One Vital Feat for Hybrids

[Caervas]

I'll keep this short and too the point, unlike what I usually do.
A feat that would enable a score of good combinations of classes, usable to any build that both has caster levels and non-caster levels:

Practiced Spellcaster

This feat (originally posted in "Complete Arcane") increases caster level by 4, up to the maximum of the character's total class levels.

Example:
A Fighter 3/Wizard 5 with this feat, will have access to spells (and sp) as a 5th level wizard, but the numerical value for all spells will be increased to 8. If the character instead was Ftr 13/Wiz 7, caster level would be 11.

The original requirement for the feat was spellcraft 4, but I'm sure you can figure out a new one with naught but imagination.

I feel it is unecessarry to explain how immensely useful this feat will be to many of the builds that are currently considered "gimped", and many others as well.

-Caervas

[Angelus_dead]

This has been suggested many times before. Note that to make it work in DDO you'd have separate feats for Practiced Wizard, Practiced Cleric, etc.

In earlier versions of the game it would have been bad to include Practiced Paladin and Practiced Ranger, but after the addition of tier 3 specialties and capstones that no longer matters much.

[Duskslayer]

Hmm.. even though I almost always make hybrids, and almost always have spellcaster levels peppered in... I dont know if this is a good thing.

Why should a level Fighter-3/Wizard-5 level be granted access to level 8 numerics?

I mean.. if a pure wiz-8 duels a hybrid wiz-5, and they both cast the same spell... why should they match? Clearly one person has concentrated training in one area, while other is spread out.

I know you wish to be able to charm, snare, etc end level mobs - but clearly that is NOT what you're trained to do since you chose to spread your experience.

Also, by your suggestion... If I was a make an odd build of cleric/wizard/bard I would have numerics of all 3 match that of 3 pure-breds?



And what about the benefits you gain from melee-class levels? (eg the 20+ weapon feats, armors, etc) dont that count for something?

Plus, next thing we'll get is people asking for more BAB-numerics for the few melee-levels they took to match that of a level 20 pure-bred fighter??


While you have the correct notion at heart.. it dont add up I think.

[Lorien_the_First_One]

I'll keep this short and too the point, unlike what I usually do.
A feat that would enable a score of good combinations of classes, usable to any build that both has caster levels and non-caster levels:

Practiced Spellcaster

This feat (originally posted in "Complete Arcane") increases caster level by 4, up to the maximum of the character's total class levels.

Example:
A Fighter 3/Wizard 5 with this feat, will have access to spells (and sp) as a 5th level wizard, but the numerical value for all spells will be increased to 8. If the character instead was Ftr 13/Wiz 7, caster level would be 11.

The original requirement for the feat was spellcraft 4, but I'm sure you can figure out a new one with naught but imagination.

I feel it is unecessarry to explain how immensely useful this feat will be to many of the builds that are currently considered "gimped", and many others as well.

-Caervas

It's been suggested before, and its still a good idea.

This would be a great boon to things like 18bard/2melee, 18wiz/2rogue, etc. I'm not sure how many classes would take advantage of the full 4 given the power of level 18 in this game, but it might even make some 16/4 mixes make sense.

This and energy substitution and energy admixture are the three feat most lacking in this game for casters.

[Creddi]

The pure 8 will have firewall. The multi 5/? won't.

The melee side doesn't work the way you object to either. Yes you lose BAB as a 5 ftr /3 wiz over a 8 fighter, but near as I can tell BAB isn't as important proportionally to casting DC.

[Kaervas]

It's been suggested before, and its still a good idea.

This would be a great boon to things like 18bard/2melee, 18wiz/2rogue, etc. I'm not sure how many classes would take advantage of the full 4 given the power of level 18 in this game, but it might even make some 16/4 mixes make sense.

This and energy substitution and energy admixture are the three feat most lacking in this game for casters.

If these three feats made it into the game I would pee my pants in joy (mostly regarding Wall of Fire, Cone of Cold and Polar Ray).

The complication I see is how the enhancement lines would work.
Would Wall of Fire always use your Fire/Cold lines no matter what you turned it into?
Or would Wall of Fire turned to Acid require the Acid/Electricity lines?
Both have their pros and cons.

Not to mention my 2 rogue levels wouldn't feel so deadweight when everyone's jumping over or ignoring traps. *Almost* makes me appreciate the ridiculous elite trap damage, it's good for business :P

[Caervas]

I don't consider this an overpowered feat:
DC will always be dependant on the caster ability score instead of level. In most cases this feat will just increase either damage or duration, all other effects will stay put.

Even if a fireball from a wiz 5/ftr 3 and a wizard 8 would be the same number of d6, doesnt mean they will do the same damage. A pure caster will gain the benefit of 4th level spells, as well as have access to higher level enhancements for improving spell damage.

Now for something completely different (which sorta spurred my motivations for making this thread):

Multiclassing is something that makes DDO stand out, its a great way to reward players for being creative and demanding of their own playstyle. Its critical that the developers do not forget to make multiclass characters more viable.
If you start searching the class/character build forums, you will see throngs of builds suggested that are created by new players seeking to make the system their own. With so many combinations so inaccessible, the failure rate is rather high, -making the inspiration for making new characters sort of a treacherous minefield.

I know similar posts like this one are abundant on the forums, but after seeing the way the game is developed, I feel that its important to stress this fact. Prestige enhancements as an example, are all (except maybe warchanter) based on specifying a class to a specialist of one of its former domains. Comparing to PnP, you see two specific strains of prestige classes; the ones that specialise a character, and those who make building hybrids (multiclass combinations) an easier path. Its important not to forget these in the latter category in DDO.
I do not know if there are many who share my view on this matter, but it seems there is sort of a vacuum of discussion about this.

-Caervas

[AylinIsAwesome]

I have to say I really, really like this idea.

So...

/signed


It might be good to have one of these feats per caster class perhaps, that you need a minimum number of levels in say Cleric before you can take it, and then you get the Cleric one, and so on. Maybe.

[Mylon]

Practiced spellcaster only increases spell level for the purpose of damage, duration effects, penetrating SR, etc. It has no bearing on spells per day or spells known.

This is what makes it balanced, as it doesn't let a wizard pick up 4 free levels of fighter.

[baddax]

/signed.
Sounds good and doesnt appear unbalancing.

[AylinIsAwesome]

Practiced spellcaster only increases spell level for the purpose of damage, duration effects, penetrating SR, etc. It has no bearing on spells per day or spells known.

This is what makes it balanced, as it doesn't let a wizard pick up 4 free levels of fighter.

Though it WOULD allow me to make a good Fighter/Wizard*, like those ones I keep killing on my lowbies when I farm House P quests!


*: Mine wouldn't suck like those do though.

[Caervas]

I have to say, making a passable fighter/mage is my honest intention of suggesting this feat for DDO; that other multiclass characters find it usable is of course a bonus. This game really needs a better foundation for fighter/mages. Just search for terms like battlemage/warmage/eldritch knight/bladesinger/spellsword (or other similar) on the forums, and you will see hundreds of threads made by people to either suggest or ask about how to do this.

Its kinda depressing being a PnP player that always swore to that combination.