Make skills more useful...

[anastasius]

Oh, so, to be naturally good at something you have to train extra hard and don't train on anything else...I get it now...

And vkhaun, I know, my bad...

Oh, so, to be naturally good at everything you don't need to focus your training on anything, you can just train everything equally well. You don't need to train to be an astrophysicist, you can do just as well as a proctologist like Kromize. Now I get it.

You don't need to spend time learning the wishbone offense in football you can just as easily become a chess grandmaster and a world class pianist and Nobel Prize winning economist all at the same time. After all in Kromize world everyone is equally good at all skills.

And Kromize, the comment about skill focus was based on your comment about being naturally good at something. If you are naturally good at a skill there are already rules in place. Not that you would ever understand that; after all it is not "something you need to know." (Oh wait a minute you are not as good in that as you are in other things. You must have been 3.5 gimped because you could only put .5 skill points into your gaming skill every level.)

[Visty]

why we have crossclass-skills?

cause gary said so

done
best argument ever

[Uska]

cause gary said so

done
best argument ever

Not really because he never did 3.0-3.5 wasnt gary's baby 1st editon was no crossclass skills there.

[Visty]

Not really because he never did 3.0-3.5 wasnt gary's baby 1st editon was no crossclass skills there.

bah shush...he might not have known it

[Enochroot]

There were actually some decently fun ideas in the OP - but way to rip it apart about the cross-skills thing and not explore the other ideas or new ideas.

- new twitch to tumble would be great - instantaneous tumble - maybe mobility could give it, would be fantastic

- heal pack thing is ingenius in my opinion - whoever shot this down because "I can count the number of times I've used it in the harbor on one hand" just isn't thinking. That's WHY it needs a revamp. If you could take the heal skill and apply heal kits to people (think the same timer bar as eating a tome or something) - and recoup hp - the heal skill and healing kits would actually be useful again!! Yeah, that would be terrible!


But whatever , keep flaming the cross-class skills suggestion (which of course, I don't agree with either ^^)

[Uska]

There were actually some decently fun ideas in the OP - but way to rip it apart about the cross-skills thing and not explore the other ideas or new ideas.

- new twitch to tumble would be great - instantaneous tumble - maybe mobility could give it, would be fantastic

- heal pack thing is ingenius in my opinion - whoever shot this down because "I can count the number of times I've used it in the harbor on one hand" just isn't thinking. That's WHY it needs a revamp. If you could take the heal skill and apply heal kits to people (think the same timer bar as eating a tome or something) - and recoup hp - the heal skill and healing kits would actually be useful again!! Yeah, that would be terrible!


But whatever , keep flaming the cross-class skills suggestion (which of course, I don't agree with either ^^)

No the heal pack idea is bad to pots are the way to go tumble is fine and mobility gives more then it does in pnp none of the ideas in the op are worth a nano second of dev time.

[Aranticus]

OP, if you get a deep cut, why go to a doctor, run to the nearest tailor and get him to stitch it up. oh get your local butcher to help out at the surgical rooms to help with surgery. oh wait there is more, get your barber to do your brazilian wax for you

[Uska]

OP, if you get a deep cut, why go to a doctor, run to the nearest tailor and get him to stitch it up. oh get your local butcher to help out at the surgical rooms to help with surgery. oh wait there is more, get your barber to do your brazilian wax for you

Stop it I cant breathe.

[Enochroot]

No the heal pack idea is bad to pots are the way to go tumble is fine and mobility gives more then it does in pnp none of the ideas in the op are worth a nano second of dev time.

Why exactly are "pots the way to go". That's basically ********. A new way of healing and utilizing another skill + items already in game between fights would be fine. What problem do you have with that exactly?

I was thinking about my mobility comment in the elevator after I posted it - yeah, you're right - but something like if you tumbled quicker with higher tumble ranks, that might be badass and fun as hell.

Stop prioritizing dev time, that is NOT an argument - the PM's will do that - just discuss whether it's a generally good idea or not, and how best to approach it. The rest is clearly up to Turbine, to give us new skills, new content, or for some reason revamp korthos island and 3 barrel cove ...

[Alizar]

"Because, "some classes are better at some skill period.". In the current system, with no standard bonus, you can choose not to learn a skill, and then hey your not better at that skill than another class who didn't have it as a class skill and learned it via cross-class system. If, however, there were standard bonuses for classes that were generally good with those skills, it would help out alot, and make a lot more sense.

Say, a sorc that didn't put any points into concentration? That's just dumb. But, if the bonuses system was in, then the sorc would naturally be good at concentrating...which would make a lot more sense!

Get what I'm saying? Or is it all just too much above your knowledge level? "

You must be from one of those other MMO's where the training is done automatically for you. Well, here in DDO land we like to be in charge of what our charcter developes in. If you made this an automatic process then this will only succeed in making each class a little more the same. I would rather opt for making more rules and choices that make the classes more unique. You say not taking conncentration for a sorc is dumb, but maybe I would choose to run with the quicken feat and take umd or jump instead.

[Kromize]

You must be from one of those other MMO's where the training is done automatically for you. Well, here in DDO land we like to be in charge of what our charcter developes in. If you made this an automatic process then this will only succeed in making each class a little more the same. I would rather opt for making more rules and choices that make the classes more unique. You say not taking conncentration for a sorc is dumb, but maybe I would choose to run with the quicken feat and take umd or jump instead.

This doesn't build your character for you. Rather, it gives your character the natural skill bonuses you would get for training as a <class>. And you would still be able to choose what skills you want to train for.


And, about healing kits and the heal skill... If we implemented this, we could change the gameplay completely. Also, put a good delay on healing pots, because, however you look at it, theres no way a person can: a) drink that fast, and b) fit that much liquid in their body(50 pots down in 1 quest...sheesh). Also, let us sit down and eat/drink while in a quest, with a nice long timer on how often we can do it...(:

[baddax]

partial jump/ tumble ability.
If i have a 30 jump and want to jump on a 4 foot ledge, why must i jump my entire 30 ? This is especially noticable in quests like coalesence chamber. I have had casters go in and start handing out jump to everyone in the party. I will specifically tell them not to give it to me on my fighters as my jump is more than sufficient and anything more makes the quest more difficult.

Use the repair skill to repair armor and weapons?

[Jay203]

A class is just a path that the person chooses to take. Why should that make the person naturally good at certain skills? Why shouldn't the person himself be naturally good at certain skills, no matter what class he chooses?

When you train for something, you will always increase your skill level of skills that you use for that training.

A class is just a path, and shouldn't dictate whether the person is naturally good at the skills or not. It should only give a person more training with certain skills. And, if they were naturally good at skills, wouldn't it make more sense to get a standard bonus as you level anyways, showing that your naturally good and thus don't need to train it to make it better?

um.... you kinda made an argument against yourself there...
yes, a class is a path that a person chooses to take, when you choose to take the fighter class, it means you're pursuing the path of weapon prowess
when you choose to follow the path of a rogue, you choose to train in various twinking skills
so if you want that full rank of UMD for ever point you spend in it, go take a path that includes UMD as part of its path career =_=;;;

YOU are making the decisions here, not the class, you choose the path you want to follow, you choose the things you want to focus in as you gain experience

[boldarblood]

DnD called - they want there game back.

[norman_quickfinger]

Folks it is safe to say we are reading the ranting of a person who never has or just started playing D&D. Dude I'm sorry but when training as a fighter you are not thinking of learning how to cast a spell or sneak attack someone. Please go out and buy the Players Handbook D&D 3.5 and read it before you post stuff like this. If the Devs went and did this there wouldn't be rogues,clerics,fighters and wizards. You would a Race that could do alot of neat stuff and then noone would really play the game. We have enough problems with that (Hint To The Devs). And btw what mmo does that the way you described? Is it the one that is no longer on-line?

[norman_quickfinger]

DnD called - they want there game back.

Nope sorry but D&D doesn't claim this one.

[Kromize]

um.... you kinda made an argument against yourself there...

Really? I'm saying that training for something, will inevitably boost some skills, but, that doesn't mean that you can't customize some of the other training you do... When I'm training as a fighter, or a sorcerer, there isn't only one way I can train as that. If I'm a fighter who wants to use wands to, then I would train my UMD...whats wrong with that?

Folks it is safe to say we are reading the ranting of a person who never has or just started playing D&D. Dude I'm sorry but when training as a fighter you are not thinking of learning how to cast a spell or sneak attack someone. Please go out and buy the Players Handbook D&D 3.5 and read it before you post stuff like this. If the Devs went and did this there wouldn't be rogues,clerics,fighters and wizards. You would a Race that could do alot of neat stuff and then noone would really play the game. We have enough problems with that (Hint To The Devs). And btw what mmo does that the way you described? Is it the one that is no longer on-line?

Haha. You must not have understood much of what I posted... In fact, I'm not entirely sure on how you thought this was a reply to me...was it? And since when do skills determin what class you are?

[norman_quickfinger]

Really? I'm saying that training for something, will inevitably boost some skills, but, that doesn't mean that you can't customize some of the other training you do... When I'm training as a fighter, or a sorcerer, there isn't only one way I can train as that. If I'm a fighter who wants to use wands to, then I would train my UMD...whats wrong with that?


Haha. You must not have understood much of what I posted... In fact, I'm not entirely sure on how you thought this was a reply to me...was it? And since when do skills determin what class you are?

Yes that was a reply to your first post. I just didn't quote it. Look this is D&D and these are the rules of it and the Devs are trying to stay as close to them as they can. Class skills are what define each character. If you want to train in UMD then do it but it will cost you twice as much if you are not a rogue or a bard. They are here to keep a certain amount of balance to the game. If the Devs didn't what you suggested they would have to rewrite the entire game. A few for example : all trap difficulty would have to be greatly increased, the umd of all the items would have to be increased and along with all spell dc's. It sounds easy but it's no where near that easy. Ask anyone into programming and they'll tell you the same thing. So really nothing would change. Just us waiting for the game to come back up after it crashes. And then you would be in The Shroud(for instance) You're up there swinging away at the chicken. You're running low on hit points do you a: hope the battle cleric next to you (that is swinging away at the chicken also) stops long enough to heal you Or b: stop attacking and pull out a scoll of heal(150 pts only) try to cast but can't because you can't make the concentration check. You shouldn't have to make that choice. If you still think it's that easy send a dev a privite message and ask them. If you don't believe them then I don't know what to tell you.

[norman_quickfinger]

Ok Kromize I should have read you profile before I reply to you. You go to Nebraska Wesleyan University for Computer Science. What is you major there before I continue this post?

[Jay203]

Really? I'm saying that training for something, will inevitably boost some skills, but, that doesn't mean that you can't customize some of the other training you do... When I'm training as a fighter, or a sorcerer, there isn't only one way I can train as that. If I'm a fighter who wants to use wands to, then I would train my UMD...whats wrong with that?

think of taking a class as going thru the type of training you wish for your character
if you're following the path of rogue, your studies would be more... focused... than if you follow the path of the sword
of course you'll end up with "some" skills should you choose to follow the path of the sword all the way, that's way you're even allowed to train in that skill whether you're following the path of rogue/bard or not, you just won't be as effecient as if you had followed the path of the rogue
do realize that it doesn't matter if they give you full rank in UMD as you spend while giving Rogue/bard bonuses to make them stand out. they'll just end up upping the UMD check on all things so it'll be the same as if you get .5/skill point spent as fighter =_=