!!!impossible Color Puzzles!!!

[Delt]

Telling him to except the fact that he can't do stuff alone is like telling a one legged man to except the fact that he wont be able to go into any buildings that have stairs. Which ain't cool. Instead you tell owners of said buildings to build some ramps. Problem solved.

You analogy, besides simply sucking, is misplaced.

Turbine/DDO isn't an essential service. It isn't a matter of accessibility or safety. It has nothing to do with bylaws pertaining to discrimination (disability).

DDO is a game. Entertainment. Just like any entertainment, Turbine caters to a specific portion of the population. Translations into other languages and accessibility for disabled go beyond the scope of the target. Turbine has no need or requirement to alter the game to address those issues UNLESS it is financially motivated to do so.

Given that in my 3+ years, I've seen maybe 3 "I am colourblind!!" topics, I'd say there is zero reason for them to care. Frankly, I'd rather Turbine fix the blank favor panel, the ring sets, the broken capstones and add the missing PrE's, a new set of capstones, new crafting, new races, guild housing first...then maybe we can look at helping the handful of people that choose to run headlong into the proverbial brick wall without a helmet or a spotter

[Hokiewa]

The OP isn't asking for the game to be made easier or demanding anything unreasonable he is asking for a chance to experience the game just like everyone else.

Telling him to except the fact that he can't do stuff alone is like telling a one legged man to except the fact that he wont be able to go into any buildings that have stairs. Which ain't cool. Instead you tell owners of said buildings to build some ramps. Problem solved.

Comparing a one legged man climbing stairs to a handful of quests in a voluntary game is intellectually dishonest. I would've expected more from you. Actually, this issue has existed since Beta, since the Devs haven't addressed it, it's obviously not a priority.

While I don't have an issue with presenting some type of option, this isn't a major issue nor should it be. Once a door is opened, you can't start excluding people from entering it.....Think about it....

[Dawn_Falcon]

the epileptic issue you quoted is an issue of litigation

Actually, it was already being addressed before that and is an acknowledged issue well beyond America today. Y'talking to someone who's had to adjust some of his work to get round a potential issue (slight colour and frequency change, all fixed!) in this field.

Adding an alternate pallet for colour-blind people doesn't make the game any easier or harder, it simply enables them to play as the designers intended. That's why it's appropriate, and it's far more common an issue than you might think.

[Furbitor]

I just tried to run The Pit, and I'm as mad as a kobold at a kissing convention!

It's not my stinkin fault!!! I'm COLORBLIND. From Birth. There's nothing I can do about it. Lots of men are colorblind... SO WHY THE FREAKIN HECK AREN'T THE COLOR PUZZLE's KEY PANELS FREAKIN LABELED, LIKE STINKIN CRAYONS ARE?!?!?!

/Signed!!


I too am partially colorblind and have God's own time tiring to deduce colors.

Saddly, the only way I get around this is memorization. And counting. \

And I always get shafted to do the reaver's puzzle, its not too difficult but I must count the turns to get the colors right.

I always get someone that spins a wheel when I get knocked down. but I wind up losing count, and I quit right there!

furb

[atkbeast]

I agree that it would be helpful if there were an additional palat for the wheels. I too am partially color blind, but have never used it as an excuse for anything as the OP seems to. The real issue with being color blind is not being unable to see colors, but how our brains interpret what we see.

I have few issues with the wheels in game, but sometimes in the Crucible, I have to look twice to make sure I dont mix up blue and green. But for the Reaver, it is the green and yellow that will confuse me. Unlike Furb, I have not had the willingness to try the puzzle even though I know I can do it.

One option to help could be something as simple as posting pictures of runes and wheels in the compendium as an example of what will be faced in game. It would give an example of what is in game, but also allow color blind players to see them and allow their brains a chance to assimilate the differences. The ideal would be another way in game, but that is proabably a ways off.

My 2 cp.

[CrustyMedic]

/signed, colour blind too.

[Kriogen]

/signed

Not color blind, but should not be hard to add some symbols or runes or something to all those color puzzles. And even if its hard, its money. You don't want to lose subs because of something like that, do you? It also gives DDO a bad rep.

@Devs:
Use Goggle and search for something like "color blind computer programs". You'll get tones of pages with usefull info and tools. In most cases it's not even hard to make program more colorblind friendly. In most cases, it doesn't take much work and is pure profit.

P.S:
It is pure profit. In company i work, we did fixed our apps. Our money man was very happy.

[chaos_master]

As long as it's a cosmetic change and doesn't really affect the gameplay difficulty, I can't see any reason against giving this a push.

[Kromize]

While a very real issue I suppose (although one I hadn't thought about until now), does anyone else see the irony in him using 2 other colors besides the standard white in his post???

you obviously didn't read the last part in his post...

+1 (pure genious insight).

No, not really. Especially if you can't spell genius right.

[Robi3.0]

Comparing a one legged man climbing stairs to a handful of quests in a voluntary game is intellectually dishonest. I would've expected more from you. Actually, this issue has existed since Beta, since the Devs haven't addressed it, it's obviously not a priority.

While I don't have an issue with presenting some type of option, this isn't a major issue nor should it be. Once a door is opened, you can't start excluding people from entering it.....Think about it....

I don't see how it is any different. You seem to be thinking that the one legged man's disability is man important than a color blind man's. When in fact no one disability is any more important to the person that has it, When presented with a situation like stairs for the one legged man or color puzzles for the blind man.

By your reasoning a movie theater or a quickie-mart shouldn't be made to have ramps since after all going to watch a movie or going to buy over priced snacks are all voluntary things.

Just because it isn't a priority doesn't mean it should have some kind of importance.

Step one, for the Devs would be to make sure that any new color puzzles accommodate color blind people.

Step two., should at the very least be a commitment from the Devs to fix any color existing color puzzle in game if the quest featuring that puzzle receives any work ei.. reworked like the Goodblade quests or made epic like the desert. I think that is fair and is very similar to rules imposed on real world business in regards to the handicapped.

[rezo]

I just tried to run The Pit, and I'm as mad as a kobold at a kissing convention!

It's not my stinkin fault!!! I'm COLORBLIND. From Birth. There's nothing I can do about it. Lots of men are colorblind... SO WHY THE FREAKIN HECK AREN'T THE COLOR PUZZLE's KEY PANELS FREAKIN LABELED, LIKE STINKIN CRAYONS ARE?!?!?!

WHY DO YOU THINK CRAYONS ARE LABELED FOR LITTLE KIDS?!? BECAUSE SOME OF THEM ARE FREAKIN COLORBLIND!!! Just turn your monitor black and white, and then try doing the stupid puzzle: then you'll know my frustration.

Some Examples: The Pit, Tangleroot, Haywire... FIX THEM!

CHANGE ALL OF THE STUPID COLOR PUZZLES SO THAT 'HANDICAPPED' PEOPLE LIKE MYSELF CAN DO THEM TOO. MAKE ALL THE FREAKIN THINGS 'SELECTABLES' THAT DON'T DO ANYTHING BUT TELL YOU WHAT FREAKIN COLOR THEY ARE.

Hmmmmmm.... I wonder what lawyers think of things like this?!? No Handicapped Access... Hmmmmm.....

STOP PEELING THE STINKIN LABELS OFF MY FREAKIN CRAYONS, PEOPLE!!!

This is less of a suggestion and more of a NEEDS TO FREAKIN HAPPEN kind of thing.

And yes; I used colors!!! I had to get my son to pick them out!!!

/signed, they really should do something about this.

[Lorien_the_First_One]

you obviously didn't read the last part in his post...

No, its actually pretty ignorant for someone to complain about colour choices, and then deliberately use colour choices that could frustrate others. I suppose he might have been trying to make a point but its the real problem with the OPs post. While he is right that colour marking of some kind would be helpful, and not all that hard to do (and legally required in more and more countries as we move forward) people react negatively to the style of his complaint. Rather than stating the challenge and possible solutions ("actionable feedback" as I believe Tolero calls it) he yells and screams and is generally obnoxious. That doesn't lead to people wanting to support him, it leads to people wanting to prove him wrong.

[SkyCry]

I have no idea what it's like to be colorblind, but I feel for you. Puzzles are a fun part of the game, something a lot of other MMO miss completely. That being said, I think changing the color puzzles (current and future) would be cutting a part of the game just because someone can't enjoy it, which is a no-go. So the correct solution is to add some other hints at what color the puzzle elements are, like a description when you select a wheel.

That being said, I think devs are busy doing more important things, so this might take a while. For the time being the workaround is to bring a teammate with you and ask them to either tell you what color it is or just let them solve the damned puzzle. This is a party-oriented game where different classes cover each others' weaknesses, so why not let other players cover your weaknesses? Game is much more fun in a party than alone.

[Turial]

Hmmm, Devs get on this, hes got a pretty good point, that would utterly suck! I mean wow, what would happen if this had happened in a raid that for some reason he was the only one left to do the puzzle lol? This really should be a top priority given the percentage of men with colorblindness.

I've been in raids where a colorblind individual was the only one to left alive to handle the puzzle.

We translated everything into the number of turns he needed to make to get the correct colors. It would be nice if the mouse over told you what color it was currently on though.

[Kromize]

No, its actually pretty ignorant for someone to complain about colour choices, and then deliberately use colour choices that could frustrate others. I suppose he might have been trying to make a point but its the real problem with the OPs post. While he is right that colour marking of some kind would be helpful, and not all that hard to do (and legally required in more and more countries as we move forward) people react negatively to the style of his complaint. Rather than stating the challenge and possible solutions ("actionable feedback" as I believe Tolero calls it) he yells and screams and is generally obnoxious. That doesn't lead to people wanting to support him, it leads to people wanting to prove him wrong.

True. Also he makes it knowledgeable that he could have had his son help with the puzzle in-game as well. And using colors, that, as you states "could frustrate others". While being obnoxious, and overly angry. However, he does have a point about the colorblind people out there who may need assistance.

p.s.- Watch out for The Twilight Forge. Don't go into the wrong tunnel, they are color coded as well.

[Natulyre]

1. Don't solo the pit as there is no solo difficulty.

2. Ask for people experienced with the puzzle in your LFM

3. If you're that much of a donkey and still wanna do the puzzle alone, Theres programs for colorblind people that changes colors displayed by your monitor

(Bonus) 4. Anyone tried the Phasewalk (Or however its called) spell? I'm pretty sure it changes surrounding colors.

If it still doesn't work or you're still mad: World isn't fair, get used to it and I'm pretty sure theres way more thing than colorblindness that affect gaming experience: People that always get lost, Peeps that just can't stay focused, Deaf players, Muted and illiterate players, People with slow reflexes... Only a few of all these problems are acknowledged by the media and such, which is why you'll rarely see systems that help people with other problems than colorblindness and such... Pretty unfair heh?

I gotta say that the OP must have had a bunch of crayons up his... pancake, crazy rants will get you nowhere. Also DDO, isn't essential, nor is it a public service, Do they even show movies in colorblind mode at the theater? Not really.

Oh and i almost forgot, I don't think devs will work on this anytime soon (Aka before 2020) if they ever decide to add a colorblind mode.

[Twidger]

Seriously? Wow, you guys are quick to jump all over someones case who doesn't agree with your "morals".. So if a mentally challenged person wanted to play DDO, but found it impossibly hard, should they make it accessible for him or her too? Should they dumb the game down so far that even a 2 year old can play it? I wasn't saying "special needs" is a bad word by the way, just that these things can be pushed too far, and by changing one thing, it opens the door for everything else. Geeze you guys can overreact.

The slippery slope argument is generally a logical fallacy. I'm going to say it is in this case. The company has full control over what they do or do not implement in the game. If a request is reasonable and not cost prohibitive, and improves the game experience for a good number of people without inconveniencing others, then there's no reason not to add it. Your example was facetious, and would not meet many of the above criteria. I think while the tone of the original post was childish, the request wasn't unreasonable.

[Cedwin]

If a request is reasonable and not cost prohibitive, and improves the game experience for a good number of people without inconveniencing others, then there's no reason not to add it.

How many threads have you seen complaining about the colors? I've seen maybe 4 in the past 3 years I've been playing this game. I've seen mac users ask for a mac version of this game more than I've seen colorblind people ask for changes to the game. (but that's a group that I don't even want to discuss. )

I see no reason to spend developer time on this, no more than they should add in custom keymapping and macros for one handed players. I've read a few posts from people who play this game who only have one hand, and you know what? They found a way around it on their own.

As a previous poster mentioned, there are programs that you can get that will alter the colors on your screen to a more colorblind palette. The OP may have discovered this sooner if he would have asked nicely, but he went on a rant, so this thread ended up going on way longer than it should have.

[sephiroth1084]

Seriously? Wow, you guys are quick to jump all over someones case who doesn't agree with your "morals".. So if a mentally challenged person wanted to play DDO, but found it impossibly hard, should they make it accessible for him or her too? Should they dumb the game down so far that even a 2 year old can play it? I wasn't saying "special needs" is a bad word by the way, just that these things can be pushed too far, and by changing one thing, it opens the door for everything else. Geeze you guys can overreact.

If the change to accommodate someone who doesn't impact anyone else playing, why shouldn't it be done? We're not talking about rebuilding the game to make it accessible to someone thinking on a the level of a 4 year old, we're talking about adding a word that says "color" next to some symbols.

That's a completely different order of magnitude. Arguing otherwise isn't just insensitive, it's downright asinine.

As for compensating for one's own deficiencies...when possible, many people do so. Haven't you ever seen the athletes who compete in various events without legs or what have you? But that isn't really applicable here, as what can someone who is colorblind do?

Do you picket public offices that install wheelchair accessible ramps as well?

[Cedwin]

If the change to accommodate someone who doesn't impact anyone else playing, why shouldn't it be done? We're not talking about rebuilding the game to make it accessible to someone thinking on a the level of a 4 year old, we're talking about adding a word that says "color" next to some symbols.

Did you read any further in the thread, or is everyone going to quote something from the beginning of page 2? My main point being, opening the door to one change like this means that anyone can walk through that door. Take for example, a ton of people over in lotro suggested that they should add "marriage" to the game, so that one character can marry another. Then we have posts asking to allow same sex marriage in game. Then we have posts complaining that it's not moral to allow same sex marriage, etc. etc. etc. In the end, marriage was not included.