Petition to change Bastard Swords

[Oreg]

Either change the crit multiplier or the crit range or the the base damage. Somehow equalize them to khopeshes. I want to look good while I am killing **** ....

[ChildrenofBodom]

I don't like the idea of upping the crit mutiplier.

But upping the base damage sounds good. Thought not sure how it would make sense...

[FluffyCalico]

Nah kopeshes are wrong and borken. You don't change more items to match the one that's broken. You unbreak the broken one

[Impaqt]

Nah kopeshes are wrong and borken. You don't change more items to match the one that's broken. You unbreak the broken one

QFT.

Breaking other things to fix broken items is a poor solution.

[Oreg]

Nah kopeshes are wrong and borken. You don't change more items to match the one that's broken. You unbreak the broken one

I can live with that. I just don't see it happening.

[Monkey_Archer]

Nah kopeshes are wrong and borken. You don't change more items to match the one that's broken. You unbreak the broken one

/QTF

Khopeshs should have been x2 and give a bonus to trip....
Since that would anger alot of people, instead they should have their base damage reduced (to D6 like rapiers and scimitars)

Giving human free bastard sword proficiency may be an easier way to see more bastard swords without doing something stupid like increasing their power.

[esoitl]

There is absolutely no basis for changing Bastard Swords.
I've always searched to find the PnP data for a Khopesh but I don't have any of the books that it appears in. The only basis for changing the stats is if it was added to DDO incorrectly and that's merely to make it correct to form.

Asking to change something because there is better makes no sense and is a very lame argument.

[Amberyll]

According to Arms and Equipment, Kopesh is 1d8 with a crit range of 19-20 with a X2. They give a benefit to Trip. I haven't looked to see what it is in DDO.

Bastard Sword have always required an exotic weapons proficiency to use one handed, and DDO won't let you use it 2 handed.

Don't know if there is any true benefit to do anything with either one, though, imho.

[Goldeneye]

I think upping the Base Damage on Bastard Swords would be a great idea
Bastard swords deserve to be worth using

[Shaamis]

Nah kopeshes are wrong and borken. You don't change more items to match the one that's broken. You unbreak the broken one

Turbine is not going to do any of this, unbreak khopeshes, break bastard swords, or any of it, because it's where they want them.

Bastard swords need to be martial weapons used two-handed, and exotic when used one-handed, but since they can ONLY be used one-handed in DDO, they are working as intended.

Khopeshes are exotic weapons that have bonuses towards special attacks that DDO doesnt really employ, so they were not included in the weapon abilities. If the crit multiplier was reduced to X2, congratulations, you have a longsword.

Bastard Swords havent been associated with a race or class in DDO (or D&D iirc) but that doesnt mean Turbine can't add enhancements for Bastard Swords reminiscient of drow/rapiers or dwarves/dwarven axes.

That could help improve the use of a Bastard sword as a weapon in DDO.

[Borror0]

Either change the crit multiplier or the crit range or the the base damage. Somehow equalize them to khopeshes. I want to look good while I am killing **** ....

Exotic weapon does mean it had to be good.

If we had good random loot once again, bastard swords may be worth something.

[Lerincho]

oooh, can they change them in to a bird? or a giraffe?








or at least allow us to put Bastard Sword in our bio's for those of us that use Bio as trade list.

[Delacroix21]

Greensteel bastard swords (like dwarven axes) are actually buffed with a double increase in die size damage 2d8 vs the 2d6 they should be. Of course that does mean it requires raid crafting.


The dwarven axes didnt deserve the boost though, weapon proficiency gained for free (with buffing enhancements no less) shouldnt equal one you have to spend a feat on.

[Junts]

Either change the crit multiplier or the crit range or the the base damage. Somehow equalize them to khopeshes. I want to look good while I am killing **** ....

yeah, make them legitimate swords, mommy sword and daddy sword got married

[Thucydides04]

I was sitting in class bored today and considered the math behind Bastages vs. Dwaxes vs. Khops.

The results are pretty interesting if you are building a TWF DPSer and plan on using a feat to aquire the weapon proficiency.

Anyways, here are the results:

Consider the expected value of a swing with each weapon where the weapons are the same acorss the board (i.e. a +5 Basatge vs. +5 Dwaxe vs +5 Khop) where B denotes a Bastage, D a Dwaxe, and K a Khop. I also let x= strength dmg multiplier and y = the wpn modifier and allow for improved crit without any loss of generality.

E[B] = 0 + 15*(0.05*(5.5+x+y)) + 4*(0.05*(2*(5.5+x+y)))
E[B] = 6.325 + 1.15x + 1.15y damage per swing
E[D] = 0 + 17*(0.05*5.5+x+y + 2*(0.05*(3*(5.5+x+y)))
E[D] = 6.325 + 1.15x + 1.15y damage per swing
E[K] = 0 + 15*(0.05*(4.5+x+y)) + 4*(0.05*(3*(4.5+x+y)))
E[K] = 6.075 + 1.35x + 1.35y damage per swing

Notice that Bastages deal the same amount of damage as a Dwaxe regardless of strength multiplier. If you consider when there is extra damage due to a crit (like maiming) the Bastage will do 1d6 on crit vs. the 2d6 by the Dwaxe. But the Bastage is hitting critcally twice as often as the Dwaxe so its a wash again! Perhaps if you are considering a Dwaxe build, you may want to reconsider the Bastard Sword and save yourslef some plat equipping him. I know that with some attention to the AH I can equip a twf with a pair of vorpal, smiting, and disruption bastages for less than 50K plat.

Now, compare the results of both with the Khop, i.e. when is E[K] > (E[B]=E[D])
Consider the following:

E[K]?>E[B]

6.075 +1.35x + 1.35y > 6.325 +1.15x + 1.15y

Doing algebra yields:

x + y > 1.25

Now we know that for any combination of strength and weapon multipliers whose sum is greater than 1.25, the khopesh does more damge per swing than either the dwaxe or the bastage. This is pretty significant since any most dps builds start with AT LEAST 14 str. So, clearly there is no incentive to go the Bastard Sword route since it costs a feat (at least Dwaxes don't cost a feat if you play a dwarf). About the only good thing a Bastard Sword has going for it is its low cost.