Newer player looking to roll Monk

[Genocidal]

Hey all,

I started playing a couple of weeks ago with a few friends, and not knowing much about the game decided to follow a pre-made path template for a Monk. Well... he didn't turn out so well and after rolling a few other classes I'd like to give it another shot. Being fairly new I don't have access to true 32 point builds but I have built up enough favor to unlock Drow, and decided to try and use that extra Dex and Int to my advantage.

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Previk Swiftfoot
Level 20 Lawful Good Drow Male
(20 Monk) 
Hit Points: 264
Spell Points: 0 
BAB: 15\15\20\25\25
Fortitude: 13
Reflex: 18
Will: 15

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                 Base Stats          Modified Stats
Abilities        (Level 1)             (Level 20)
Strength             14                    14
Dexterity            16                    23
Constitution         12                    12
Intelligence         14                    14
Wisdom               14                    17
Charisma             10                    10

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                 Base Skills         Modified Skills
Skills           (Level 1)            (Level 20)
Balance               7                    30
Bluff                 0                     0
Concentration         5                    35
Diplomacy             0                     0
Disable Device        n/a                   n/a
Haggle                0                     0
Heal                  2                     3
Hide                  7                    29
Intimidate            0                     0
Jump                  6                    25
Listen                2                     9
Move Silently         7                    29
Open Lock             n/a                   n/a
Perform               n/a                   n/a
Repair                2                     2
Search                2                     4
Spot                  5                    27
Swim                  2                     2
Tumble                4                     7
Use Magic Device      n/a                   n/a

Level 1 (Monk)
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Toughness
Feat: (Selected) Two Weapon Fighting


Level 2 (Monk)
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Stunning Fist


Level 3 (Monk)
Feat: (Selected) Dodge
Feat: (Monk Path) Philosophy - Path of Harmonious Balance


Level 4 (Monk)


Level 5 (Monk)


Level 6 (Monk)
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Power Attack
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Finesse


Level 7 (Monk)


Level 8 (Monk)


Level 9 (Monk)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Two Weapon Fighting


Level 10 (Monk)


Level 11 (Monk)


Level 12 (Monk)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Bludgeoning Weapons


Level 13 (Monk)


Level 14 (Monk)


Level 15 (Monk)
Feat: (Selected) Greater Two Weapon Fighting


Level 16 (Monk)


Level 17 (Monk)


Level 18 (Monk)
Feat: (Selected) Toughness


Level 19 (Monk)


Level 20 (Monk)
Enhancement: Monk Serenity
Enhancement: Elven Dexterity I
Enhancement: Elven Dexterity II
Enhancement: Lifting the Veil
Enhancement: Way of the Faithful Hound I
Enhancement: Way of the Faithful Hound II
Enhancement: Way of the Faithful Hound III
Enhancement: Way of the Faithful Hound IV
Enhancement: The Receptive Earth
Enhancement: Restoring the Balance
Enhancement: Monk Improved Recovery I
Enhancement: Monk Improved Recovery II
Enhancement: Monk Improved Recovery III
Enhancement: Eagle Claw Attack
Enhancement: Fists of Light
Enhancement: Rise of the Phoenix
Enhancement: Void Strike
Enhancement: Difficulty at the Beginning
Enhancement: Unbalancing Strike
Enhancement: Adept of Wind
Enhancement: Disciple of Breezes
Enhancement: Grandmaster of Storms
Enhancement: Master of Thunder
Enhancement: Disciple of Pebbles
Enhancement: Adept of Flame
Enhancement: Disciple of Candles
Enhancement: Adept of Rain
Enhancement: Disciple of Puddles
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
Enhancement: Monk Balance I
Enhancement: Monk Concentration I
Enhancement: Monk Wisdom I
Enhancement: Monk Wisdom II
Enhancement: Monk Wisdom III

As you can guess, I'm looking to run a Dex monk -- I've read Halflings are fairly good for that build, but every stat combo I could come up with having only 28 points left me unhappy in one place or another. I'd like to have this build at 14 Con but took toughness early to help with the HP I'd be lacking in (Not a fan of the level 18 Toughness but I couldn't find a better feat to throw in). The way I envision playing this character is as a light tank with middling DPS that's also able to be a bit stealthy if needed -- if I'm off-base on that being useful then I can dump Int down to 10, lose Hide and Move Silently and pump the Con up to 14. I held off on Finesse until 6 because the difference is only +1 up until then assuming my gear ends up mostly equal in +stats, but with also taking Power Attack I'd like as much to-hit as possible at that point.

A few specific questions I have, and any suggestions on top of that or pointing out errors I've made would be extremely helpful.

I'm assuming they don't, but do Drow and Monk SR stack? How about any of the other Racial + Class bonuses?

Assuming 'average' gear progressing through the levels, how big of a difference will the extra few HP I'd gain from 14 Con help in comparison to the extra skills 14 Int gives over 10?

Based on what I'm looking for in this character, would a 12/16/14/8/16/8 Halfling that only maxes Balance, Concentration, and Spot/Jump be a better choice? I ended up with an extra Action Point to dump at the end because of the lack of good enhancements, which I imagine wouldn't be a problem for the Halfling with the Sneak Attack line.

Is the slightly lower Wis in the Drow build going to cause me AC troubles down the line? What can I reasonably expect to get AC to, and will it be a number that's even useful as I get to higher levels?

Thanks in advance.

[Fattiest]

I have not rolled a monk, what i can tell you is that most consider it a advanced class. average gear and a new player(light knowledge on game innerworkings) will struggle alot with this class, all the power in the world to you and i hope you do well, i dont touch them thou, and i've been around since 06'

I would look at the fighter class as your first build untill you get more experance, or wiz as they are not twink heavy.

[Fennario]

14 int is a bit much, especially if you are not taking combat expertise.

Stealth skills, while fun sometimes, are very situational in group play. Can be useful for soloing sometimes though.

One thing you have to remember about con is that your 12 base is going to be a 10 base in wind stance. And you will find that will be the stance you are going to be in most of the time.

If you are going to be using stunning fist there are a few things you need to realize:

Your wisdom needs to be high. Consider a few level ups in wisdom. With drow dex enhancements and wind stance, its not hard to get the dex up there.

Consider elegant crane instead of hound. Wind stance is the superior stance, but it doesn't give back ki like fire does. But if you take crane, all the auto crits that you get from your stuns will give you back enough ki to keep stunning.

Monk sr and drow sr do not stack. But thats hardly a concern. Your monk will have sr 30 at end game if you stay pure.

Halflings make outstanding monks. 32 pointers do help though. The only difference a 32 point halfling would have than the one you listed would be 2 more strengh. Depends if you want keep grinding that favor, or play your monk now. A drow monk can work too though.

AC is about dex and wisdom. But it is also about gear. With enough gear your ac should be fine.

[RhapsodieInBlue]

I just started during beta and have now become a loving subscriber. I started out with a fighter, bringing him to 6, but ultimately not enjoying myself very much. I then started a monk, and though I was a little "twinked," my knowledge of DnD helped me along the way.

Halflings really are amazing! You're not going to max any of your stats, but as a monk min/maxing is really not effective. Unless you are going after skill points, int is not important and neither is charisma. Of course I only have access to 28 point builds, but I'm fairly certain my stats looked like this.

STR 12
DEX 16
CON 14
INT 8
WIS 16
CHA 8

Feats at first level were Dodge and Two Weapon Fighting
Second level monk feat was Weapon Finesse.

The two weapon fighting line now affects your unarmed attacks, so it is definitely worth taking it, as you can just as easily switch out to kamas for a zombie beat down.

Now, here's a hint: The Amanatu quest line in the marketplace can be done at levels 2-4 in a party, and the reward is a +1 shock kama of tendon slice that you can get twice in the same questline if you're lucky. That's a finessable weapon that's d6 + d6 lightning that you can use in wind stance, and you can dual wield it!

IF you don't mind buying turbine points, that +1 Tome of Supreme Ability is a major plus. It immediately brings your abilities into better-than-normal-ville.

At Level 4/0 taking Monk Wisdom at 2, WIS ability increase, and Halfling Dexterity you can have a wind stanced monk with base stats as follows. (and with the tome)

STR 13(14 with a +1 easy to achieve item.)
Dex 20 (in stance)
Con 13 (in stance)
Int 9
Wis 20 (with an easy to achieve +1 item)
Cha 9

Let's see where this puts you!

10 Base AC
5 from Dex
1 Racial
1 Dodge (assuming you take the feat at some point before 4.)
5 Wisdom

This gives you a 22 base AC from Stats alone.

Let's look into a few extras.

Black Spider Bracers (final reward from waterworks)
+4 Armor Bonus Bracers

That puts you at 26 ac at level 4, centered and unencumbered.

If you find a mobile outfit (which i've found a few), then you gain mobility for free until you take it.

If you're tumbling this gives you 30 AC without quaffing a single potion.

My monk at 5 now sort of looks like this:
43 AC while tumbling buffed. (If you gain enough hate on a big guy and then tumble kite him, even accidental things won't hit much at all at my level.) (I have some friends that help me with potion buying and cast extended shield of faith on me )
Absolutely obscene saves, something like 12/15/14 without using a single potion.
Evasion, meaning I can be the trap monkey.

Now then, here's some things you want to watch out for...

ONE! Magic Missile. If you don't have a shield clicky, the new dungeon scaling system makes a CR1's magic missile do 8-12 damage per missile. Ouch?
TWO! Scorching Ray. This will hit you for 32-42 points of damage right in the face now. If you're up close and personal with a shaman or arcane skeleton it can sometimes be hard to tumble away from the casting animation, and it offers no save.

Hope this has somewhat been a help and if anything I have said is wrong please correct me.

[Hendrik]

Very good information here. If I may add from my own personal Monk experience, a stat balanced (STR,DEX,CON,WIS) has been the most rewarding Monk I have played.

Looking forward to Grandmaster of the Elements some day.

[Genocidal]

Thanks for the advice everyone. I liked Hound for the flanking bonus, but didn't even consider that I'd be getting a lot of crits when enemies are stunned which makes Crane look like the obvious choice now. I actually rolled the character with the Halfling stats earlier this morning, but I think I'm going to remake as a Drow for the dumbest reason: I can't really stand my character being so small! Especially with the way the camera compensates for it, and after playing a Warforged it's not a jump I can make right away. A dumb complaint but if I'm going to be spending a lot of time with the character, one that will bug me into not wanting to play it. The other thing with the halfling is that I'd either have to buy a tome, use a level-up, or start with odd stats to pick up Power Attack, none of which I'm too keen on doing. I can see why people suggest waiting for 32pt builds to play a Monk now. For now though I think I'll give a Drow with 14/16/14/10/14/10 a shot, cutting out Hide and Move Silently and throwing my level-ups into Wis after I bump Dex to 17 for the TWF line.

Are there any other feats that people would recommend for a Monk? Dodge seems like something I could respec out later on, and taking Toughness again at 18 really seems like a wasted feat.

[Furbitor]

Thanks for the advice everyone.
The other thing with the halfling is that I'd either have to buy a tome, use a level-up, or start with odd stats to pick up Power Attack, none of which I'm too keen on doing. I can see why people suggest waiting for 32pt builds to play a Monk now. For now though I think I'll give a Drow with 14/16/14/10/14/10 a shot, cutting out Hide and Move Silently and throwing my level-ups into Wis after I bump Dex to 17 for the TWF line.

Are there any other feats that people would recommend for a Monk? Dodge seems like something I could respec out later on, and taking Toughness again at 18 really seems like a wasted feat.

First off... I say to everyone trying out a new class to go with whatever you want.. because make up your mind your gonna trash that toon no matter what happens.

This frees you, you see to make any decision on its merit alone, and keep you from anguishing at the trainers. That said... I see you reference dps a lot in your posts.. as if that is foremost in your mind. I suggest try whatever... but havent you heard the cries of hundreds of players saying monk stink on ice? Ill give you a hint. They do, IF you try to make the monk something its not.

But, If you make the monk into what it is, and are the type of player who can change your gameplay style.. then the monk will be an awesome class.

If your look at a monks greatest stats, dex and wisdom, then you can glimmer the best you can hope for is a 2 weapon ftr style of play. Halflings have super racial bonuses to dex... hence thier popularity. Strength isnt a halflings strong suit.

This is my halfling monk:

Stat base equip Fire water air
-------------------------------------------
str 16 24 27 22 24

dex 19 30 30 30 32

con 14 23 23 23 21

int 9 10 10 10 10

wis 14 24 22 27 24

cha 8 11 11 11 11


the equipment includes the various tomes I gotten... but all in all I run in fire mode most the time.

I went with way of the monkey for the bonuses to elemental resists... at cap a full 10 pts of resist that stacks is awesome

I could have went down one path or another but you must have your stats close if you want to be a rezzing monk... not that its needed anymore.. LOL but HANDY

Good luck!