You Win a Roll on a +4 Tome and Someone Else takes it. What Should You Do?

[PhoenixFire31]

While yes what happened to you sucks, all the posting in the world will not fix what happened. Don't group with the Sorc again (or do, it really is up to you) and move on.

[Yajerman01]

Its a very rare tome just as +2 tomes were not too long ago. From what the OP has stated it sounds like the ranger was genuine however it sounds a little fishy to me in regard to the sorc. but I wasn't there and the facts presented are ambiguous at best.

But for purposes of argument on whether a tome is right for someone, WHO ARE YOU TO SAY?

No one here can say that a tome is not useful for a person, period. There are way too many semantics going on here.

I can argue a tome for each stat regardless of class. As such, the question comes down to who is it more useful for? Answer? Doesn't matter, if its useful, its useful.

Items on the other hand are another issue, but tomes are a completely different beast when it comes to looting.

And no, I will read any/all tomes I loot and will roll IF its a + higher tome I havent already read.

Consider the ranger put it up for roll in general tells me it was a free for all. I would have rolled on it then.

As for me, I am usually specific if its a tome I have already read and I dictate who can roll on it and then I will generalyl wait till everyone leaves the raid before I distribute it because in the end - too many liars and con-men who try to trick people out of thier tomes.

[Enochroot]

Its a very rare tome just as +2 tomes were not too long ago. From what the OP has stated it sounds like the ranger was genuine however it sounds a little fishy to me in regard to the sorc. but I wasn't there and the facts presented are ambiguous at best.

But for purposes of argument on whether a tome is right for someone, WHO ARE YOU TO SAY?

No one here can say that a tome is not useful for a person, period. There are way too many semantics going on here.

I can argue a tome for each stat regardless of class. As such, the question comes down to who is it more useful for? Answer? Doesn't matter, if its useful, its useful.

Items on the other hand are another issue, but tomes are a completely different beast when it comes to looting.

And no, I will read any/all tomes I loot and will roll IF its a + higher tome I havent already read.

Consider the ranger put it up for roll in general tells me it was a free for all. I would have rolled on it then.

As for me, I am usually specific if its a tome I have already read and I dictate who can roll on it and then I will generalyl wait till everyone leaves the raid before I distribute it because in the end - too many liars and con-men who try to trick people out of thier tomes.

so ... who are we to say who can use a tome, but when you put it up for roll, you dictate who can roll on it?

... nice.

[Maxmillian]

According to your account, you did the classy thing. You questioned the sorc who did not give you an opportunity to discuss the matter...as he recalled with your apparent tome. The class comes in when you did not accept a +2 tome from the ranger, and props to the ranger for being cool about it as well. Again this is all on face value from your account only, but playing Argo primarily, I have seen a bunch of pretty nasty behaviors. "Whats fair is fair, and unfair is still fair to perception". Good luck in your endeavours.

[Hendrik]

before the roll, shoulda been assigned to the sorc. after the roll, it should've gone to whoever won the roll and the raid leader should have hung himself in shame that he let something that monstrous occur

Wait Tot, you advocate just giving it to the SORC BEFORE any roll so he can just take off with it?

Your telling me that my loot should to be assigned to someone before I decide what I want to do with it in some naive belief he will not take off with it or put it up for roll?

So if you pull a 4 INT Tome you will automatically just give it to the WIZ and let him/her decide what to do with it???

The only person in that party that should be ashamed is the one person that did not live up his/her own 'putting it up for a roll'.

Dishonest and shameful actions to say the least.

[norman_quickfinger]

Alittle note on favored souls. As he said he's spec'ed for healing not fighting. A healing favored soul goes for s.p.(charisma) not d.c(wisdom). Remember f.s.s get the same bonus for sp.s as sorcs. And from reading this thread if that server is that bad on players doing this then pay to have your toons transfered to another server.

[Hendrik]

so ... who are we to say who can use a tome, but when you put it up for roll, you dictate who can roll on it?

... nice.

IF it has his name on it when the Chest is opened, he can do anything with it he desires.

If open rolling is announced then people need to stand by there statements and follow through.

[Yajerman01]

so ... who are we to say who can use a tome, but when you put it up for roll, you dictate who can roll on it?

... nice.

You want to misinterpret that, thats okay. Im stating in general who are we to say that a person has no use for a tome be it class or whatnot. That has been the continued argument in this thread.

I dictate how I distribute a tome however is not hypocritical in any fashion because I choose to distribute it first to favored classes first. For example if it IS a +4 CHA tome I look for people who generaly use that key stat more then others. So my line of thinking is:

1. Sorc
2. FVS/Paldine/UMD
3. Anyone else that wants it (general roll)

Now if it was a +4 con tome - id let everyone roll on it if I did not have a freind or guildy with me.

Is that clearer for you?

[Baranor]

If you won the roll, the person putting it up for rolls should have honored the roll. It was shady to have handled things like that.

The real issue comes down to the person that pulled it. Personally I would have passed it straight up to the Sorc. After all its your loot and if you want to pass it straight up to the class that will most benefit from it, then by all means, do it..

personally I would have looted the **** tome and eaten it in front of everyone
I'm sick of this nonsense need/greed BS. I play this game to improve my characters not someone else's especially some nonguildie that I prob wont even group with for a month or so.

Lets see...

+4 cha

FvS: About 40ish more SP

Sorc: + 2 DC to all spells, + more SP

The choice seems pretty obvious.

do you honestly think a high level sorc(possible capped) hasn't had a tome yet?
more than likely we're talking about the sorc saving some AP at best

[shinmade]

personally I would have looted the **** tome and eaten it in front of everyone
I'm sick of this nonsense need/greed BS. I play this game to improve my characters not someone else's especially some nonguildie that I prob wont even group with for a month or so.


do you honestly think a high level sorc(possible capped) hasn't had a tome yet?
more than likely we're talking about the sorc saving some AP at best

Lets see here mr Baranor.

I give you that the +2 cha tome on a 20 sorc has probably been acquired. It is still a +1 DC to spells. Sorc wins. In terms of saving AP, both classes save AP's.

So what exactly is your point here.

[Wizzly_Bear]

(or worse, wipe entire shroud groups because I'm a clueless self-righteous noob)...

better than wiping groups because of a lack of skill. also better than pinning all your failures on one person who has no control over your actions and (in)abilities. also better than relying on cheating to accomplish something so easy in a game.

[Atenhotep]

from what you've said, you did get jipped....however, i gotta ask - why would you roll on a +4 charisma tome on a fvs?

UM .. because CHA and WIS are the prime characteristics.

[Wizzly_Bear]

UM .. because CHA and WIS are the prime characteristics.

imo str/dex and con are way more important than cha. 25-50 sps is nothing in 3000. 11 base cha +6 item +2 tome = 19, all you need for casting. savings aps....some people will pull any argument out their crack the +4 wouldnt save you any inventory slot nor aps.

[Atenhotep]

Word, there's almost no reason to do this. The tome should most definitely have gone to the sorc anyway.

CHA is a major CHA for a FvS... just as it is for a sorc, just as it is for a Bard, just as it is for a Pally and even a Cleric (I need a +4 CHA and WIS on mine).

The ONLY Classes which do not rely on CHA are .. well, any fighter which is not Intimidate specced.

[Enochroot]

But for purposes of argument on whether a tome is right for someone, WHO ARE YOU TO SAY?

You want to misinterpret that, thats okay. Im stating in general who are we to say that a person has no use for a tome be it class or whatnot. That has been the continued argument in this thread.

I dictate how I distribute a tome however is not hypocritical in any fashion because I choose to distribute it first to favored classes first. For example if it IS a +4 CHA tome I look for people who generaly use that key stat more then others. So my line of thinking is:

1. Sorc
2. FVS/Paldine/UMD
3. Anyone else that wants it (general roll)

Now if it was a +4 con tome - id let everyone roll on it if I did not have a freind or guildy with me.

Is that clearer for you?

Don't these statements sort of conflict? I'm not seeing how I am "misinterpreting" anything.

[ddoer]

I don't really believe the ranger. but as the OP said he is ok, then he's ok. If you make a one million donation to a charity, will you mistakenly transferred to a wrong account? there are 12 party members and it coincidentally goes to the sorcerer?

the sorc should be blamed for not honor the roll. he has no excuse. a sorc is supposed to be neutral but not lawful, and probably he is a human sorc and human are greedy. and obviously he is not blah and he may not have the luck to get another +4 cha tome without 20 or 40 more runs. It's just like the million dollars is transferred to your bank account and you know you won't get punished for taking it. will you take it?

I have an interesting rolling experience too. My sorc won a roll over a cleric and another sorc for the Lorikk's Champion. I know it is a cleric item, and I also deadly want it, and I feel a bit guilty for winning over the cleric and try to offer a handsome amount of plats to make him feel better after I took the item. what i think is, if everyone think it is a cleric item and a sorc shouldn't roll when a cleric want it, why put up a roll at all? no one ever speak up before the roll.

I say, the sorc should be blamed (and i should be blamed for my case), and the one who set up the roll should also be blamed.

[Atenhotep]

YOur loot is your loot and no telling someone else how to play their character and it could save that Fvs an item slot for spell lvl and most sorcs or bards proably wont get a dc from it as it likely would put them at a odd number, I also wouldnt fault a monk on rolling on it.

Agreed agreed.

These ppl telling me that, should my FvS or Cleric or Pally, come across a +4 CHA Tome roll that I'm not to roll on it are kinda ****ing me off.

[Vorn]

I think it was pretty neat of the guy to put a +4 tome up for roll in the first place. I'd expect with true reincarnation coming down the road that most folks would be keeping any +4 tome regardless of what character they were playing at the time they pulled it.

As for the original question it comes down to the perceived intent--it was either a genuine mistake or malicious. In either case you just learned something. Up to you to decide what you do with that information. I'd shrug...more important things in life to worry about than a video game--what's for lunch, for example...I'm really hungry!

[Wizzly_Bear]

CHA is a major CHA for a FvS... just as it is for a sorc, just as it is for a Bard, just as it is for a Pally and even a Cleric (I need a +4 CHA and WIS on mine).

no. its not.

sorc = dc and sps
bard = dc, sps, and perform
paladin = extra saves, extra smite damage, and extra lay on hands damage
fvs = extra sps

imo paladin should actually come first for a charisma tome, then sorc, then bard, then intims and umds, then everyone else (fvs included with "everyone else")

The ONLY Classes which do not rely on CHA are .. well, any fighter which is not Intimidate specced.

what about umd specs? or any other class that wants to use SF pots without havign to equip an item? thats just as "useful" as a fvs getting it.

[Enochroot]

CHA is a major CHA for a FvS... just as it is for a sorc, just as it is for a Bard, just as it is for a Pally and even a Cleric (I need a +4 CHA and WIS on mine).

The ONLY Classes which do not rely on CHA are .. well, any fighter which is not Intimidate specced.

This is absolutely ignorant in how cha works for FvS.

There's a few actually good reasons for FvS to take a +4 cha tome, and I'm not seeing it in "healing" FvS (maybe I'm misinterpreting what a "healing" FvS is ...

- to minimize cha investment and still cast level 9 spells - and minimize enhancements/gear
- to use cha skills (umd, intim, etc)

I "assumed" (yes, maybe wrongly) - that a "healing specced FvS" would have plenty of cha to cast level 9 spells, and probably doesn't care that much about being super "tight" on cha points, and also, that a "healing specced" build wouldn't be umd/intim.


To call cha a "major" stat on FvS other than that is otherwise ridiculous. The spell point gain from cha increase is negligible - and to say it's the "same" as for a bard or a sorc is just plain stupid.