The need for more HP and other changes for Epic quests

[Strakeln]

Your spell choices leave much to be desired, although it's clear to me that you play almost all melees and have that kind of gameplay in mind. Incendiary Cloud, Delayed Blast Fireball and Meteor Swarm are all incredibly useful. One reason why: Abbot. Second reason why: Epic Wizking. An arcane caster using disintegrate in the Abbot is making a poor choice, since many of his spells are wasted on the Abbot's mantle.

I wouldn't make any spell choices based on the Abbot. His mantle bug can apply to DBF as well, even an indirect hit. Incendiary cloud makes no sense for the Abbot, whatever paltry damage it does to him is meaningless when everyone not casting or in melee are tossing boulders @ 200 a pop.

[Monkey_Archer]

I wouldn't make any spell choices based on the Abbot. His mantle bug can apply to DBF as well, even an indirect hit. Incendiary cloud makes no sense for the Abbot, whatever paltry damage it does to him is meaningless when everyone not casting or in melee are tossing boulders @ 200 a pop.

Agreed. Firewall the spawns... use that dex to toss meteors

[Aspenor]

I wouldn't make any spell choices based on the Abbot. His mantle bug can apply to DBF as well, even an indirect hit. Incendiary cloud makes no sense for the Abbot, whatever paltry damage it does to him is meaningless when everyone not casting or in melee are tossing boulders @ 200 a pop.

This is completely irrelevant. A sorcerer should never stop casting at the Abbot. Incendiary cloud may do relatively little damage, but it is a damage over time effect that will take off a couple thousand hit points by the time the raid is over. Not a single DBF has ever failed for me. I hit an Incendiary Cloud if he moves out of one, and spam DBF. Your 200 a pop boulder is paltry when a sorcerer his dealing, on average, 600 damage per second.

[Monkey_Archer]

This is completely irrelevant. A sorcerer should never stop casting at the Abbot. Incendiary cloud may do relatively little damage, but it is a damage over time effect that will take off a couple thousand hit points by the time the raid is over. Not a single DBF has ever failed for me. I hit an Incendiary Cloud if he moves out of one, and spam DBF. Your 200 a pop boulder is paltry when a sorcerer his dealing, on average, 600 damage per second.

yeah... 200 damage on a .5 second cooldown is way less damage then < 600 on a 2 second cooldown...

[Aspenor]

yeah... 200 damage on a .5 second cooldown is way less damage then < 600 on a 2 second cooldown...

and spell crits for 1800, and incendiary cloud ticking down.....

throwing boulders cannot remotely touch a well played sorcerer's damage output, and FWIW, it takes longer than half a second to throw another boulder.

[Strakeln]

Meh... I just figure there's more efficient uses of your time. Casting IC means you're not swapping between DBF/MS/Disintegrate. That pretty much goes along with your "600 DPS" point. While I wouldn't recommend a sorc toss boulders, in this case, you'd be better off tossing a boulder or two instead of casting IC.

[Maegin]

*popcorn*

Interesting views.

[Aspenor]

Meh... I just figure there's more efficient uses of your time. Casting IC means you're not swapping between DBF/MS/Disintegrate. That pretty much goes along with your "600 DPS" point. While I wouldn't recommend a sorc toss boulders, in this case, you'd be better off tossing a boulder or two instead of casting IC.

Not true, at all. The added ticks of damage more than make up for your lost time where you could have tossed a boulder (which i am still finding hilarious, boulders.....the only class I can see this being a good idea for is a rogue). You underestimate the compounding damage effect of the IC over time.

It takes all of 2 or so to cast IC, and over time it will put out somewhere around 1000 damage. Throwing boulders will do maybe, and I'm being generous, 500 damage in 2 seconds but has no DOT. The benefits of casting IC are backward-loaded, but they outweigh throwing boulders by a significant margin.

[Juggle]

I read so many of these threads but all I ever really hear is "wah wah wah" Everyone always has something to complain about, whether that be a quest being too easy, or too hard. DDO players never seem to be satisfied. Epic quests are just like anything else that's new to the community. Remember when the Shroud came out and many people thought it was impossible? And two clerics were REQUIRED sometimes three, and if you wanted to get into a VOD. on sarlona at least, you had to be ready with 2 major pot donations to even get in. Turbine releases new content, we find a way to make the quest, which was hard at first, a routine, then complain about no new content. And I can't count on 5 hands the amount of threads I read about people complaining about the difficulty of The Abbot. The Abbot is fun and easy, just people are too impatient to learn it and just complain that it requires some keyboard skills rather than soley clicking a mouse and drinking a pot. These types of things like EPIC quests and Abbot are something for the player-base to work on, something challenging and exciting that will keep us working and keep us busy. Yeah, epic quests requires epic players. Players that can adjust their toon accordingly and figure out efficient ways to accomplish something challenging, whether that means making yourself a shroud HP item for more survivability, or exchanging a feat or two out for toughness. And I don't bother reading long replies so I don't blame you if you don't want to read mine haha.

[Maegin]

I read so many of these threads but all I ever really hear is "wah wah wah" Everyone always has something to complain about, whether that be a quest being too easy, or too hard. DDO players never seem to be satisfied. Epic quests are just like anything else that's new to the community. Remember when the Shroud came out and many people thought it was impossible? And two clerics were REQUIRED sometimes three, and if you wanted to get into a VOD. on sarlona at least, you had to be ready with 2 major pot donations to even get in. Turbine releases new content, we find a way to make the quest, which was hard at first, a routine, then complain about no new content. And I can't count on 5 hands the amount of threads I read about people complaining about the difficulty of The Abbot. The Abbot is fun and easy, just people are too impatient to learn it and just complain that it requires some keyboard skills rather than soley clicking a mouse and drinking a pot. These types of things like EPIC quests and Abbot are something for the player-base to work on, something challenging and exciting that will keep us working and keep us busy. Yeah, epic quests requires epic players. Players that can adjust their toon accordingly and figure out efficient ways to accomplish something challenging, whether that means making yourself a shroud HP item for more survivability, or exchanging a feat or two out for toughness. And I don't bother reading long replies so I don't blame you if you don't want to read mine haha.

Wall of text hits you for 2,605 ponts of damage.

lol

But, if you actually read, they have some interesting points, and its fun to see where its going and opinions

[Monkey_Archer]

and spell crits for 1800, and incendiary cloud ticking down.....

throwing boulders cannot remotely touch a well played sorcerer's damage output, and FWIW, it takes longer than half a second to throw another boulder.

The biggest difference being that boulders dont cost sp...

Even assuming the abbot fails every save, spamming DBF only does about 2x the dps of boulders...

You need a pretty high dps group to make going through all your sp in 1 minute be considered "well played"... not that it never happens that way of course...

[Junts]

The biggest difference being that boulders dont cost sp...

Even assuming the abbot fails every save, spamming DBF only does about 2x the dps of boulders...

You need a pretty high dps group to make going through all your sp in 1 minute be considered "well played"... not that it never happens that way of course...

I alternate dbf/disintegrate (some meteors now, but they aren't really more reliable dps yet since I don't yet have one of those silly regalias) on the abbot, and rarely manage to blow through my whole bar before we kill the guy. He doesnt have that much hp, and most groups have the d ps to kill him in less than 2 minutes.

If you're having issues with sp in the abbot at lv 20, its probably because you're short manning or running in a group where people are inadequately equipped, a lot of them are in the water, or with an excessive amount of non-dpsing bards and clerics.

I used to use a pot or two alternating exactly the same dps combination back at 16 before we'd kill him, but dps output is so much higher now that I don't have that opportunity despite having 500 more sp .. I end most abbots with sp remaining, and I do everything I can to get rid of spell points as fast as possible (hence even casting meteor swarm, which isnt yet a better sp/damgae ratio than dbf or disintegrate, without a regalia).

[Monkey_Archer]

its Probably Because You're Short Manning Or Running In A Group Where People Are Inadequately Equipped

Perhaps...

[Strakeln]

Not true, at all. The added ticks of damage more than make up for your lost time where you could have tossed a boulder (which i am still finding hilarious, boulders.....the only class I can see this being a good idea for is a rogue). You underestimate the compounding damage effect of the IC over time.

It takes all of 2 or so to cast IC, and over time it will put out somewhere around 1000 damage. Throwing boulders will do maybe, and I'm being generous, 500 damage in 2 seconds but has no DOT. The benefits of casting IC are backward-loaded, but they outweigh throwing boulders by a significant margin.

Okay, you keep on telling yourself IC is a better choice to cast instead of two other damage spells... eventually it will come true!

[Junts]

Okay, you keep on telling yourself IC is a better choice to cast instead of two other damage spells... eventually it will come true!

a single ic cast on him in theory would do more damage, but it would be very limited by teleport frequency; after about 25-30 seconds of sitting in the cloud, it will have done more damage than a single dbf.

The problem is, hes almost never in one place for that long anymore .. prior to mod9, it was definitely a better idea to cast that spell.

[Strakeln]

a single ic cast on him in theory would do more damage, but it would be very limited by teleport frequency; after about 25-30 seconds of sitting in the cloud, it will have done more damage than a single dbf.

The problem is, hes almost never in one place for that long anymore .. prior to mod9, it was definitely a better idea to cast that spell.

Per his numbers and "compounding" damage, one IC will do 1000 dmg.

In the 2 second cast time, you could cast two spells, due to the 1 second global timer. Pick two out of three (MS/DBF/Disintegrate) and cast them. You know the numbers for each of these three spells, what damage would that result in?

~1400 > 1000, end of story. Without factoring in crits, of course.

And that's not even getting into multiple casts of IC...

[Aspenor]

Per his numbers and "compounding" damage, one IC will do 1000 dmg.

In the 2 second cast time, you could cast two spells, due to the 1 second global timer. Pick two out of three (MS/DBF/Disintegrate) and cast them. You know the numbers for each of these three spells, what damage would that result in?

~1400 > 1000, end of story. Without factoring in crits, of course.

And that's not even getting into multiple casts of IC...

Well at least you've stopped talking nonsense about throwing boulders. That was classic, I was having some great laughs.

You keep telling yourself that IC is a bad idea, and I'll keep killing the Abbot while you throw asteroids, deal? Considering it's pretty clear you've never even tried using the tactic, I find it a bit questionable that you'd have any clue how useful it is.

[Aspenor]

a single ic cast on him in theory would do more damage, but it would be very limited by teleport frequency; after about 25-30 seconds of sitting in the cloud, it will have done more damage than a single dbf.

The problem is, hes almost never in one place for that long anymore .. prior to mod9, it was definitely a better idea to cast that spell.

I don't see him teleporting more than twice in a fight. Often he teleports right back into the first cloud I cast.

[Junts]

I don't see him teleporting more than twice in a fight. Often he teleports right back into the first cloud I cast.

Ahh my experience is that he teleports about once every 15 seconds or so, and I expect 4-5 per fight in the 90 sec or so it takes to take him down.

[Strakeln]

Well at least you've stopped talking nonsense about throwing boulders. That was classic, I was having some great laughs.

You keep telling yourself that IC is a bad idea, and I'll keep killing the Abbot while you throw asteroids, deal? Considering it's pretty clear you've never even tried using the tactic, I find it a bit questionable that you'd have any clue how useful it is.

I think you need to take a deep breath and read what I wrote regarding boulders a little closer