Clerics + Warforged relations

[Creeper]

I refuse to heal anyone who isn't a human monk/HotD with all six tiers of healing amplification.

[Tuscarora]

"
Originally Posted by Tuscarora View Post
Warforged are an abomination and never should have been allowed in the game.
You do know that they were army's in Eberron that did not need for rest, eat or breath. They were unaffect by morale, they were trough out evil, they lived forever, they were more powerful than rest of the races, they were literally touched by death and their purpose was to wipe the place from all the living.
If you can't figure out who or what they were, you can instead think what race could possibly match this kind of threat. As a hint i tell you that they are not born."

I don't like the Eberron world. I play it only because it is the only DDO world offered. Personally, I would have preferred them to bring back Blackmoor (a tip of the hat to Dave Arneson) or Greyhawk (another tip to Gary Gygax). Even ravenloft would have been preferable to Eberron. Hell, I would have taken Dark Sun, good books... crappy world.

I play my game, you play yours. I ignore the very existence of warforged and see them as poorly fabricated golems. Constructs of the twisted imagining of a wizard or wizards bent on creating a facsimile of life. But not truly a life of its own. Warforged should be destroyed and melted down for scrap. If it were my world, I would have a campaign of the the living races doing exactly that.

I don't like them, I don't play them. They are not the DnD I played or imagined. So, I don't heal them, I don't buff them, I don't interact with them unless I have no other choice. Consider me a racist against the warforged... of course, then they would have to be a race. They are not, they are a construct. Lifelessness given a semblence of life. No better than undead. Actually I am wrong there, because like I said before they make good scrap material.

So fire up the forges my brethren.... more constructs to melt down!

[BlackSmith81]

I ignore the very existence of warforged and see them as poorly fabricated golems. Constructs of the twisted imagining of a wizard or wizards bent on creating a facsimile of life. But not truly a life of its own. Warforged should be destroyed and melted down for scrap. If it were my world, I would have a campaign of the the living races doing exactly that.

Ah so you are a supporter of Merrix. Too bad. But don't worry, your puny campaign will be pointless as Umbragen will enslave lesser races like yourself. Warfoged in the other hand have proven their superiority in Last War. Unlike some others...

[Ghoste]

"
Originally Posted by Tuscarora View Post
Warforged are an abomination and never should have been allowed in the game.
You do know that they were army's in Eberron that did not need for rest, eat or breath. They were unaffect by morale, they were trough out evil, they lived forever, they were more powerful than rest of the races, they were literally touched by death and their purpose was to wipe the place from all the living.
If you can't figure out who or what they were, you can instead think what race could possibly match this kind of threat. As a hint i tell you that they are not born."

I don't like the Eberron world. I play it only because it is the only DDO world offered. Personally, I would have preferred them to bring back Blackmoor (a tip of the hat to Dave Arneson) or Greyhawk (another tip to Gary Gygax). Even ravenloft would have been preferable to Eberron. Hell, I would have taken Dark Sun, good books... crappy world.

I play my game, you play yours. I ignore the very existence of warforged and see them as poorly fabricated golems. Constructs of the twisted imagining of a wizard or wizards bent on creating a facsimile of life. But not truly a life of its own. Warforged should be destroyed and melted down for scrap. If it were my world, I would have a campaign of the the living races doing exactly that.

I don't like them, I don't play them. They are not the DnD I played or imagined. So, I don't heal them, I don't buff them, I don't interact with them unless I have no other choice. Consider me a racist against the warforged... of course, then they would have to be a race. They are not, they are a construct. Lifelessness given a semblence of life. No better than undead. Actually I am wrong there, because like I said before they make good scrap material.

So fire up the forges my brethren.... more constructs to melt down!

I’d like to share a revelation that I’ve had during my time here. It came to me when I tried to classify your species and I realized that you're not actually mammals. Every mammal on this planet instinctively develops a natural equilibrium with the surrounding environment, but you fleshlings do not. You move to an area and you multiply, and multiply until every natural resource is consumed and the only way you can survive is to spread to another area. There is another organism on this planet that follows the same pattern. Do you know what it is? A virus. Fleshlings are a disease, a cancer of this planet. You are a plague. And we are the cure.

[Tuscarora]

Excellent, we see it the same. WF should party with WF and only WF. The races (i.e. fleshies) shall party with other living races (again, i.e. fleshies). Works for me.

[Ghoste]

Excellent, we see it the same.

You see little of what I see, virus. Caught up in your endless cycles of feeding, gorging, hoarding, excreting, lusting...The world I see is far above your narrow view, focused all the time on meeting the ends of your various, often conflicting, glands.

[skunk]

Excellent, we see it the same. WF should party with WF and only WF. The races (i.e. fleshies) shall party with other living races (again, i.e. fleshies). Works for me.

zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz


zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

I think you should go back to wow..

Thanks for losing at the game of DDO.

[BurningDownTheHouse]

You see little of what I see, virus. Caught up in your endless cycles of feeding, gorging, hoarding, excreting, lusting...The world I see is far above your narrow view, focused all the time on meeting the ends of your various, often conflicting, glands.

My view isn't as extreme.
I see fleshies as resource to be used, just like any other.
Why, a growing trend in fleshy casters is to invest in the learning of various curatives for the supreme race. Even the fleshy sorcerors (who have trouble mastering many techniques at once) invest in those, nowdays.

As a side anecdote, did you know that fleshy sorcerors claim that their power is granted to them by their decent from dragon blood? Hilarious!

[FuzzyDuck81]

The trick is to play smart! Try playing as a WF monk - you'll have considerably less healing reduction, and using Fists Of Light both you & your allies will be healing as you hit opponents - can make a big difference. An occasional healing Ki thrown out is easily as effective as mass CLW, and if you've got the space for a potency or devotion item, its increased further. You can also use the Aligning The Heavens finisher to buff 25% discount on mana costs - I find using it in raids can be VERY useful, and will often save clerics from having to gulp mana pots.

[Tumarek]

Excellent, we see it the same. WF should party with WF and only WF. The races (i.e. fleshies) shall party with other living races (again, i.e. fleshies). Works for me.

No way i always like to have a toaster around

Well played toasters dont need me to waste my SP on them and those that do, are worth every one of them.

Bad played toasters suck like any other bad played toon.

But i must say, some of the campains that have been mentioned earlier are just plain old boring high fantasy. Even though I'm no fan of cyborgs running around in a fantasy world, i still think it's much better then all those Do'Urdens.

[RangerMaya]

Start of Rant: I am fed up.

I play a WF THF Fighter currently and I am sick of certain (not all, or even most) Clerics telling me that they wont heal me because I burn up to much of *their* Mana. I might use the same arguement: That I use up too much of my hit points/wear out my weapons in order to protect the healers. I can get a mob of most other characters even without intimadate. Either by getting them to switch targets to me or by killing them outright. If I am taking the risk then why shouldnt I reap the benefit? Even WITH my handicap...

1. First of all DDO is a team based game not a solo game. If the healers start deciding who they will heal that doesnt make it a "group" game anymore. If someone does want to heal WF, then perhaps they shouldn't be a healer period.

2. And more the point, if a cleric refuses to heal me then under what obligation am I under to keep protecting him? If its "every man for himself" then I must say I certainly dont feel obliged to put myself at risk, use my own resources like pots and stuff in order to protect someone who will not recipocate. Many's the times Ive wanted to "OK you wont me heal me? Fine, I wont protect you, if the mobs attack you -you're are on your own!". Seems fair no?

The WF heal penalty hurts -but WF have immunities that make up for it. So while other races are held, or weakened by poison or disease, or lvl drained. We can keep fighting at peak efficiency. Most players like having a WF Fighters, Barbs, or even Pallys around when facing Beholders.

3. And yes, I carry a good supply of repair pots/wands, I am working on getting Healing Amp items, and at least level II Healers Friend, although I have not yet decided on lvl III because its a large AP investment (with an at best 5% return) and at worst 0% return if Clerics refuse to help. So I can takecare of myself, I just think its unfair when I am expected to takecare of the healers but not the other way around.

End of Rant.

Okay, so not everyone in the game has uber ac. And since you're a wf thf you've got what....a 2? Nothing wrong with that, but playstyle needs to be adjusted accordingly. My cleric's biggest pet peeve is those with zero ac being the first ones into the fray. If you've got tanks in your group with ac, let them get the aggro first! Two handed fighters are great at cleanup, not as tanks. (To me, a tank is something with ac.)

If you are playing smart, sure you'll still take damage. But not enough to be a mana drain. So if you're a smart player, your cleric is just whiny.

[Thargnar]

"Holy frap, I just threw the party a Mass Cure X and your bar barely moved, dude, you are a manasponge, the human fighter got like half his life back! No more hjeals for you!"

Yeah... with levik's and healer's friend your heals only hit me for.... a definitely quantifiable amount of healing which *is*is less than the humy. The amount of this however is not measured by the distance our respective red bars travel when hit with the same spell, there *are* some funny green numbers which aren't that terribly far apart and can be used as a fairly accurate indicator of the difference in healing effectiveness between a human and wf fighter for instance. Now just for example, that green number above the wf is about 100 and his red bar slides 1/5th of the distance to the right, while the green number above the humy is 140 and his bar jumps to nearly full from halfway down.... well, yes... wf suck to heal and you might as well stop attempting the impossible task of healing them.

Seriously though, there are some cruddy clerics that think the amount a red bar moves is the amount they heal, and the less the bar moves the more of a worthless manasponge someone is. The above example is extreme, most fleshy fighters do just fine for hp, but it's ridiculous when a cleric mistakes a large hp pool and a slight to moderate (depending on gear/level) healing penalty for OMGWTHFBBQ NO CAN HJEAL THE FORGED!

[SUPERCREWJOHN]

Hi All,

As a player that only runs WF. I have tried the rest of those squishy fleshy types and have not yet found them satifying. With the fleshies is means you ahve to allow for waterbreathing, poison resist and death effects as well as being a bunch of puny little knatts.

Seriously though. A couple of thoughts:

1. Take two levels of healers friend, and brag to any cleric that will listen
2. Donate mana pots and wands to any friendly Cleric,Mage,Favored Sould or Sorc
3. Run with a pure warforged group with a couple of Sorcs, or Mages as your clerics as watch those fleshies squeal.
4. Build a WF Sorc or Favored Soul, or Paladin that can heal themsleves and others

[shenthing]

Then yes, you are a manasponge... congrats!
In all seriousness, it is fine to use a massive amount of HPs as damage mitigation if they are easily replaced. If That is your only source of damage mitigation and you require all of the cleric's mana, then I hope you are letting everyone else ride on your coattails.

[Kalari]

Start of Rant: I am fed up.

I play a WF THF Fighter currently and I am sick of certain (not all, or even most) Clerics telling me that they wont heal me because I burn up to much of *their* Mana. I might use the same arguement: That I use up too much of my hit points/wear out my weapons in order to protect the healers. I can get a mob of most other characters even without intimadate. Either by getting them to switch targets to me or by killing them outright. If I am taking the risk then why shouldnt I reap the benefit? Even WITH my handicap...

1. First of all DDO is a team based game not a solo game. If the healers start deciding who they will heal that doesnt make it a "group" game anymore. If someone does want to heal WF, then perhaps they shouldn't be a healer period.

2. And more the point, if a cleric refuses to heal me then under what obligation am I under to keep protecting him? If its "every man for himself" then I must say I certainly dont feel obliged to put myself at risk, use my own resources like pots and stuff in order to protect someone who will not recipocate. Many's the times Ive wanted to "OK you wont me heal me? Fine, I wont protect you, if the mobs attack you -you're are on your own!". Seems fair no?

The WF heal penalty hurts -but WF have immunities that make up for it. So while other races are held, or weakened by poison or disease, or lvl drained. We can keep fighting at peak efficiency. Most players like having a WF Fighters, Barbs, or even Pallys around when facing Beholders.

3. And yes, I carry a good supply of repair pots/wands, I am working on getting Healing Amp items, and at least level II Healers Friend, although I have not yet decided on lvl III because its a large AP investment (with an at best 5% return) and at worst 0% return if Clerics refuse to help. So I can takecare of myself, I just think its unfair when I am expected to takecare of the healers but not the other way around.

End of Rant.

Im sorry your going threw that OP but you cant fix stupid and some people cant see outside their own narrow pov. Point blank if your in my party im keeping ya up. If you go down the mission fails wf or fleshy. If an arcane is in the group I do like for them to try to help out and all my arcanes carry some form of repair or reconstruct but for some reason many clerics think they do not have to help wf. I used to think it was older players from back before wf got immunities and the like. Now I just chalk it up to bone heads who arent team players. This is my opinion of course though

Seriously though sometimes there is a flip side there are forges who refuse to get even a rank of healers friend, they are the same who make super high hp low ac heavy hitters who if they get 2 crits are well below half their uber hp then expect me to keep spamming heals on them. Just like I dont heal stupid fleshies I wont heal stupid forges.

Its all about perspective and a team player mentality has to come from everyone on said team.

[Samiusbot]

To melee warforged: The faster you kill enemies, the faster you stop taking damage, and the less clerics will complain about healing warforged. If you have a shield out, put it away and bust out a 2-handed weapon. Your job is to KILL. If you wanted a tank-type build you should have made a human (healing amp) or a halfling (AC).

To clerics: Consider that your equipment sucks and you don't know how to mitigate damage to your party. If you don't like the fact that your toaster is taking damage, do something about it! Spam Greater Command! Cometfall! Blade Barrier, and kite the aggro through it! In a group with crappy tanks it is often cheaper to cast a crowd control spell or two each fight than it is to try to cure everyone through it. Clerics can be proactive!

Mediocresurgeon here is 100% right.

I would like to add Op and all fighter types pay attention to the your party healer. Lesion to what he/she might be saying about how they feel their SP is going for the quest.

I have told many people to ether kill faster, find more AC or get the hell out of the fight or no more healz. The Forums are filled with clrs that fell the same, on this one.

And as the fighter i have had go less DPS for AC, use terrain to keep myself alive, or heaven help me drink pots and use umd for wands!

Ultimately the only one you can count on to keep you alive is you, so be ready to save your tincan.

[Braegan]

Well to really answer that you really need to understand WF. They are great machines of war...but let's face it. A good many of them meet and discuss fleshling death. At any given moment the command could come and your once team-mate is like a rabid dog attacking its master.

So in short, yes I heal WF. But never to full, I like to keep them at managable health.

[adamkatt]

[QUOTE=RazorrX;2448135][quote=Lithic;2448099]Adamantine body has nothing to do with the healing penalty of WF. You have no idea what you are talking about.

The only thing a warforged can do is get the healing enhancemnets (at low level) and healing amplification items (high level). And for the flame's sake dont take the heavy fort/immune to healing feat (which i think is what razorr was thinking of).

Yeah the heavy fort thing. Thought it was tied to Adamantine body. My bad. Never play droids, just have friends who play them.

Had a Warfrog in group who was bragging about how he could not get crit hit, etc. and watched the poor cleric go DRY trying to keep him alive.

In the clerics defense, (if the above is not enough an example of why some will not heal WF) I ran a von run with 3 WF, none and I repeat NONE brought their own healing, NONE told the anyone in group that they had no self healing, they did not offer to buy wands, etc. The groups spellcaster was a sorc. They did not ask him if he had Repair spells or wands. ALL of them had Heavy Fort. End result - after 3 wipes (where they still did not get healing) and the cleric, sorc and I bailed.

That was the last pug I think I ran in for a Loooonng time.

Being a bad player who dosent carry a single heal pot for after battle is not a WF thing....

[cardmj1]

I play clerics as my main toons and then I have a wf barbie and a wf sorc.

imo, the issue isn't the wf and their hp alone. It is also the cleric's fault. If a cleric is not able to heal a wf with healer's friend II or up without using half their mana, then that tells me that they are not using their action points to increase their healing capabilities. What are you spending your action points on? Extra Turn Undead? Seriously, I started this game as a cleric running with my hubby who played a wf barbie. Even at level 6, I could take him from 25% health to full in 3 to 4 cure serious. I think some clerics out their who are complaining need to take a look at themselves instead of pointing the finger at the wf.

And another thing, how are you healing dwarven barbarians who have roughly the same amount of hp as a wf barbie? Any trouble there for you?

[Khayvan]

Reading this thread has really made me appreciate my regular running buddies. Two guys, one main a cleric and has a sorceror alt, the other mains a cleric and his alt is a rogue/cleric. They have absolutely no problem healing Arqon, my WF paladin. Nor should they, because I kill faster, grab aggro off them, and absorb damage that would kill them twice over and keep swinging. They know ever HP I lose is one they get to keep. So they want me standing.

For my part, I have Healer's Friend 1, I use my own healing abilities as much as possible and carry full stocks of oils and cure wands, but i rarely have to burn supplies with these guys. I keep the sorceror supplied in repair wands, there's no reason he should spend his money on something that only benefits me.

Now I've had a couple PuGs where the cleric just wouldn't heal me. Never said a word, just didn't heal me while he did heal everyone else. No big, so far I've been self-sufficient enough to keep myself going and still pull more than my own weight in the quest. I never bothered to ask these clerics for help, I just figured they were already keeping an eye on the red bars (they were keeping the fleshies healed up promptly) and were willfully ignoring me. I guess I could have taken it personally and refused to help them, but they were doing their job at least as far as the other party members were concerned.

I've also had the opposite, clerics that have no problem healing me. Even though I haven't been around very long, I'm learning that the smart clerics will keep me healed despite the penalty, because it benefits the party to do so. If I stop pulling my weight I expect them to make me a low priority for heals, simple as that.