Legion for a Day Program

[Tom318]

i have nothing to justify. i'm in no way related to legion...

still drivel is drivel

It is.. well being generous so.. guild level is something everyone can see and verify. You can't claim a guild level you don't have. Anyone can claim to be the first level 20 half-orc, but how would anyone prove that? but you can claim to have for instance a level 70 guild, and anyone from the person who joined on the first day to the person who's played for years, can see whether or not your guild is level 70.

So it's an independent, verifiable metric of measurement that is independent of opinion and conjecture.

[BurningDownTheHouse]

So it's an independent, verifiable metric of measurement that is independent of opinion and conjecture.

Sure, except it measures the wrong thing....

[Tom318]

Sure, except it measures the wrong thing....

That's open to much debate I guess.

[blitzschlag]

So it's an independent, verifiable metric of measurement that is independent of opinion and conjecture.

as you can see its not free of opinion. feel free to raid with the great "english comedy series" guild on thelanis...

[BurningDownTheHouse]

as you can see its not free of opinion. feel free to raid with the great "english comedy series" guild on thelanis...

Lol, QFT.

[Tom318]

as you can see its not free of opinion. feel free to raid with the great "english comedy series" guild on thelanis...

Yes it is. If you have a level 60 guild, then "I have a level 60 guild" is not an opinion. Whether or not it's a measure of "greatness" is. What it is, though, is a verifiable way to measure something that can't be accomplished easily.

[BurningDownTheHouse]

What it is, though, is a verifiable way to measure something that can't be accomplished easily.

Standing in the harbor and spamming guild invites all day long, is actually quite easy.

[Tom318]

Standing in the harbor and spamming guild invites all day long, is actually quite easy.

You don't get guild favor from standing in the harbor spamming invites

[BurningDownTheHouse]

You don't get guild favor from standing in the harbor spamming invites

No, you get it from n00bs that accept your guild invites and then proceed with earning you free renown.

[blitzschlag]

Yes it is. If you have a level 60 guild, then "I have a level 60 guild" is not an opinion. Whether or not it's a measure of "greatness" is. What it is, though, is a verifiable way to measure something that can't be accomplished easily.

the guild level is just that, the guild level. if you quest regularly with either a small or large enough guild everyone reaches certain guildlevels. so the small guild of lvl 20s that does constant epics and high level raiding gets to the same level as fast as the large guild of f2p that never play beyond lvl 10 and farm irestone inlet because of the fat lootz.

its just a indication of constant questing/raiding around or above charlevel.

sure, if you are lvl 70, it shows that you are lvl 70. but what relevance does it have other than different options for your guildleader to pay cash to turbine?

if you play the game you know what guilds are in your "league" that you can blindly invite into your raids/quests. if you don't know the guild but see a high guildlevel, its a sign to back off (at least for me).

[Tom318]

No, you get it from n00bs that accept your guild invites and then proceed with earning you free renown.

That's an achievement as much as any, and at least he's learning some real-world skills

[Tom318]

the guild level is just that, the guild level. if you quest regularly with either a small or large enough guild everyone reaches certain guildlevels. so the small guild of lvl 20s that does constant epics and high level raiding gets to the same level as fast as the large guild of f2p that never play beyond lvl 10 and farm irestone inlet because of the fat lootz.

its just a indication of constant questing/raiding around or above charlevel.

sure, if you are lvl 70, it shows that you are lvl 70. but what relevance does it have other than different options for your guildleader to pay cash to turbine?

if you play the game you know what guilds are in your "league" that you can blindly invite into your raids/quests. if you don't know the guild but see a high guildlevel, its a sign to back off (at least for me).

That leaves us without a measure of "greatness" that is independent, verifiable and free of opinion.

[BurningDownTheHouse]

That's an achievement as much as any, and at least he's learning some real-world skills

That leaves us without a measure of "greatness" that is independent, verifiable and free of opinion.

Bored (trolled?) now, bah-bye.

[blitzschlag]

Bored (trolled?) now, bah-bye.

yeah, he made it to my list with the drivel of this and some other threads today.

[fuzzy1guy]

Funniest thing i've read all week.

[kailiea]

That leaves us without a measure of "greatness" that is independent, verifiable and free of opinion.

I bet that level 70 guild can't run Tower of despair in 9 min but I know Legion can....

It was even verified with a screen shot in the achievement section.... along with an 11 min shroud, 4 min hound elite etc etc

The current renown system only benefits small or large guilds and really any noob can loot a chest

[Rasczak]

Now that is some funny doo doo.

Good job guys, that's a great way to pick up recruits who will pay you to be in your guild....


25pots.....Tell you what...I'll donate 25pots to Legion since they obviously becoming poor

[Purgatory]

Its nice to do a Tod,Hound and Shroud all before your ship buffs run out

[GlorkTheInvader]

I bet that level 70 guild can't run Tower of despair in 9 min but I know Legion can....

It was even verified with a screen shot in the achievement section.... along with an 11 min shroud, 4 min hound elite etc etc

The current renown system only benefits small or large guilds and really any noob can loot a chest

Yeah, it seems to me that there are plenty of other measurable, verifiable ways of measuring greatness, that have MUCH more to do with in-game/in-quest ability than how quickly you can loot renown.

[Renegade66]

There's a separate thread with about a jabillion posts explaining why guild renown does not equate to guild power. Find that one and do your homework.

We figured this out early during the race to GL20 on Thelanis. Legion just did their usual high end zerging of raids and epic content. When we got up to about level 15 or so, we realized that Bane(?) was a couple levels ahead of us. So, we took a day and a half out of running challenging content to farm Epic Von 2 chests like everyone else was doing. Boring as hell and 0 challenge, but we quickly overtook them and was GL 20 well before anyone else on Thelanis.

Another server made 20 before us, but in reality if we would have chosen to farm chests from day 1, we would have reached the goal at least 3 days earlier than anyone else. The point is not to say we should have done that or sour grapes. The point is that the renown system is severely flawed when it comes to measuring guild power, so we wrote it off as a guild goal.

One can argue the key measurements equating to the most powerful guild. Keep in mind that Power does not equal Quality. Meaning, you don't have to be nice to be powerful.

Another important note is that being small does not give you a bonus to being powerful. Quite the opposite actually. There are many guilds twice as large as Legion. If this allows them to knockout more elite/epic content and gain worldwide firsts then they are more powerful than us. There are no weight classes in DDO. Well unless you consider the flawed renown system.

Here are some general qualities to measure guild Power. The weighting of each is debatable as well as the list itself. Again, there's an entire thread devoted to the obvious.

* Most epic quest/raid completions
* Most elite quest/raid completions
* Percent success rate for epic/elite content
* Lowest average completion time for epic/elite content
* Most worldwide firsts
* Most server firsts
* Other significant accomplishments (e.g. first to solo something extremely difficult to solo)

By the way, none of these factors are included in guild renown. Renown misses the mark entirely wrt guild power.

To answer, how do I know that Legion is the most powerful guild in the game, I offer "It just is". Kind of like, why is the ocean wet? It just is. Everyone knows it is. Everyone agrees that it is. You can set criteria for wetness, but in the end the ocean will be most wet, just as Legion is most powerful.

If you need more meat, then take my sig for example. You will see a slew of worldwide firsts and also other accomplishments such as first to cap a permatoon. Someone mentioned these are easy accomplishments based on dedication alone. I disagree. People had been trying to cap a perma-toon for years with no success. There is an entire guild dedicated to doing so. It took more than dedication to make it happen. It took power, especially when considering it was accomplished in less than a month in a 3 man group.

Those accomplishments represent just 1 member of Legion. Multiply that out by the others in Legion with time records, firsts, solo achievements, etc. Then compare that list to other guilds. I doubt you'll even find another guild with as many achievements as any one of us alone. A fact is a fact. The ocean is wet. Legion is most powerful.