hp and in too many number for MM to be efficient, and they're immune to cold so Niac's is out.

Zombies and Wights:
Niac's Niac's Niac's. Low reflex and no cold resistance means it knocks them down pretty quickly.


Hope that's helpful!

[Ninetoes]

Quite! +1to you, sir.

I plan to grab all the metamagics, right now I've just got maximize and extend. I hadn't thought of Niacs on the wraiths, actually, might not be a bad Idea.


Something I should have mentioned is that I solo a LOT. I haven't had a whole lot of luck with the /lfg on my server at lower levels, and as such I find I just solo things. If i had a set group, I wouldn't even bother with master's touch and just take all DD and CC spells.

Having said that, there just doesn't seem to be enough of a SP pool availible to me to take single target DD spells like niacs. Soloing anything in the harbor that's not one of the throw-away, "haberdasheresque" quests is a real stretch for a spell-only lvl 3 caster. Hence, the master's touch melee approach.

I already figured I'd have to web/acid skeletons. I'll just grab a maul and swap between slashing and blunt for the undead.

Do any of the lvl 1 CC spells work on undead? I need to do some more homework.

[PyrosianFelicity]

Something I should have mentioned is that I solo a LOT. I haven't had a whole lot of luck with the /lfg on my server at lower levels, and as such I find I just solo things. If i had a set group, I wouldn't even bother with master's touch and just take all DD and CC spells.

I may not be the best guy to be giving you advice, then, as my solo ability consists of large amounts of suck. Just so that you know to take anything I say with a bit of doubt with it, 'cause it comes from playing with groups, not playing solo.

Having said that, there just doesn't seem to be enough of a SP pool availible to me to take single target DD spells like niacs. Soloing anything in the harbor that's not one of the throw-away, "haberdasheresque" quests is a real stretch for a spell-only lvl 3 caster. Hence, the master's touch melee approach.

I already figured I'd have to web/acid skeletons. I'll just grab a maul and swap between slashing and blunt for the undead.

Do any of the lvl 1 CC spells work on undead? I need to do some more homework.

I don't believe any of the level 1 CC spells work on undead, but Command Undead might be worth looking into once you hit level 2. I don't have it myself, but I've got a guildie that I've seen use it to devastating effect, since apparently Undead don't have great Will saves.

When playing the Kobold quests in the Harbor with the Master's Touch strategy, I'd imagine that your Charm + Swing combo will do quite well. If you can hit level 4 before hitting some serious undead you can grab Command Undead then, and just continue with the same strategy. Charm should continue to be useful for living targets for a little while yet, including some of the Hobgoblin enemies, and will probably get a good amount of use until at least level 6.

At level 6 you get the magical Haste, which is a pretty large SP-drain to keep going constantly, but has a great melee-DPS increase with it. Maybe a combination of Haste with Web or Hypnotism would be good, for level 6+ quests.


Sorry, re-reading that it doesn't sound too helpful, maybe you can find something useful in it.

[Ninetoes]

Sorry, re-reading that it doesn't sound too helpful, maybe you can find something useful in it.

You'd be surprised how often 2 newbies putting their heads together can be useful. It actually helps me think through it very well. I've considered hypno OR web, but I think what I'll do over the weekend is grab web as soon as I hit 4. A there are quite a few areas in particular in the lvl 3-4 quests that web will serve me really well, provided I use it tactically. What I was mainly worried about in the upcoming levels was getting surrounded by multiple mobs. So far, it's fairly easy to crowd control humanoids by simply charming 2 mobs out of a pack and letting them get a bunch of agro. God help them if I charm a Hobgoblin Cleric, or Witchdoctor (nothing's funnier than having the witchdoctors make the wolves dance. 2 CC spells for the price of one!).

The Catacombs and other undead areas (Delara's, etc) will be trickier. Won't be soloing Delara's anyway, but there's a LOT of undead around and I have to be ready for them. I'll grab web and use it to bottleneck doors or passageways. I'll let you know how it turns out. I can't justify filling a slot with a single target, undead only spell when I could fill it with Web instead and use it for many, many levels.

It's a shame you're not on my server. We could have some fun.

[Bladedown]

Ray of Enfeeblement is also a great spell to have if you use web. It has no save and it's synergy with web is wonderful as it makes it tougher for something to break out of web once it get's stuck.

[Ninetoes]

I've done some more digging, and decided the "smack it until it's dead" sorc really isn't in the spirit of things. I'm going to give it another shot and see how i fare just using a few spells and mouselook. Should be fun.

[PyrosianFelicity]

I've done some more digging, and decided the "smack it until it's dead" sorc really isn't in the spirit of things. I'm going to give it another shot and see how i fare just using a few spells and mouselook. Should be fun.

I've always kinda had a distaste for those kind, too. Maybe it's my NWN background that's conditioned me to think that anything with melee ability should have a good AB, which doesn't seem to be as true in DDO. I do have a love for the "Low Str, Low HP" caster that can really dish out the pain, though. There's something incredibly cool about coming up to a boss, turning on all the metamagic, and knocking it out in a couple spells while totally draining your SP bar.
Personal taste, I suppose.

Let me know how it goes, and if I can help with anything else!