Strength with Weapon Finesse

[Graark]

If I take this feat, how important is having a good strength score to my character? Does STR still determine chance to hit etc., or does that all transfer over to my DEX?

Edit - I am a low level Monk btw

[Pizzasoup]

If I take this feat, how important is having a good strength score to my character? Does STR still determine chance to hit etc., or does that all transfer over to my DEX?

I believe your to-hit chance is transferred to DEX but your bonus damage still depends on STR.

[Tobril]

To-hit will be based on dex with finesse, but you still need str for damage and to avoid str damage effects from making you helpless.

[Graark]

To-hit will be based on dex with finesse, but you still need str for damage and to avoid str damage effects from making you helpless.

Bingo! Thanks for the info. Now I know where to put my points

[xanvar]

Plus Str affects carrying capacity and combat feats such as Trip and Stunning blow. Plus it is no fun to get hit with a ray on enfeeblement and be overloaded

[Rasczak]

Plus Str affects carrying capacity and combat feats such as Trip and Stunning blow. Plus it is no fun to get hit with a ray on enfeeblement and be overloaded

...or uncentered on a monk

[Hjarki]

Weapon Finesse is a feat that you really build your character around rather than just grab on a whim. In most cases, characters with Weapon Finesse have the minimal possible Strength to qualify for whatever feats/enhancements they need. There was some reason for them to take Weapon Finesse and that reason is always intertwined with having a low Strength.

[honkuimushi]

Weapon Finesse is a feat that you really build your character around rather than just grab on a whim. In most cases, characters with Weapon Finesse have the minimal possible Strength to qualify for whatever feats/enhancements they need. There was some reason for them to take Weapon Finesse and that reason is always intertwined with having a low Strength.

That's more true in PnP or games like NWN. Without Epic levels or PrCs or more of the non-core classes there isn't as big a need to get Dex up to ridiculous levels and few ways to make up for lost damage.

And with the current incarnation of DDO placing a premium on damage and making achieving a meaningful AC a challenge only for powergamers, there are few reasons to pick up Weapon Finesse on most characters. The addition of Grazing hits devalued it even more.

The exceptions Pretty much consist of Monks, Monk splashes, and halfling and elven/ drow rogues(maybe with a Monk splash.) Monks and Monks splashes don't have to worry about max dex bonus and the class and wisdom AC bonuses make it the easiest way to build an AC character. (It's still not easy.) Rogues still will do a bunch of damage through Sneak Attack and +dex races will get up to +7 to dex through racial bonuses and racial and class enhancements. Halflings also have to deal with a strength penalty and Elves and drow get up to +2 to hit and damage with a finessable weapon. (Rapier for elves and rapier and shortsword for drow.) So in this case, Finesse is about maximising to hit.

And in both cases the standard advice is to add points to strength to max out the 1 to 1 point buy and use a +6 strength item and a tome if possible. Then take Power Attack to increase your damage even more.

Most melee charcters with a base strength of less than 12 are considered hopelessly gimped. So while your first point is valid, the second doesn't transfer to DDO very well.

[sephiroth1084]

I'd say, be sure to have at least 13 (base or base+tome) in order to acquire Power Attack eventually. Having more is certainly worthwhile as well, since Str adds to your damage.

[Maxelcat]

No finesse:

STR is your hit and dammage. regardless of what you use in melee.

with finesse:

Light weapons use your DEX to hit / STR for damage

but with non light weapons it defaults back to just STR

now while awesome, you need to look at it this way:

where are you putting your stat points. If your a DEX build, then get it. If your a STR build then dont.

If your a STR build then even if you get a +6 DEX item there's no way that bonus to hit is better than your STR + to hit

If your a DEX build then your +to hit (with light weapons) will be better than your STR + to hit with anything...

I've found:

better to have high DEX hit always (even if its for low damage with a light weapon) since high DEX also affects a saving throw... While STR doesn't.

As for ray of enfeeblement... you have a lesser restoration already on your hot keys right? even with a low STR being enfeebled to useless has only happened to me less than maybe three times... amusingly on my high STR toons...

[RobinofSpiritwood]

One feat that wipes out 1/2 your damage for a +5 to-hit bonus is Precision.

Few people talk about it, but Precision as a combat mode somewhat approximates the effect of a Weapon Finesse build. You get to hit a lot, with reduced impact per hit. It's in some ways superior to going Finesse- it is situational and reversible- so you have more flexibility, it works with every weapon out there, and if your strength is high, your Precision accuracy will be superior to Finesse builds. Much like Finesse, Precision does not affect elemental add-on damage.

You can still go with a low strength, as part of a deliberate design. If you are wealthy, you can compensate to a degree by getting suitable gear, and relying upon additional effects. D&D is a Magic-rich environment. But you'll have to concentrate thinking about ways to bypass the limitations.

With a Str of just 10 base, as a rogue, there was relative difficulty doing the kind of damage we should expect against Constructs, Undead and Elementals, without specific bane weapons. But once geared up, I'm doing well in kill counts again. Against regular monsters, the crippling strike & sneak attacks puts me way ahead of some Strength based Fighters. The thing is- Reflex saves seem to become progressively more important as you progress. Survivability is necessary, not just Damage Output.

[sephiroth1084]

Precision might be useful on some builds early in the game when monster AC tests our ability to hit more than late game where everyone hits on a 2+ with a few buffs (and no arguing here, as I melee with my 14 Str Wizard frequently!). That said, I don't think it is ever worth wasting a feat on. Yes, the game is not just DPS, but you lose too much to gain very little. A character would be better off just dropping their fancy weapons for ones with the highest to-hit bonus available (highest base enhancement plus Righteousness), and investing in enhancements that benefit your attack bonus. Oh, and make sure to flank.