Fighting undead - best approach?

[crooth]

I'm a lvl5 human Paladin soloing The Catacombs and having a really hard time with skeletons and some other undead. I was using my 1H sword (Nicked Longsword - that's +1 with 1d6 frost) or 2H sword (+2 greatsword) to kill pretty much everything but suddenly these things are much harder. I have a +2 with longswords thanks to the enhancement and weapon focus, and hate to give up the 'to hit'.

But sure, I get that skeletons have damage resistance to slashing weapons but I've yet to find a mace or other blunt weapon worth having. I recently acquired a Nicked Mace (+1 with 1d6 force dmg) and certainly it does better, but I feel like I keep missing too much. Maybe I'm obsessing.

In any case, what weapon should I be looking for to fight these tougher undead? Are there undead bane weapons reasonably available at my level and if so, where (the AH is a no-go on my server.)?

[Matuse]

Undead bane tend to be silly expensive. You can try to turn in Necromatic Gems and pray to get something decent from that, but the odds are long.

The nicked longsword is suffering a double whammy, since skeletons are resistant to slashing, and flat out immune to cold. It's fine against zombies, but for skeletons you really just have to bite the bullet and get something blunt.

Light/Heavy Mace, Morningstar, Light/Warhammer, preferably holy or of pure good (these being popular, expect to pay a bit for them...TOTALLY WORTH IT), since you'll want something with those mods when you do the Delera's series. Fighting ghostly skeletons without a weapon that penetrates their DR (and that ridiculous club doesn't count) is a major PITA.

Zombies aren't too much of a problem if you don't have slashing; they have gimp AC, no element resists, and are a lot less common overall than skeletons. A nice holy/PG blunt weapon is a must-have. Obviously the dream weapon would be a holy adamantine warhammer of undead bane...if that drops, or you find it in the AH for less than the price of one of your firstborn, then be sure to pick up some lotto tickets, because you have luck to burn.

[cdbd3rd]

I'm a lvl5 human Paladin soloing The Catacombs and having a really hard time with skeletons and some other undead. I was using my 1H sword (Nicked Longsword - that's +1 with 1d6 frost) or 2H sword (+2 greatsword) to kill pretty much everything but suddenly these things are much harder. I have a +2 with longswords thanks to the enhancement and weapon focus, and hate to give up the 'to hit'.

But sure, I get that skeletons have damage resistance to slashing weapons but I've yet to find a mace or other blunt weapon worth having. I recently acquired a Nicked Mace (+1 with 1d6 force dmg) and certainly it does better, but I feel like I keep missing too much. Maybe I'm obsessing.

In any case, what weapon should I be looking for to fight these tougher undead? Are there undead bane weapons reasonably available at my level and if so, where (the AH is a no-go on my server.)?

My first answer to the question of "best approach" is,

FROM BEHIND!!

edit out Nicked Mace suggestion: *sigh* nvm.
I'll finish reading the entire post next time.


The Nicked Mace is a good thwacker til ya get ahold of a Holy or PG weapon.
Watch the House D brokers as a few turn up there.

[Failstorm666]

minor spoilers














Pillar of Light which is a possible end reward from the catacombs series blows up skeletons real good as its a PG staff and the Battleworn GS (+1 Ghost Touch GS) is awesome for zombies and the wraith

[Cedwin]

Just get a blunt weapon with holy (+2d6 dmg) or pure good (+1d6 dmg) on it.

I've been using a +1 holy quarterstaff of pure good on my ranger and it tears right through skeletons.

[Zenako]

The Nicked Mace should be awesome for low level undead. Abosolutely nothing at those levels is immune to force damage ( and the same holds pretty much true throughout the game).

You really should not be missing all that much more with the Mace vs the Longsword, unless you have a lot more than just +2 to hit things invested in Feats/Enhancements with the Longsword. A level 5 paladin with any sort of strength, should be able to handle the catacombs undead. Do you have all the other Korthos Isle goodies/clickies?

Some assumptions:
Level 5 = 5 BAB
14 STR = +2 to hit
Aid Clickie = +1 to hit
Insight Goggles = +1 to hit
Angers Wrath Set? = +2 to hit
Human Versatility Boost = +2 to hit, or damage, etc for the tough mobs.
Weapon bonus = +1 to hit.

At this point you are looking at a total to hit bonus of = 12-14 or so. Normal skeletons have AC around 10 (so hit the damage boost instead). Some of the Skeletal Warriors in PLate Armor are around AC20, so you should still be hitting them over half the time.

If you do not have those extra items I listed, it would be a worthwhile chunk of time to go get them, especially if you are soloing.


Mace for bony dudes. Slashing for Zombies.

[Jayfunked]

Don't cross the streams

[GlassCannon]

Don't cross the streams

[GlassCannon]

Use the strongest weapon you have, that has the right damage type. You want Bludgeon for Bones, Slash for Zombies, and just anything for Wights and Ghouls. For Wraiths, Specters, Shades and Shadows, a Ghosttouch weapon is preferable, but the damage type doesn't matter.

You can't get criticals or sneak attacks on undead, so factor that into "strongest weapon".

As for Ghost Skeletons, it's best to have a Holy or Pure Good weapon(Flametouched Iron weapons also deal Good damage), to get full damage when you hit them instead of 0+fire(Flaming Club) or 0 altogether(+5 Transmuting Dwarven Axe of Righteousness will still deal 0).

If your Cleric has a massive Charisma score, he/she just may be able to Turn the undead and destroy them outright. Don't forget that Undead are usually Evil, so your Holy Smites will work great on them.

[Emili]

Aye, Undead… the scourge of any melee really, weapon wear and by far count your blessings your not the dex based rogue screaming he cannot SA it.

Undead best delt with via the arcane… sorcorers and wizards truly aspire on such. Personally I do wish they’d bath (the mob that is) I find them quite dirty and olfactory offensive… thank goodness you’re disposing of the filthy smelly things.

What used to be… and quite still is a large proportion of the mob you may encounter in DDO be undead… comes to mind that little d’Jorasco clan… healing marks indeed, I think those marks ill gotten from their secret experimentations and necrophiliatic ways. I truly speculate them to be related to Norman Bates – Oh, so many skeleton’s in the Halfling closets and yet most quite tall… poor wondering strangers I suppose to meet such demise, sure they bury them but a tortured soul rest not easily - as they say you wish to hide a body- burn it.

Now then to answer you questions:

Holy and/or pure good, work very well… Flamming to a good extent. also flametouched iron, silver or transmutting in some situations.

• Ghost touch for incorperal
• Slashing for the fleshy ones
• Bludgeoning (mauls or warhammers) for the bony ones.

Should you not care to carry weapons of differing groups, be fine the procs of holy or flaming help quite a lot… Undead bane and greater undead bane are very nice especially if mixed with holy or flaming burst or such.

• Skeletons – for as agile be the little hoppers they tend to trip rather easily … a tactic you should get used to with many a mob really.
  
• By mid level they clean up much nicer – you’ll be totin’ an disruptor eventually … and then later disruption tappers off towards lvl 16+ Still much to keep around. Even while sporting green steel later I still carry a few disruptor for lower CR trash.

Awe, Catacombs – a love and hate relation with the chain… ‘bout 65? of silverflame's 400+ favor lay within… as such is scorned by many for repetitiveness. Be happy you’re not knee deep in slime while swinging at skeletons as we once were in the first few parts.To be a young Pally once again the image remains in mind…

‘T was the day Turbine released drow… My Amilia bless her, be my pride at the time level four drow pally growing quick … I was invited to group for catacombs elite … all drow btw – go figure – somewhere in the process I forgot to quest advance - I think part six? – we finished all the same. Then there he was – A handsome Drow – his name Nan, tell to me why have you not got your end reward… not that I really cared, yet his insistant demeanor and taken me by the hand we thus continued from point I screwed up… Two drow pallys – he level 5 and my level 4 – ripping thru the last three parts of catacombs elite yet again… as we parted he hugged me, I blew him a kiss, sure we grouped again yet eventually he disappeared over time.

Luck,
EimÃ*le ♥

[jjkolb]

There is a chest in one of the links of the Catacombs chain that sometimes has Dryden's Mace (if you're lucky). That mace is pretty good at killing undead types. However, you need a rogue or something to open a locked door in order to get to the chest.

[juniorpfactors]

house D/ Ah and find holy Maul with PA, or Maul of Pure good with Power attack
lots of stacks of Haste pots, and stand in a fire wall doesnt hurt much either

jrp

[crooth]

Thanks so much for the advice from everyone. I'm going to run Catacombs again just to try get a chance on that Pure Good staff and the Battleworn greatsword. Those weren't choices I remember having. Since I acquired the Nicked Mace after my only Catacombs run was done I figure I'll get a good view to its ability there.

I moved on to The Necropolis and because there are fewer skeletons there I found I was going just fine against wraiths/gouls/etc. I did make level 6 and no doubt that helps too.

So, at this point I'm level 6 and with a sword I get:

+6 BAB
+2 STR (16)
+1 Insight googles
+1 Weapon focus slashing
+1 Enhancement
+1 from the weapon bonus
= +12 total

I didn't pickup the Anger's Wrath set as I went for the Protectors Set instead and its +1 to AC. The good news is I have 28 AC standing though I am now thinking of re-running those 2 Korthos quests in order to acquire the set and try it out. I might desire the +2 to hit over the AC.

And thanks for reminding me you can't crit the undead - makes my keen +1 greatsword less valuable.

[Montin1]

I agree Holy (burst) and of pure good on weapons is the way to go with undead. Not sure if anybody mentioned (I didn't see) but divine light enchantment/skill rocks. Level 1 gives you 6d6 aoe damage with level 2 (which you can get at level 10) does 12d6. I normally run around grabbing agro of a ton load of undead then aoe nuke em. And with currently 15 divine lights that 180d6 worth of aoe damage. It's a lot faster than hitting em with a weapon!

[ghettoGenius]

I didn't pickup the Anger's Wrath set as I went for the Protectors Set instead and its +1 to AC. The good news is I have 28 AC standing though I am now thinking of re-running those 2 Korthos quests in order to acquire the set and try it out. I might desire the +2 to hit over the AC.

Unless they changed it, you can only get one complete set from Korthos as the captain will only give you 1 end reward with the set items. Not sure if this is still in effect.

[Zenako]

You can only get a complete set once. The matching part from Misery's peak is only available on the first completion.

You can however run the Cannith Crystal over and over again to pick up some Aid Bracers. Each use last 3 minutes and gives you +1 to hit and 11(13) Free HP.

Your 16 STR would be +3 to hit also.

[Vormaerin]

Skeleton Knights and Skeleton Archers tend to have unusually high AC for their level. On top of that, they are bouncy. So its a real pain to fight them. Its entirely possible that you are missing as much from them moving away as from their AC. If you are chasing them down, not only are you not getting your best attacks from the attack chain, but you are taking a -4 to hit.

[sirgog]

A couple of suggestions for fighting undead at low level:

1) It's better to beat monster DR than it is to use your best weapon. A +1 Warhammer will outperform a +2 shortsword even if you are a fighter with Weapon Focus: Piercing and Weapon Specialization: Piercing.

2) Try to force undead that like to flee up against a wall. This is particularly true of skeletal archers.

3) Kill undead in the following order:
- Undead priests first (except in Delara's Tomb where they are weaker than the arcane casters)
- Undead arcane casters second
- Wraiths and specters third (push these up to first if you have no protection from or way to remove the debuffs they cause you)
- Low-hp, low-AC melee undead fourth
- High HP or AC melee undead last.

4) Against corporeal undead, have Trip and Sunder on your hotbar. Use them often - try to trip archers, try to Sunder anything that you miss on an 8.

5) Carry a small supply of Haste potions for emergency use (to disengage from combat to heal; or to get just a little bit of extra oomph when you need it). These aren't cheap if you are new, so use them sparingly.

6) Look for excellent undead-smashing weapons on the House D brokers - sometimes you will find a little gem like the +2 Shock Maul of Pure Good I found there the other day. If you have the plat, look at the Auction House too.

7) When you hit level 8 (if you are rich), or 10-12 otherwise, look for weapons of Disruption. These annihilate all non-rednamed Undead that have low saves (and most do).

[crooth]

Unless they changed it, you can only get one complete set from Korthos as the captain will only give you 1 end reward with the set items. Not sure if this is still in effect.

Yeah I found that out last nite, sadly. I was able to get a couple AID bracers as Zenako suggested.

I messed around last night on Hard and found soling the second part of the chain (To Find a Witness) too difficult at lvl6. That's OK - I'm sure it wasn't meant to be solo'd on Hard at lvl6.

Those Skeleton Knights have high AC and are the most painful for me. I had no difficulty against the other skels and zombies though, so I'm feeling good about that.

Divine Lights (6d6) was not all that useful because an avg of 21pts of dmg didn't do near enough on Hard. However, I love the AOE, certainly and I'll likely add to it. It just wasn't the big win against those mobs at that level. I am happier with DL than I am with outright turning them as that rarely works against the mobs I want turned.

Thanks for the info sirgog - I've done most of that, but the tip about Trip/Sunder is new and one I'll try. I thought Trip was based on Dex and thus (at -1 for my 9 Dex) I was unlikely to make it work. But Sunder should and hopefully helps against those high AC knights.

[Matuse]

Be sure to wear the lesser axeblock bracers from Korthos vs skeleton knights. Helps take the edge off of their sword attacks.

And uh, yea, this can be solo'd on Hard at level 6. I did the entire quest chain solo on Hard at level 5. Course, I brought a ghost touch of pure good weapon, so it was only the zombies that gave me any real bother (well, that and the MASSIVE number of skeletons in Gerard's Tomb, since I insisted on smashing every. single...sarcophagus, but I can't complain about problems of my own making).