Fun Hagglebot Build

[mediocresurgeon]

I want to make a max (or near max) haggle bard for my account. I do not plan on using it for anything other than haggle, except perhaps running it through Shroud when my other characters are on timer. I also do not want to have to dump a lot of time/resources into it, because bards are not my preferred playstyle. I have tried making human max haggle bards before but I never have the willpower to play them past level 5 because they don't take an active enough role in the party for me.

Here is a bard I think I can handle.

It will be fun to play at all character levels because it will (a) find and disable traps and (b) provide tactical ranged weapon support, giving it active party roles even when done buffing. It will have massive haggle (max -1), mass cure through the shroud, provide typical party buffs, and simple crowd control.

Class: Rogue2/Bard18
Race: Human
Alignment: True Neutral

Starting Stats:
Strength: 8
Dexterity: 14
Constitution: 14
Intelligence: 12
Wisdom: 8
Charisma: 18

Final stats (no tomes):
Strength: 10 (+2 rage)
Dexterity: 22 (+1 rogue enhancement, +7 items)
Constitution: 20 (+6 item)
Intelligence: 18 (+6 item)
Wisdom: 8
Charisma: 34 (+1 human, +2 bard, +5 level-ups, +8 item)

Equipment:
Goggles: Tharne’s Goggles
Helmet: Minos Legens
Amulet: Shiona's Pendant
Trinket: Head of Good Fortune
Cloak: Stormreaver’s Napkin
Ring1: Shiona's Seal (crafted +2 exceptional charisma)
Ring2: Hotswap (Dexterity +6, Disable +15, Haggle +15, or Feather Fall as needed)
Gloves: Triple Positive Greensteel (+150 sp, +6 Charisma skills, raise dead 1/rest)
Boots: Boots of the Innocent
Belt: Knost’s Belt/Vorne's Belt/Belt of the Defender of Siberys
Bracers: Bracers of the Glacier
Robe: Blue Dragon (+2 Spell pen 7, enhanced spell crit)
Weapon1&2: Reserved for tactical repeating crossbows (such as Banishing, Cursespewing, Destruction, Paralyzing, Smiting, or Stat damage)

Spells:
Level 6:
~Charm Monster, Mass
~Cure Moderate Wounds, Mass
~Greater Shout
Level 5:
~Cure Light Wounds, Mass
~Dispel Magic, Greater
~Greater Heroism
~Shadow Walk
Level 4:
~Break Enchantment
~Dimension Door
~Freedom of Movement
~Otto’s Sphere of Dancing
Level 3:
~Displacement
~Fear
~Good Hope
~Haste
~Remove Curse
Level 2:
~Blur
~Glitterdust
~Invisibility
~Rage
~Sound Burst
Level 1:
~Detect Secret Doors
~Focusing Chant
~Hypnotism
~Merfolk’s Blessing
~Remove Fear

Skills:
Balance 4 ranks
~Total Balance: +16 (4 ranks, +2 Head, +4 Greater Heroism, +6 ability)
Concentration 22 ranks
~Total Concentration: +33 (22 ranks, +2 Head, +4 Greater Heroism, +5 ability)
Disable Device 23 ranks
~Total Disable Device: +60 (+23 ranks, +2 Head, +4 Greater Heroism, +4 ability, +7 tools, +15 hotswap item, +5 Human Skill Boost)
Haggle 23 ranks
~Total Haggle: +76 (23 ranks, +2 Head, +4 Greater Heroism, +6 greensteel, +4 Bard Haggle IV enhancement, +15 hotswap item, +12 ability, +2 Negotiator, +3 Skill Focus, +5 Human Skill Boost)
Jump 4 ranks
~Total Jump: +10 (4 ranks, +2 Head, +4 Greater Heroism)
Open Lock 4 ranks
~Total Open Lock: +43 (4 ranks, +2 Head, +4 Greater Heroism, +6 ability, +7 tools, +15 hotswap item, +5 Human Skill Boost)
Perform 21 ranks
~Total Perform: Not relevant. This build only has 21 ranks to meet class feature prerequisites.
Search 23 ranks
~Total Search: +53 (23 ranks, +2 Head, +4 Greater Heroism, +15 static item, +4 ability, +5 Human Skill Boost)
Use Magic Device 23 ranks
~Total Use Magic Device: +55 (23 ranks, +2 Head, +4 Greater Heroism, +6 greensteel, +3 Golden Cartouche hotswap, +12 ability, +5 Human Skill Boost)

Feats:
Human: Mental Toughness
01: Extend Spell
03: Exotic Weapon: Heavy Repeating Crossbow
06: Empower Healing Spell
09: Spell Pen 1
12: Spell Pen 2
15: Negotiator
18: Skill Focus: Haggle


Constructive criticism welcomed.

If you found this build helpful, please leave rep!

[mediocresurgeon]

82 views, 0 comments.
Is this build horribly gimped or something? What am I missing?

[Dacian_Falx]

It is what I am thinking of as well, only going drow, and starting with rogue for the extra skill points. That would mean taking Rapid Reload as the first feat, then Repeating X-Bow at 3, Spell Focus: Enchantment at 6 (so that you can get Spellsinger at 7 or 8), Extend at 9 and still haven't decided on the future feats (spell pen, another focus, improved crit: ranged, etc)

[mediocresurgeon]

Rapid Reload requires BAB +2, so you you multiclass to rogue within your first three character levels you have to wait until level 4 to get it.

In this build, I broke my own rule of going rogue at first level for extra skill points. Rogue at first level would not provide me the feats necessary for this build, so my first rogue level is at lvl2 and my second rogue level is at lvl10. As you can see from my skill layout, bard skills at level 1 (6x4 base) instead of rogue skills at level 1 (8x4 base) did not significantly impact this build's ability to function at cap.

[Aerendil]

Some quick thoughts:

1) no PrE listed. Are you going for Spellsinger? Your feats seem more geared towards Virtuoso, but you're all-out CHA, so...yeah, not sure what your aim is with this character. All you'll be able to do is heal and shoot pretty little bolts at enemies for negligable damage.

2) str is terribly low. Yes, I realize you're not intending to melee at all and just want to use your repeater, but still... a level 1 wizard/sorc with maximized ray of enfeeblement would practically take you out.

3) there's no need to go with a max CHA / specialized feats setup to be a great Haggler. I've never quite understood the draw of these builds. You can make a very good and functional haggler Bard without gimping yourself so that you can sell that +5 holy longsword of pure good for an extra 30 platinum :/

4) /2 Rogue is completely unnecessary, as it's generally used for Evasion. You shouldn't be ANYWHERE near the front lines with this character, and so Evasion is completely unnecessary. You're better off with a pure Bard for the capstone (+2 Cha).

5) if you do go for Spellsinger, you should rework those feats a bit to make yourself more functional / useful. Heighten is fairly good, as is Spell Focus:Enchantment. Maximize is also good to have if you plan on using greater shout.

[Dacian_Falx]

Rapid Reload requires BAB +2, so you you multiclass to rogue within your first three character levels you have to wait until level 4 to get it.

I'll take your word for it, the character planner and compendium just says you need light crossbow proficiency, but I'm new here.

In this build, I broke my own rule of going rogue at first level for extra skill points. Rogue at first level would not provide me the feats necessary for this build, so my first rogue level is at lvl2 and my second rogue level is at lvl10. As you can see from my skill layout, bard skills at level 1 (6x4 base) instead of rogue skills at level 1 (8x4 base) did not significantly impact this build's ability to function at cap.

I see it, but I just hate giving up all those extra skill points (my version goes 14 INT), especially when you can use them to max hide/move silent to help with the baby levels. If I get around to it, I'll see if I can post a drow version for comparisons sake. In essence, I wanted a spellsinging bard that could open locks and disarm traps well, not the pinnacle of the best. The only stumbling block I run into: whether I should get 11 STR on the off chance I ever want to convert him into a warchanter, but I am finding more and more that if I want to melee well, I should play a good melee character.

[Dacian_Falx]

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 3.10
DDO Character Planner Home Page

Level 20 True Neutral Drow Male
(2 Rogue \ 18 Bard) 
Hit Points: 160
Spell Points: 831 
BAB: 14\14\19\24
Fortitude: 7
Reflex: 19
Will: 10

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                 Base Stats          Modified Stats
Abilities        (Level 1)             (Level 20)
Strength             10                    11
Dexterity            16                    20
Constitution         12                    13
Intelligence         14                    15
Wisdom                8                     9
Charisma             18                    27

Tomes Used
+1 Tome of Strength used at level 7
+1 Tome of Dexterity used at level 7
+1 Tome of Constitution used at level 7
+1 Tome of Intelligence used at level 7
+1 Tome of Wisdom used at level 7
+1 Tome of Charisma used at level 7

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                 Base Skills         Modified Skills
Skills           (Level 1)            (Level 20)
Balance               6                    10
Bluff                 4                     8
Concentration         1                    15
Diplomacy             4                     8
Disable Device        6                    26
Haggle                8                    32
Heal                 -1                    -1
Hide                  7                    15
Intimidate            4                     8
Jump                  4                     5
Listen               -1                     1
Move Silently         7                    15
Open Lock             7                    21
Perform               n/a                  31
Repair                2                     2
Search                6                    14
Spot                  3                     5
Swim                  0                     0
Tumble                4                     6
Use Magic Device      8                    33

Level 1 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Rapid Reload
Enhancement: Rogue Skill Boost I
Enhancement: Rogue Disable Device I
Enhancement: Rogue Open Lock I


Level 2 (Bard)
Spell (1): Cure Light Wounds
Enhancement: Bard Concentration I
Enhancement: Bard Song Magic I
Enhancement: Bard Energy of the Music I


Level 3 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Exotic Weapon Proficiency: Repeating Heavy Crossbow
Spell (1): Charm Person
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Damage I
Enhancement: Bard Lingering Song I
Enhancement: Elven Dexterity I
Enhancement: Bard Charisma I


Level 4 (Bard)
Spell (1): Detect Secret Doors
Enhancement: Bard Extra Song I
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Attack I
Enhancement: Bard Lyric of Song I


Level 5 (Bard)
Spell (2): Cure Moderate Wounds
Spell (2): Soundburst
Enhancement: Bard Concentration II
Enhancement: Bard Song Magic II


Level 6 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Spell Focus: Enchantment
Spell (1): Focusing Chant
Spell (2): Glitterdust
Enhancement: Bard Lyric of Incredible Song I
Enhancement: Bard Energy of the Music II


Level 7 (Bard)
Enhancement: Bard Spellsinger I


Level 8 (Bard)
Spell (2): Invisibility
Spell (3): Good Hope
Spell (3): Crushing Despair
Enhancement: Bard Charisma II


Level 9 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Extend Spell
Spell (3): Haste
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Damage II
Enhancement: Bard Lingering Song II


Level 10 (Rogue)
Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity I


Level 11 (Bard)
Enhancement: Elven Dexterity II


Level 12 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Ranged Weapons
Spell (3): Displacement
Spell (4): Cure Critical Wounds
Spell (4): Otto's Sphere of Dancing
Enhancement: Bard Charisma III


Level 13 (Bard)
Spell (4): Freedom of Movement
Enhancement: Bard Lyric of Song II
Enhancement: Bard Lyric of Incredible Song II
Enhancement: Bard Wand Mastery I


Level 14 (Bard)
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Damage III


Level 15 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Greater Spell Focus: Enchantment
Spell (4): Hold Monster
Spell (5): Greater Heroism
Spell (5): Mind Fog
Enhancement: Bard Inspired Attack II


Level 16 (Bard)
Spell (5): Mass Suggestion
Enhancement: Bard Improved Spell Penetration I
Enhancement: Bard Wand Mastery II


Level 17 (Bard)
Enhancement: Bard Improved Spell Penetration II


Level 18 (Bard)
Feat: (Selected) Spell Penetration
Spell (1): Merfolk's Blessing
Spell (5): Greater Dispel Magic
Spell (6): Heroes Feast
Spell (6): Otto's Irresistable Dance
Enhancement: Bard Wand Mastery III


Level 19 (Bard)
Spell (2): Rage
Spell (6): Mass Charm Monster
Enhancement: Bard Improved Spell Penetration III


Level 20 (Bard)
Spell (3): Remove Curse
Enhancement: Bard Lingering Song III
Enhancement: Bard Haggle I

Spells need work, but that is something I need to learn and research more. Feel free to comment and compare!

[mediocresurgeon]

Going Human was very important for this build, not only for the extra feat but also for a "maximum" Haggle skill (Humans get a racial skill boost, whereas Drow do not).

I am by no means an expert at Bards, my highest level bard only making it to level 5 before deletion. My current "hagglebot" is my paladin, who has no ranks--just a +15 haggle item, greater heroism, and a decent charisma.