Pale Master review

[Monkey_Archer]

Tested on level 20 human wizard - Pale master tier 3

Necrotic touch: About 300 damage on a failed save. Very nice

Skeletons: ~100 hp. CR:6

Arcane skeleton: casts acid arrow, scorching ray, lightning bolt, snowball swarm and some DC based spell that a rat was immune to. Likely to be quite useful for level 6 content.

Blackbones: ~150 hp. CR:12

Blackbone Arcane: casts burning hands, scorching ray, fireball, firewall and a DC based spell that a troll was immune to. Likely to be quite usefull for level 12 content, and even helpful in some high level content

Frostmarrow: ~200 hp. CR:18. All very weak for their CR rating IMO. Not one of them could kill a CR:17 ogre without constant (5+) healing with necrotic touch.

Frostmarrow Arcane: casts frostlance, snowball storm, ice storm, sleet storm and hold monster (guessing its about 25-30 DC, as it was able to hold the ogres in the vale fairly well). Moderately useful for Crowd control if the party has FOM, but does less damage then the Blackbone

Undead Traits: 100% fort, healed by negative energy, immune to positive energy. Cannot target yourself with necrotic touch, chill touch or inflict wounds spells. This makes self healing impossible (haven't tested with a friendly cleric casting mass inflict wounds though)

Wraith form: Duration 3 minutes, 5 minute cooldown. Grants undead traits. 25% incorporeal miss chance. Featherfall. +20 Move silently. Deals con damage on unarmed crits. I dont see a purpose for this yet... (maybe just stealth??) The healing immunity is a pretty large penalty for just 25% incorporeal...

Lich form: Duration 3 minutes, 5 minute cooldown. Grants undead traits. +4 con, +4 int +2 necromancy DC. Applies an inflict wound spell on unarmed attacks. Occasionally recives temporary hp when hit (appears to be 10% chance for 30 hp).


For low to mid levels i think this would be a very powerful PRE, but for endgame I'm not impressed. The summons are likely to be very useful at low-mid levels but are all much too weak to be helpful endgame. Again, in mid levels 3 minutes of healing immunity can be dealt with, but at endgame where damage is unavoidable its just a good way to get yourself killed.

Suggestions:
-Make lichform/wraithform a toggle ability, but keep the 5 minute cooldown.
-Allow inflict wounds and similar spells to target players in undead form.
-Add a self-targetable negative energy spell/ability (possibly to the currently very weak tier 3)
-Increase the effectiveness of tier 3 summons
-Vampiric touch!!!

[Sirea]

Do the traits like 25% miss chance, +4 stat, and the Necromancy DC stack?

[Visty]

dunno about the misschane, but the stats and dc stacks

[whysper]

Necrotic touch: About 300 damage on a failed save. Very nice

This is going to get "fixed." I have no idea what they were thinking.

[Bunker]

So Lich form alone adds a total of +4 to necromancy dc. Wow!

Question: If you activate a form, can you stop it before the timer wears off? (perhaps that was what you meant by adding a toggle?)

[Maegin]

what about testing this with a wf and arcane healing/reconstruct?

if wf can still be healed with recontruct, this makes wf casters that much more insane

[Bunker]

This is going to get "fixed." I have no idea what they were thinking.

What is wrong with it that it requires fixing?

[Kriogen]

-Make lichform/wraithform a toggle ability, but keep the 5 minute cooldown.

Not even that is enough.

Toggle with no cooldown. Stance like CE, Power Attack, monk stances. Noheal is huge penalty.

[Monkey_Archer]

So Lich form alone adds a total of +4 to necromancy dc. Wow!

Question: If you activate a form, can you stop it before the timer wears off? (perhaps that was what you meant by adding a toggle?)

No, it cannot be turned off.

[Bunker]

If you get a chance, I'm curious about something else.

Yugoloth Int pot has a -50% fort with the +2 int.

When in undead form, wearing a Heavy Fort Item and having drank a yugoloth potion, what is your characters current fortification? Being undead, does he still retain 100% fort?

[Maegin]

you gotta admit, the forms are spot on fow how much power they yield. the danger of no heals, or umd harm scrolls, is about right for giving someone stackable stats and dc's out the wazzou! you literally are a lich/wrath, undead traits and all

OP, does the necro touch cost any sps?

Does the wraith form's 25% miss chance stack with blur/displace? I imagin its the defensive form judging from stuff like this.

[Kriogen]

..OP, does the necro touch cost any sps?

No. At will spell, like dragonmarks, but with 6 seconds cooldown.

[rimble]

with 6 seconds cooldown.

Jeebus! I didn't think it'd be that short.

(Yes, we all know that's what she said, let me just get that out of the way)

[Vhlad]

Can WF enter lich form?

If so, oh snap.

Frees up a helm and belt slot (i.e. use upgraded mindsunder docent for con 6, SFL, toughness), throw helm out (since you have 100% fort in lich/wraith form), equip archmage or pale master belt. Will lose greater arcane lore (currently using blue scale docent).... but could throw a conc opp helm on and replace torc with an abbot necklace.

[Angelus_dead]

you gotta admit, the forms are spot on fow how much power they yield. the danger of no heals, or umd harm scrolls, is about right for giving someone stackable stats and dc's out the wazzou!

The benefits do not nearly compensate for healing immunity. The only way the undead forms can be a benefit is if you were somehow prepared to go 3+ minutes without doing anything dangerous.

you literally are a lich/wrath, undead traits and all

No. If you were literally a Lich, then you could UMD a Harm scroll onto yourself. (And also your Fort save against Disintegrate would go down, not up)

Does the wraith form's 25% miss chance stack with blur/displace? I imagin its the defensive form judging from stuff like this.

It can't be defensive if it involves healing immunity.

I suspect that the healing immunity was an accident, because these undead forms would actually make sense if you could get healed somehow.

[Monkey_Archer]

Can WF enter lich form?

If so, oh snap.

Frees up a helm and belt slot (i.e. use upgraded mindsunder docent for con 6, SFL, toughness), throw helm out (since you have 100% fort in lich/wraith form), equip archmage or pale master belt. Will lose greater arcane lore (currently using blue scale docent).... but could throw a conc opp helm on and replace torc with an abbot necklace.

Unfortunately the form only lasts 3 minutes with a 5 minute cooldown so you would still need a fort item.

The description on the undead traits effect says you are treated as an undead instead of your previous race... so not sure whether reconstruct will still work if you're no longer a construct.

[rimble]

Unfortunately the form only lasts 3 minutes with a 5 minute cooldown so you would still need a fort item.

The description on the undead traits effect says you are treated as an undead instead of your previous race... so not sure whether reconstruct will still work if you're no longer a construct.

They're living constructs...so now they're undead constructs...? Still a construct? hehe

WF Monks got messed up when they hit level 20 and became outsiders, so hopefully the non-healing in undead forms is a similar mistake. Maybe a healing penalty is in order, but immune seems pretty rough.

[Raiderone]

No. At will spell, like dragonmarks, but with 6 seconds cooldown.

yes. it'll help mages stack up to sorcerers since no mana needed.
now all we need is a AOE effect....like burning hands.

at 16th lvl my mage was doing 130hp damage (Pale Master2). Don't forget
this is without TOD set which will make Necroic touch even more powerful.

gotta see if deaths sickle from mindsunder helps increase damage.

[Vhlad]

Unfortunately the form only lasts 3 minutes with a 5 minute cooldown so you would still need a fort item.

The description on the undead traits effect says you are treated as an undead instead of your previous race... so not sure whether reconstruct will still work if you're no longer a construct.

Instead of a living construct you're an unliving construct. i.e. should go from healing via positive + reconstruct to negative + reconstruct.

I assume the undead forms don't share a cooldown, since they're separate requirements and AP costs. i.e. can you get both and go lich for 3 mins, then wraith for 3 mins ?

[Bunker]

yes. it'll help mages stack up to sorcerers since no mana needed.
now all we need is a AOE effect....like burning hands.

at 16th lvl my mage was doing 130hp damage (Pale Master2). Don't forget
this is without TOD set which will make Necroic touch even more powerful.

gotta see if deaths sickle from mindsunder helps increase damage.

Death's Touch (upgraded)
Greater Void Lore
Improved Nullification IX

....there is more to the sickle, but those 2 properties of the item will add to your Necro touch ability.