Changes to summoned pets

[ryingar]

So let me get this right, I'm going to be limited on one pet from any source at a time? And the reason is "Lag Control?"
But its okay for me to have 5 hirelings running around? I know there is some difference between the two, but still I think this is ridiculous. If I spent the time and ings to craft a few trip earth item/weaps, pick up the drow/scorp clicky(also known as Bobo in certain circles), and summon a hezaru that is my business and for the most part we like to call that "tactics", well sometimes anyway. Granted I don't summon everything every quest, but sometimes its fun to have 6 pets running a muck.
Also if you are going to put in Pale master, where is the fun if you cant have a small army of undead to serve you?

Suggestion to Devs:
If you are going to adjust summons, do it at least in the spirit of the following:
1: Put a limit on the number of summons. Say one summon from a particular source, ie one GS, one Spell, one enhancement.
2:Put in DeCrafting. Some of us have made quite a few trip earth items for soloing/fun, and in one fell swoop they are now useless.
3:Possibly leave the GS items out of this particular rule. Doubtful but it had to be mentioned.

I may edit this at a later point, but atm I am really pi&*(d off about this change.

[Angelus_dead]

So let me get this right, I'm going to be limited on one pet from any source at a time? And the reason is "Lag Control?"
But its okay for me to have 5 hirelings running around?

This is simple:
1. The more players in the party, the fewer hirelings there can be.
2. The more players in the party, the more summons there can be.

3:Possibly leave the GS items out of this particular rule. Doubtful but it had to be mentioned.

Anyone who has even once been in a group that made heavy use of Greensteel elementals will know how idiotic it was that this was ever allowed. A party with 12 elementals is stupid, but 24 or 36 is ludicrous.

2:Put in DeCrafting. Some of us have made quite a few trip earth items for soloing/fun, and in one fell swoop they are now useless.

If the people who had spent precious Large Scales on dual-supreme Shortswords and Mauls weren't allowed to reforge them into the new Rapiers and Axes, then you certainly don't deserve better treatment about your Mediums.

[ryingar]

Anyone who has even once been in a group that made heavy use of Greensteel elementals will know how idiotic it was that this was ever allowed. A party with 12 elementals is stupid, but 24 or 36 is ludicrous.



If the people who had spent precious Large Scales on dual-supreme Shortswords and Mauls weren't allowed to reforge them into the new Rapiers and Axes, then you certainly don't deserve better treatment about your Mediums.

I don't disagree with you on any particular point, But this has been around for almost two years(ish)? These have become part of the established game play, not something that was changed in the next patch.

I agree that we shouldn't have 24+ earthies running around, but only one total? from any source? That seems like using a nuke when you need a scalpel.

Also those SS and Mauls were still useful in full, their functionality was not changed. the earthie items are seeing a change to thier functionality.

[TechNoFear]

I agree that we shouldn't have 24+ earthies running around, but only one total? from any source?

Per player, so still can double the party size.

Also those SS and Mauls were still useful in full, their functionality was not changed.

Transmuting was reduced to Metalline, making many of them less effective.

[puck4872]

Got a link to offical notes for this change? Would like to check it out.

[puck4872]

Summoned Monster changes


Summon Monster spells no longer have exceptionally long cooldown timers.
Summoned creatures now persist for 10 minutes and will teleport to their master if they are not currently in combat and their master is distant from them.
Summoning a second creature will banish your first creature back to its home plane.

Has anyone tried there clickies out?

[Feylina]

lol turbines banging the lag drum again. what a crock of super high intensity training.

[fuzzy1guy]

Anyone who has even once been in a group that made heavy use of Greensteel elementals will know how idiotic it was that this was ever allowed. A party with 12 elementals is stupid, but 24 or 36 is ludicrous.

Agreed 1000%

Anytime i see someone summon up multiple elementals. I just stop moving. I won't be able to see anything going on or target without tab at all. All i see is a wall of elementals. This is silly and never should have happened.

The solution is just stop moving. If they want to finish the quest for me. Be my guest. If they run into the beholder with a dozen elementals that get dispeled and turn on them. That's their business. (and as funny as that is) I don't wanna be near it.

I usually note those players and never join a group with them again. :|

I suppose the usual thing to do would be to throw a fit and recall out. But meh. I just stop moving until the elementals are gone or the quest is finished. Sit quietly and sort my inventory. That always needs doing.

The worst is the reincarnated folks doing this in lower level quests where it is EXTREME overkill. I'm guessing to try and impress new players. But it ammounts to soloing while in a team. Which is just silly. Why did you LFG and accept folks in if you and your earth army can do it all alone. Oh you wanted a cleric to heal you? Well he got tired of following the wall of shifting stone and stopped moving way back down the tunnel...


It was intresting to see the first time just as something new After that... Ugh... i'll pass.

[Missing_Minds]

I don't disagree with you on any particular point, But this has been around for almost two years(ish)? These have become part of the established game play, not something that was changed in the next patch.

Doesn't matter. The only constant in ANY MMO is change.

[ryingar]

lol turbines banging the lag drum again. what a crock of super high intensity training.

They shout "Lag" like the Bush admin shouted "911" to keep us all in fear and accept any and all changes they feel like.

But Beyond that, I'm shocked at the some of the comments here. Seems like most of you dont care one way or another. I'm not saying we should have a insane number of pets, but more than one is not game breaking. I think one pet from a particular source is pretty fair. Most people dont summon to begin with and none of these pets are overly strong. but they do have their uses.

I do like the change to porting for pets and the change in timer.

BTW - Point to you on the transmuting change

[pumagirl418]

the lag started when they started 'tweaking' the ai. so how can us lowly players who have no control over that be responsible. i am sick and tired of being told i am responsible for lag...

if i made upteen earth element clickies i should be able to have them and my summons.

GAMERS ARE NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR LAG, THE DEVLOPERS AND HARDWARE ARE RESPONSIBLE. quit pinching ur friggin pennies and sink some more cash into ddo, thats why you went free to play turbine. why should i and other gamers be punished for more gamers on the servers?


sick sick sick...

[Eladrin]

So let me get this right, I'm going to be limited on one pet from any source at a time? And the reason is "Lag Control?"

No. The reason for these changes is for consistency and playability issues.

Summon Monster effects had incredibly lengthy cooldowns as a means to control the number that would be out at any time. We believe that having the creatures teleport to your side if they can't get to where you are and having the ability to instantly re-summon a pet that dies are positive changes, but removing the cooldowns required a stricter limit on the number that could exist at a time.

[Borror0]

[...] this has been around for almost two years(ish)? These have become part of the established game play, not something that was changed in the next patch.

It'll make two years at the end of the month, but it does not matter. The argument that you are using here can be used to oppose several beneficial changes. For example, "Ranged combat has been severely underpowered for, what, over three years now? This has become part of the established gameplay, not something that was changed in the next patch." That kind of argument cannot be reasonably used because several players would love ranged to be improved.

What you are doing, here, is essentially a nirvana fallacy: because something is not perfect, it's a bad solution. Things don't work that way. For each solution, you've got to weight in the good and the bad. If the good outweigh the bad, then adopting that solution is the best choice for as long as there is no better realistic solution available.

Doesn't matter. The only constant in ANY MMO is change.

Been reading a lot of Zombie_Columbus lately, have you?

[ryingar]

No. The reason for these changes is for consistency and playability issues.

Summon Monster effects had incredibly lengthy cooldowns as a means to control the number that would be out at any time. We believe that having the creatures teleport to your side if they can't get to where you are and having the ability to instantly re-summon a pet that dies are positive changes, but removing the cooldowns required a stricter limit on the number that could exist at a time.

TY for a Dev response. I do understand the reasons and how the changes are meant as a balance. I'm just sore about it atm. I liked having a summon or two from time to time.

[adamkatt]

No. The reason for these changes is for consistency and playability issues.

Summon Monster effects had incredibly lengthy cooldowns as a means to control the number that would be out at any time. We believe that having the creatures teleport to your side if they can't get to where you are and having the ability to instantly re-summon a pet that dies are positive changes, but removing the cooldowns required a stricter limit on the number that could exist at a time.

But gs items already had a low cool down.

[ryingar]

It'll make two years at the end of the month, but it does not matter. The argument that you are using here can be used to oppose several beneficial changes. For example, "Ranged combat has been severely underpowered for, what, over three years now? This has become part of the established gameplay, not something that was changed in the next patch." That kind of argument cannot be reasonably used because several players would love ranged to be improved.

What you are doing, here, is essentially a nirvana fallacy: because something is not perfect, it's a bad solution. Things don't work that way. For each solution, you've got to weight in the good and the bad. If the good outweigh the bad, then adopting that solution is the best choice for as long as there is no better realistic solution available.

As always Borroro you never pull a punch, that's why we love you. I just needed to vent for a moment or two as I'm sure you are well aware. Also my argument was that yes it may not be perfect, and if I had written the thread after a bit to cool down, would have been a bit more creative in involving the community to come up with a few ideas that might be worth looking into as additions or modifications to the current direction. We should(and i believe that we do) be able to use the forums to help the devs with input, ideas, and concepts on current, past, and future content.

[Borror0]

Honestly, the one solution to this problem is to add some sort of Green Steel respec but it must not be as easy as it sounds, as they would otherwise have done it already considering that we've been bugging them for over two years.

Though, losing out on a few mediums is not that bad.

[ryingar]

Honestly, the one solution to this problem is to add some sort of Green Steel respec but it must not be as easy as it sounds, as they would otherwise have done it already considering that we've been bugging them for over two years.

Though, losing out on a few mediums is not that bad.

Though most of my earthies are trip earths, so I'm just out a bit on the usefulness.

Its never as easy as we make it sound, lol. Though we wish it were.

[ryingar]

If they do come out with some sort of GS respec, I imagine it would require a new collectible or Epic tokens to achieve, which I'm ok with.

[Xyfiel]

Make all current gs bind to account, bind on equip, and treat it as never equipped.
Then we could move it to another character at least. Shouldn't require much either, just some flag in a database I figure. It isn't what we want, but sure many could settle for it.