Cleave and bludgeon 2h Q

[Mojofizznut]

I'm guessing Cleave and Greater Cleave are really designed for thf yes? You would want the maximum damage in the aoe sweep right? So building these two skills on a twf is really sort of useless I would guess -- or is the damage with dual wielding or s&b using cleave sufficient to hold aggro on a mob with intimidate clicks while casters and others pound away?

Also, I'm noticing in a lot of fighter builds folks are choosing slash and piercing focus, but I rarely see bludgeon. Why is this and not bludgeon more? What is the thf bludgeon weapon? Quarterstaff bites from what I'm reading, and looking at enhancements is it greater club? What are the 1h and 2h bludgeon weaps of choice? The 1h warhammer is only 1d8 vs say dwarven axe or khopesh at 1d10.

Is there something like a two handed warhammer? I must have missed something -

[WeaselKing]

There is the maul which is two handed with a 20/x3 crit, I think it is 1d10 base damage. So basically it is like a bludgeoning greataxe with one less damage on average (greataxe is 1d12 base dmg). I have a barbarian that uses them, although I switched to ic:slash since the only mauls I usually use are a Min II (impact) and a 5% weighted where a +1 to crit range will not mean much, however my Sword of Shadows likes the ic:slash. XD

[Angelus_dead]

I'm guessing Cleave and Greater Cleave are really designed for thf yes?

Nope.
1. It is a stretch to say that Cleave and Great Cleave were "designed" at all. They certainly don't come close to fulfilling their intended role in gameplay.
2. Cleave and Great Cleave are primarily useful for a shield-holding character, who both doesn't have another way to get melee AOE damage, and who also has a way to reduce incoming damage while the special attack is on cooldown.

THF characters have less desire to use Cleave, because their attacks already do damage in an area. Here's a bit more information on the design flaws of Cleave.

So building these two skills on a twf is really sort of useless I would guess -- or is the damage with dual wielding or s&b using cleave sufficient to hold aggro on a mob with intimidate clicks while casters and others pound away?

Yes: Taking Cleave on a TWF character is even less helpful than on other characters.
No: "Holding aggro while casters do DPS" is not how DDO combat works.

Also, I'm noticing in a lot of fighter builds folks are choosing slash and piercing focus, but I rarely see bludgeon. Why is this and not bludgeon more? What is the thf bludgeon weapon?

They prefer slash or pierce because the weapons are better. Bludgeoning weapons are only tier 3 (Warhamer) or tier 4 (mace), while slash includes tier 1 (khopesh) and tier 2 (scimitar, etc). TIP: To check the tier of a weapon, multiply the critical threat range times the critical multiplier, minus one.

The prime THF bludgeon is the Maul, which is exactly like a two-hand warhammer.

[Mojofizznut]

No: "Holding aggro while casters do DPS" is not how DDO combat works.

1st, thanks a lot for replies all.

2nd, Yep, new to game from WoW.

Is there a primer (link plz since no stickies) on 'how to tank' in ddo then? Is aggro purely held by intimidation and you don't have to worry about a threat table, or dealing dps sufficiently?

[Angelus_dead]

Is there a primer (link plz since no stickies) on 'how to tank' in ddo then?

To have a defined "tank" character in DDO is highly rare. It can be accomplished either with Intimidate taunting or DPS, depending both on the capabilities of the character and the need for more defense vs more DPS.

The most important trait of a DDO tank is ability to survive, which is most noticeably limited by your hitpoint total, preventing any single attack from killing you. Of course reducing incoming damage is important too... but holding aggro is actually less of a factor towards success. You see, DDO doesn't have the "enrage" feature widespread in WOW, which puts a time limit on how long you can spend fighting a boss before it decides to eat you. If a DDO tank can't hold aggro, the group can simply tell the DPS characters to slow it down.

In fact, you can actually have the DPS guys leave entirely and just let the tank kill the boss on his own, while being healed extensively. That technique is called the "hero method". Of course it's irritatingly slow, so it's always preferable to get as much other people helping DPS as you can.

You might like to search around for a thread called "DDO Introduction for WOW players", which should cover some major differences.

[Mojofizznut]

Great, thank you for taking the time and explaining.

Cheers