Thank You for ruining my game

[Maxelcat]

"Oh, Noes, the Higher level Quests are hard for my Buber character, I cant walk threw the content with my buber gear and stuff, I have to think..."

D&D is all about challenge. Its never EVER suppose to be a Cake walk. Its about over coming the worst that the DM/Plot can throw at you...

sheesh...

If you think this is bad... Thank your lucky stars that the LV 20 end game isn't "S1 Tomb of Horrors"...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tomb_of_Horrors

[Dirac]

"Oh, Noes, the Higher level Quests are hard for my Buber character, I cant walk threw the content with my buber gear and stuff, I have to think..."

D&D is all about challenge. Its never EVER suppose to be a Cake walk. Its about over coming the worst that the DM/Plot can throw at you...

sheesh...

If you think this is bad... Thank your lucky stars that the LV 20 end game isn't "S1 Tomb of Horrors"...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tomb_of_Horrors

Since no one is saying or arguing for the position you are ridiculing, are you sure you are posting in the right thread?

Tomb of Horrors is an iconic dungeon, and one I (and many) remember fondly. If you are familiar with it (and D&D) at all, then you would know that any competent DM would never make Tomb of Horrors the standard dungeon template for their campaign.

[7-day_Trial_Monkey]

Since no one is saying or arguing for the position you are ridiculing, are you sure you are posting in the right thread?

Tomb of Horrors is an iconic dungeon, and one I (and many) remember fondly. If you are familiar with it (and D&D) at all, then you would know that any competent DM would never make Tomb of Horrors the standard dungeon template for their campaign.

What I remember so well from my 1st time playing in i PnP, was the wizard's bright idea to levitate up level with the solid black orb at the end of the 1st hallway, and then ask the fighter to gently push him in head 1st so he could check it out!

[vyrank]

The low level quests do seem much tougher also. I have been working on a number of people to come and play when it opens for free. I won't be pushing them until the quests are little bit more level. We were fighting to 3 man a lot of the quests in Korthos which we did on a regular basis prior. The scaling does seem off to me.

[Maxelcat]

Since no one is saying or arguing for the position you are ridiculing, are you sure you are posting in the right thread?

Tomb of Horrors is an iconic dungeon, and one I (and many) remember fondly. If you are familiar with it (and D&D) at all, then you would know that any competent DM would never make Tomb of Horrors the standard dungeon template for their campaign.

It was my failed attempt of additional mockery, its what I get for posting before my first coffee.

Actually i'm looking at my copy of S1 right now and chuckling.

I know not every dungeons not suppose to be like S1, but everything should be a challenge.

The thing i love about DDO is I'm finally a player. (I had run a PW in NWN, and I'm my groups primary DM) I personally love the fact I have no idea where I am or where I'm going, or whats around the corner. Sure I get some sneak peeks if I PUG, But i use that in character when my guild signs in. "Guys! I was just with these people and there's a really cool dungeon we should try!!!" (which kinda makes sense being a Rouge Freelanceing while his party is not around)

But even with those sneak peeks, I don't remember everything, which leads to some wipes. heck there's been lots of time where we've come somewhere new and been all like "we can totally do this!!!". *DEAD!* "ok guys maybe not..."

[Drfirewater79]

The problem I am seeing with you Doc is that you are a complainer... most of the posts I have seen by you are complaints of some kind. Also you seem to HATE change. the content (new) is not THAT hard.. nor is the older stuff. Sure you have to be a bit more careful but the groups I play with are decent enough that we have not had that much difficulty. You for sure can not zerge content anymore though. You most certainly have to watch for the warning symbols too... if you get green.. slow down and kill kill kill. If you get yellow stop, take a breath and kill what comes up and make sure you are not wiping the group, you get red, you can pretty much count on a wipe.
The point here is that there is going to be change.. if you want the same game as it was before Mod 9 then your expectations were way off. MMO's are all about change and if you hate it that much then you might want to consider a different genre of games to play if any.

Yeah I complain cause that is what forums are for ... I have made hundreds of posts about stuff i like.

In fact mod 7 was my favorite mod and i even love Reavers refuge I love all of necropolis cept shadow crypt. In fact with exception to the delays and Turbines tell nothing and expect us to be happy attitude I have never had much to say bad about the game since launch. I have been a total trooper for the difficulty of all mods with exception to this one. In fact I cant think of the last mod i had issues with at all .... maybe crucible was a bit much first time on elite but really dont think i have had issues with anything cept for when they made changes to dragon raid and when they launched Titan bugged and Abbot which i still refuse to do (though might give it a try again as alot has changed so i hear).

I dont hate change if it means like in all MMO's cept this one ( I have played more then 6 different MMO's so yes i have alot of experience with the type of game an MMO is as well as having owned every system available in canada since intellivision and c64 I would prolly say there is no type of game i haven't at least tried and i quite like the MMO market as is. The difference is Turbine seems to take joy in messing with quests forcing us to change strat's we have been using for months just because we are beating missions. That also means they aren't thinking about pugs and new players who have difficulty with these missions and that is what has led to our diminishing player base over the last three years.

The new content is that hard .. if a group of people who can cake walk 90% of the other content on elite can walk into a mission one level higher then what they have been doing (but actually one level lower based on difficulty level on elite vs normal) and wipe 5 times in half an hour then there is something wrong. while i would totally agree with you if we had made it to the end boss and got our asses handed to us there but we wiped 3 of the four times before we made it to the first boss. And I love the Dungeon alert system and no we where not even in green when we wiped.

As far as my hate for change goes its not adding stuff that bothers me its changing what we have grown to love ... changing tact so much that its no longer fun to do the mission because people drop group from fustration ... this is what leads to people leaving the game forever and not comming back.

I admited even in the OP i am gonna give it three months ... in my opinion its more then enough time for Turbine to fix there mistakes (which really if they couldnt fix them in 3 months of freaking beta what chance do they really have of making it better now). Apperantly even Turbine is realizing they messed up the Scaling ... full parties should always beable to stand a better chance then solo players other wise you turn this game into wow .... and i will be damd if i am paying 15$ a month for wow.

The capstones are for pure classes only but really in alot of the new content if you don't have evasion your screwed. Personally i think Turbine should have done more thinking in the last year if they where gonna launch a **** mod like this lacking in forethought lacking in at level content and over powering mobs for the sake of delaying people from attaining lvl 20 quickly so they can drag there heals with new mod release ... increasing and changing current missions so they take longer to complete and cause less people to have the time to complete them especially if they have to go slow and then burn them for trying to speed up by intentionally nerfing the single most popular play style.

Yeah I complain because there is alot to complain about ... if you have never seen my non complaining posts then you should look around more often cause i have had many constructive and thankful posts just not many in the last 5 months since i been sick of Turbines negligence on the part of its player base causing most of my in game friends to leave already and making me and many others consider leaving now.

[Donnie]

predictable thread is predictable

[Drfirewater79]

"Oh, Noes, the Higher level Quests are hard for my Buber character, I cant walk threw the content with my buber gear and stuff, I have to think..."

D&D is all about challenge. Its never EVER suppose to be a Cake walk. Its about over coming the worst that the DM/Plot can throw at you...

sheesh...

If you think this is bad... Thank your lucky stars that the LV 20 end game isn't "S1 Tomb of Horrors"...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tomb_of_Horrors

That wasnt the only issue i think you didnt actually read anything you just saw the tag line and started spouting off.

6 uber players with uber loot got destroyed in new content on normal first off and two players without uber loot finished the same mission that is the biggest screw up in DDO history.

lvl 20 end game should be hard and i bet it will be extream on hard and elite but F2P games have to be open to both power gamers and casual players .... And as is the end content in this game is both fustrating and extreamly hard in comparison to other missions and there level scale to the scale of the party as it goes up.

The most intelligent comment i have heared so far about this is that at lvl 20 will it still be that difficult ...well in my opinion yes on elite when missions are actually lvl 21 it will be and at lvl 20 since its the natural cap really we should be turning to elite for challenge.

Normal is suppost to be how you learn the mission and it would be one thing if the difficulty was labyrinth navigation or puzzle solving but throwing a horde of mobs all at much higher difficulty and with no choice but to have evasion to survive or even acid fogs doing 60+ damage on top of 30 resistance i had on which goes well beyond what we can do with items and max emp. They are editing spells to suit there needs and not giving us the same advantages then its cheating .... DDO is based on DnD rules which means both DM and Players have rules they are suppost to follow ....

...Wait before you say it DM = GOD ya right but if my DM went so far off the rule book for the sole reason being to kill the party then .. the game would be over and they wouldn't be asked to DM us again.

PC doesnt mean you should live forever but it does mean you should have a chance its not like i am going into a lvl 19 mission with a bunch of lvl 15's and getting wiped and comeing here to ***** about it .... its a full group of lvl 17's with good loot and strong tactial thinking going slow and really not getting lost in any of it either. It was simply tuned up to high and mobs where doing damage you'd expect from hard or elite on normal.

[Nikmal]

The casual player who gets on once or twice a week for a few drinks with friends is not looking for a new job. They are not looking for an easy button they can push for electronic loot. They are not looking for other people to show them everything to do. They are looking for a fun adventure that challenges them in such a way that when they are successful, they have a feeling of accomplishment.

This is why the majority of regular quests should follow exactly what I said before: Normal should be completable with four competent adults at level with average equipment who have never seen the quest before.

Having been through the new content, I can tell you we completed all that we have been though, including Genesis.. on normal with 3-4 people and have NEVER seen the content before this. So yes it is do-able.

[Drfirewater79]

There is currently a scaling bug in large parties that we are investigating.

Thank you eladrin for clearing up and making it official

full parties are being over scaled as i said at least sometimes when yeah complain about stuff someone hears it and actually gives two craps.

good to know its actually being looked into cause if the damage on normal feels like elite then its prolly not scaled properly.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The one thing about common sense is that its not that common.

[ThunderGulch]

What I remember so well from my 1st time playing in i PnP, was the wizard's bright idea to levitate up level with the solid black orb at the end of the 1st hallway, and then ask the fighter to gently push him in head 1st so he could check it out!

HAH! the Sphere of Anihalation(sp?) Love that module!
I lost my best character to that stupid thing.
/reroll my fighter that had 18/76 strength! I wasn't a happy camper.

/hijack off

[Drfirewater79]

Having been through the new content, I can tell you we completed all that we have been though, including Genesis.. on normal with 3-4 people and have NEVER seen the content before this. So yes it is do-able.

its only doable in groups with 3-4 people and that is the problem its not do-able with 6 and that is the problem.

[Fenrisulven6]

The AI seems much improved. Ran through Delera's yesterday. Not the same old archers as before. We left alot up on our way through, as pre the usual. Bad move. They plink you to death now.

[Quikster]

ran all the new content on normal in a full group except the raid. Ran a few quests on hard. Had one wipe, and one quest that was bugged or we just couldn't figure out what to do. Not sure the problem you're having. The only old content I have ran were raids.

[Kalari]

I got to run the flagging quests last night on two of my girls. My ranger did okay in there though a lot of healing was needed due to grazing hits. Yeah its annoying but not the end of the world. And heck my guild doesnt get mad at death that much though tying in the xp to it is rather annoying.

But that Invasion quest the part that bugs me is not only do you have to be on your game as a cleric there is a real zero margin for error in there right now. Im glad its a challenge it had my blood pumping and I stayed up waay late till we figured it out. But to go in there with 17's geared out and only have the quest beat by my cleric running around dropping BB's and spaming stuff to keep myself up..

That doesnt scream epic battle with your full team. I can see where some clerics will either complain a lot about this quest or you'll see the big ego ones who brag about how they can take the quest down. I'll run it to help get guild mates flagged but I dont see myself pugging this quest period.

Thats my worry about many of quests this new mod I dont see myself running it with people who dont have the A game on. And I can see where the divides will begin from it.

[bandyman1]

I've ran everything out there on hard so far in full groups of 6.

Had a lil trouble in one group with New Invasion's last fight. No other issues .

[joker965]

The OP is right. The problem is that the post made is like this:

INT: 18
WIS: 10
CHA: 6

[Kalari]

I've ran everything out there on hard so far in full groups of 6.

Had a lil trouble in one group with New Invasion's last fight. No other issues .

Besides New Invasion's last fight I found the whole area fun and challenging but I still see this area as a guild or close ally only place. I wouldnt want to just go in some of those quests with any old pug it would be a nightmare specially if you get people who dont listen or cant gel right.

But man alive is that place fun. Even the little mini quests like protecting that one chick Im really enjoying it but Im running it with people I can play drunk with hehe.

[Dirac]

Having been through the new content, I can tell you we completed all that we have been though, including Genesis.. on normal with 3-4 people and have NEVER seen the content before this. So yes it is do-able.

Fair enough. I always get into these threads just to make sure the debate is framed the right way. If it can be done, cool. It appears that there is a bug with 6 person groups that may be skewing the perspective.

[adamkatt]

LOL, In STK3 we got to the room past the Acid traps where there are multiple Hobgoblin Clerics and Archers most on a ledge up high. I snuck my way up the ladder with the fire traps and killed the first Cleric easily. The second Cleric, however, had spotted me by then and started alternating between, Command, Cause Fear, Searing Light. I would get 4 steps and be Commanded again(gee my Rogue has a poor will save when level 3?). It was a blast!

One of the casters last night was throwing up Hypnotic Patterns on the three of us. Named Kobold just about killed us with the other Kobolds running around hitting us.

Sweet! Yep, i use line of site a lot, of course its hard to do where you were! next time have someone throw something at each one and then hide!