Change Ram's Might to a 2nd level ranger spell

[Visty]

What is the change to rams? its going to like bulls str or somthing? I did a search but nothing really comes up. Just gives me room for tumble, and camo I guess...

they are fixing it so the dmg doesnt scale with your lvl
its a fixed str+2 dmg+1 now resulting in dmg+2 due to str (iirc)

[Guildmaster_Kadish]

they are fixing it so the dmg doesnt scale with your lvl
its a fixed str+2 dmg+1 now resulting in dmg+2 due to str (iirc)

+2 Str, +2 Damage (total +3 damage). But yes, you're correct other than that.

[Roman]

Its point is to see who kills the most mobs. And some of us love it.

Legolas and Gimli were obsessed kill counters. So when we do it, we are roleplaying!

Well technically it is who got the final killing blow. So even if you do 99% of the work I can come along and slap the mob one time and take all the credit. I think the kill counter changes the mindset and strategy of some players, and not always for the better.

And I confess, I used to be driven by kill counts. But next mod I actually look forward to using dual tenderizers and watching all the barbarians giggle with all the autocrits.

I would prefer to see more useful stats like total DPS output, total dmg received. amount of healing received, deaths by vorpal, amount of stat dmg ouput, etc... I think it would encourage more diversity in strategy and help to improve builds too.

[Riminy]

You mean its as broken as taking one level of rogue and being able to do any trap in the game?

[Lithic]

You mean its as broken as taking one level of rogue and being able to do any trap in the game?

Most rogues nowadays are happy to let the 1rogue/Xthings do the traps. We are too busy killing stuff

[DaggomaticDwarf]

Please... 6 ranger is a great splash now... but it's not the end all be all. You would know this if you knew what you were talking about.

Um Bobby me boy there are a number of peeps in these here forums that I consider experts and a great help to the DDO community, and u aint 1 of em.

[DaggomaticDwarf]

Rams might doesnt have anything to do with that. Most killcount leaders have been using high attack speed builds with vorpal or WoP not DPS.

Your saying +2 str +2 Dam doesnt help in ur to- hit ?? I could be wrong tho I dont claim to be an expert, I normally listen to other like Borro or Ara.

[bobbryan2]

Heheh... what's funny is that rangers were the best DPS class (aside from rogues, but with no radiance/sirocco, SA was much more difficult to get) even back in mod2, before tempest.

My, how peoples' minds have changed since then.

Uh... no. They were craptastic DPS back in Mod 2.

remember... there was no GTWF, and so with 4 attacks, you only got hooks on 2 of them. TWF was a truly gimped fighting style... not even counting how stupid it would be to remove a shield in all those early quests.

[bobbryan2]

Um Bobby me boy there are a number of peeps in these here forums that I consider experts and a great help to the DDO community, and u aint 1 of em.

Fair enough. But at least I know enough to know that 6 ranger isn't the end all/be all splash that every melee needs.

[DaggomaticDwarf]

But I never said it was nor do I claim to be an expert that "knows what Im talkin about"

[ViolentEnd]

they are fixing it so the dmg doesnt scale with your lvl
its a fixed str+2 dmg+1 now resulting in dmg+2 due to str (iirc)

How does this work currently? The compendium, etc. lists +2 str and dmg. Does it currently do more than this?

[Visty]

How does this work currently? The compendium, etc. lists +2 str and dmg. Does it currently do more than this?

currently it scales with lvl and is +3 or +4 dmg at lvl16 (too lazy to check atm)

wouldnt be the first time the compendium is wrong

[ViolentEnd]

Thank you for the clarification.

[Monkey_Archer]

Ranger 6 IS the most powerful dps splash in the game. (for TWF builds)

Look at the dps outputs of the Monster, the Despoiler, and the Ravager

These (and their variants) are among the top dps builds in the game... all use ranger to achive it.

[Guildmaster_Kadish]

Uh... no. They were craptastic DPS back in Mod 2.

remember... there was no GTWF, and so with 4 attacks, you only got hooks on 2 of them. TWF was a truly gimped fighting style... not even counting how stupid it would be to remove a shield in all those early quests.

Heheh. First of all, a ranger got 9 damage from FE per swing (Hmm. I can't remember if there were 3 or four levels of FE Damage back then. I'll assume 3), compared to what, 4 maximum for a fighter (weapon spec & 3 str) or 3-5ish for a raged barbarian? Paladins were decent; they got 3 from DF, plus their smites.... But even only counting THF, rangers were the best DPS at that point. No other class got a damage bonus as high as the ranger's FE.

Second, here's a TWF vs. THF comparison for a ranger for the curious:
TWF:
Onhand:
3.5 base
5 enh
10 str (max for pure ranger at level 10 was 28 unbuffed, a rage potion/clickie puts it to 30)
5 PA
1 Inspire Courage
1 Prayer
9 FE
33.5 avg. non-crit

Offhand:
3.5 base
5 enh
5 str
5 PA
1 Inspire Courage
1 Prayer
9 FE
28.5 avg. non-crit

33.5*15+4*94.5=904.5
904.5/20=45.225 avg. swing onhand

28.5*15+4*89.5=769.5
769.5/20=38.475 avg. swing offhand

4*45.225+2*38.475=257.85 attack sequence

THF:
7 base
5 enh
15 str
10 PA
1 Inspire Courage
1 Prayer
9 FE
48 non-crit

48*15+96*4=1104
1104/20=55.2 average swing
55.2*4=220.8 attack sequence

That's comparing two +5 khopeshes to a +5 greatsword. However, that's not quite fair, since khopeshes are innately better than greatswords. If we want a pure comparison of the stances, we can imagine a THF khopesh (using the base damage of a greatsword):

48*15+144*4=1296
1296/20=64.8 average swing
64.8*4=259.2 attack sequence

So THF was indeed slightly better as a stance at that point in the game (by 1.35 damage per sequence).

However, if we consider top-end loot for each stance, we have THF's SoS:

48*13+144*6=1488
1488/20=74.4 average swing
74.4*4=297.6 attack sequence

And we can add 7 damage per swing to the TWFer for an elemental khopesh of pg (rr), adding 7*6=42 yields a 299.85 attack sequence (278.5 for elemental or pg).

So we see that, in actual in-game situations, TWF actually had a very slight advantage in actual maximum DPS (a mere 2.25 damage per sequence higher). However, note once more that both of these stance breakdowns are using numbers for a ranger. A barbarian, fighter, or paladin would be lower.


People like you who blindly assumed that rangers were "craptastic DPS" without actually thinking about the comparison or doing the math were the reason that it took a pair of extreme changes (additions of Tempest and GTWF) before rangers became recognized as mainstay DPS.

[Twerpp]

Well technically it is who got the final killing blow. So even if you do 99% of the work I can come along and slap the mob one time and take all the credit. I think the kill counter changes the mindset and strategy of some players, and not always for the better.

And I confess, I used to be driven by kill counts. But next mod I actually look forward to using dual tenderizers and watching all the barbarians giggle with all the autocrits.

I would prefer to see more useful stats like total DPS output, total dmg received. amount of healing received, deaths by vorpal, amount of stat dmg ouput, etc... I think it would encourage more diversity in strategy and help to improve builds too.

I would like to see all that info too. Then the people saying they did 99% of the damage yet got 1% kills can finally shut up.

Lol those mysterious killstealers...just waiting to take that last hit point

[rmstevens]

OMG for real

[exarkun]

+2 Str, +2 Damage (total +3 damage). But yes, you're correct other than that.

ah well thats no big deal then...thanks for the info..

[Angelus_dead]

Heheh. First of all, a ranger got 9 damage from FE per swing

You only get a Favored Enemy bonus if you're attacking a Favored Enemy. That was less common in mod 2, especially if someone wasn't a pure ranger. It wasn't like today where someone could say "Evil Outsider is all I need"

So THF was indeed slightly better as a stance at that point in the game (by 1.35 damage per sequence).

Damage per sequence is very inaccurate and heavily biased in favor of TWF. A TWF sequence took much longer than THF or S&B, so the reality is that TWF DPS was even further behind than you say.

That's comparing two +5 khopeshes to a +5 greatsword.

Two khopeshes? In mod 2? Sorry, you're missing on attack rolls. In fact, the -2 penalty from a light offhand was sometimes a problem in top-end mod 2 content (elite BGs), and another -2 would've been a lot worse.

[vainangel]

You mean its as broken as taking one level of rogue and being able to do any trap in the game?

amen