Torthur Hareft; str based pure ranger

[KoboldKiller]

Because they're built for mod 4-6, back when monks did not exist and giants were more common. And everyone refuses to reroll because
A. they're ignorant and thinks they're still the best.
B. They have a s-load of loot and it would take a while to perform better.

I'll be sure to let them know that.

[Crarites]

Well done on reading the post! Applaudes to you, I guess you overlooked the calc as well. Sigh.

Regardless any pure ranger will never have aggro, not in my world. And certianlly not while playing with me or Yar. Period.

You are ~30 dps behind without aggro, and 6 dps ahead with aggro oh and you lose perma true seeing. Woopi-fkn-do. Please go back to the basics.

So is that a yes when you have agro litany + goggles is more dps?

[Yargore]

Much like most of your posts you initially post a statement as fact and you later back up that fact with opinion.

What?
I do think dwarfs are a poor choice for rangers because humans are better.
What's the point of making a dwarf instead of a human? flavor, and that's it.

If you think "poor choice" means "completely useless", then that's your problem.

Ab****-Yargore: This build is gimp

Other people: Why?

A.Y.: because it's gimp

Others: Why?

A.Y.: low AC low DPS and is not an MC.

Others: Much more to this build than AC and DPS. Plus the AC and DPS is actually very good when looked at in depth. We are not talking about MC

A.Y.: This build is gimp because it has low AC low DPS and is not an MC, here let me post a build with the same AC and DPS but with a much worse gear selection and min/max

You really can't read, can you?

I said multiple times that the build is gimped because it lacks PA and 4 damage enhancments, while only having 50 AC in CE.

What the "others" have said is that it's justified to be gimped aslong as you are pure and have written a very long post about the build.

The build AO posted had higher AC and higher DPS. Get your facts straight please. It also had much better gear layout.

[Absolute-Omniscience]

So is that a yes when you have agro litany + goggles is more dps?

Yes, with aggro and litany you deal 7 more dps, ~1% or so. Whilst if you do not have aggro (the more common senario in powergamer groups) you are 30 dps behind, ~6% dps behind. And you lack perma true seeing, +15 spot, +15 search.
The choice is obvious; but there you have it. My unbiased facts posted once again. I will not try to deny the fact that Litany + goggles = more dps while having aggro, but I will not advocate it as a superior combination either, as max dps and the average senario dps will be lower.

[Yargore]

Regardless litany + goggles is more dps when you have agro.

Ah, after 5 pages you actually say it. And you're saying that we don't add anything to the discussion

Litany and mentau goggles is slightly more when you have aggro, but overall bloodstone and vod goggles are better.

So I was not wrong when I said that bloodstone is better than litany for DPS.

You should rest this case now, you were wrong. Just accept it.

[kingfisher]

Who in gods name uses banishers anyways? You wont be able to banish in mod 9 anyways, as they are on their plane.

banishers own a good chunk of the vale and vale quests. i dont care how high your dps is its a helluva lot more effective to one shot your way through these quests and the vale. not seeing you need them, a vorp or dps works well also, but saying they are unusable is stupid. yar is always telling us how smart yall are, but this post is getting laughed at. better edit this post to remove the evidence.

[kingfisher]

[QUOTE=Yargore;2305128]

You really can't read, can you?

I said multiple times that the build is gimped because it lacks PA and 4 damage enhancments, while only having 50 AC in CE.

QUOTE]

you said this after many many pages of 'go monk!!' and 'use khopsehes!!' followed by 'change to human'. i know that you are NOW saying that the build is gimp because of PA and the dam enhancements (even though this has been justified to the satisfaction of everyone but you), but thats not how all this got started.

just keeping things in perspective since most of the original posts were eaten or edited.

ARRGH!

[Rhymer25]

Ah, after 5 pages you actually say it. And you're saying that we don't add anything to the discussion

Litany and mentau goggles is slightly more when you have aggro, but overall bloodstone and vod goggles are better.

So I was not wrong when I said that bloodstone is better than litany for DPS.

You should rest this case now, you were wrong. Just accept it.

I love how you argue. "I am right because I am right you are wrong because your are wrong." "Bloodstone and vod goggles are better because they are better." Whew man nice comeback.


I also love when I say you can't read, you come back and say I can't read. You copy my posts like you copy builds. The majority of your attacks on other people for that matter you use the same wording someone has used on you in the past. There were some posts on this thread at one time of you saying things to Torthur that people said to you on your own threads.


Here is some advice dude. Get over it. People say junk on here all the time (me being one of them.) you just can't take it so personal.

[Nyvn]

+31% more dps (+4 str, +1 DA enhancement +5 pa +3 FE dmg, bloodstone, dual DA, better weapons, ) Makes all the difference in the world

Not sure how starting str of 15 vs 17 = 4

I know he has 28 listed, but it seems to me he's not counting buffs ie. Ram's Might.

- PA and the enhancements however do make a large difference.

- Having 1d6acid, goodburst definitely hurts his damage vs well everything that matters. Especially considering he has WoPs for trash.

- I agree his post is very hard to read and makes pulling info out of difficult, it's been mentioned numerous times.

- As been stated in other threads your posting style provokes people. If you'd originally listed improvements within his parameters we wouldn't have 10 pages of back and forth with little actually being discussed. After all people will make characters however they want, but if they have good information to base their builds on even flavor builds can be effective.

[Rhymer25]

[QUOTE=kingfisher;2305180]

You really can't read, can you?

I said multiple times that the build is gimped because it lacks PA and 4 damage enhancments, while only having 50 AC in CE.

QUOTE]

you said this after many many pages of 'go monk!!' and 'use khopsehes!!' followed by 'change to human'. i know that you are NOW saying that the build is gimp because of PA and the dam enhancements (even though this has been justified to the satisfaction of everyone but you), but thats not how all this got started.

just keeping things in perspective since most of the original posts were eaten or edited.

ARRGH!

Exactly king!!!! I was giving a summery of the last 10 pages not the last two.

[Yargore]

you said this after many many pages of 'go monk!!' and 'use khopsehes!!' followed by 'change to human'. i know that you are NOW saying that the build is gimp because of PA and the dam enhancements (even though this has been justified to the satisfaction of everyone but you), but thats not how all this got started.

just keeping things in perspective since most of the original posts were eaten or edited.

ARRGH!

You are really putting words in my mouth now. When I first came to this thread (as Aaxeyu) I made plenty suggestions on how to improve the build without multiclassing.
I mentioned that going monksplash would be better, but all the suggestions were for a pure.
That was when you and some other dude jumped in and flamed me for saying that monk splash is better, and the OP ofcourse defended his build.

If you actually would have read the OP you would know that telling him to go monk, use khopeshes, and change to human actually are 100% valid suggestions to his build, as he wanted his ranger to be as powerful as possible. That' the only reason he went pure and dwarf.

You really have to accept that no matter how rude and blunt I am, I'm still right most of the time. You keep saying that I'm wrong just because you don't like me. You never had any real argument for anything you have said. Only insults and flames. You really are pathetic.

lol, yea your post is really objective, right. You flame and insult me in almost every thread, so it's clear that you really don't like me. So your perspective on the thread is extremely subjective. You might actually be so blind that you believe that it's objective. I wouldn't be surprised, as you are an extremely biased person. Atleast here on the forums.

[kingfisher]

.

ay, arrgh, lmao

[Rhymer25]

You are really putting words in my mouth now. When I first came to this thread (as Aaxeyu) I made plenty suggestions on how to improve the build without multiclassing.
I mentioned that going monksplash would be better, but all the suggestions were for a pure.
That was when you and some other dude jumped in and flamed me for saying that monk splash is better, and the OP ofcourse defended his build.

Deny it all you want. It is more than just king that remembers how things progressed. You post opinion as fact and back it up with more opinion. You admitted that, when your wrong, you just edit your own posts and you admitted your angry because people flamed your builds.

Even after the CUBE your back under a new name with some dude equally as much of a troll as yourself. Thank you for attacking this build over and over and over again for no strong valid reason.

[Yargore]

I love how you argue. "I am right because I am right you are wrong because your are wrong." "Bloodstone and vod goggles are better because they are better." Whew man nice comeback.

More like: I am right because I calculated it and saw the results before I made an opinion on the matter.
The result is fairly obvious, and if you would actually have cared to calculate for yourself you would also know.

AO did post a calc to prove it, but that calc was "wrong because it's wrong"

Bloodstone and vod goggles are better because 6 seeker and 8 SA damage is better than 4 seeker and 1-3 damage.
I don't post every calc I make, as it's just to time consuming. But when I make an initial statement I almost alwasy do.
This time it was "that random dude who just came here to troll" who stated that litany was better than bloodstone, but he didn't show any calcs to back it up, he just kept saying that "I was wrong because I was wrong".

I also love when I say you can't read, you come back and say I can't read. You copy my posts like you copy builds. The majority of your attacks on other people for that matter you use the same wording someone has used on you in the past. There were some posts on this thread at one time of you saying things to Torthur that people said to you on your own threads.

LOL.
So I'm bad for saying something that's already been said? So what if I sometime have used the same wording as someone else? Am I supposed to find new ways to say the same thing?
Seriously, you're making me laugh now.

Show me a build that I've copied. I think that will be really hard as there is none.

Here is some advice dude. Get over it. People say junk on here all the time (me being one of them.) you just can't take it so personal.

I got the impression that you were the one taking things personaly, considering all the insults you were throwing around.

[Crarites]

Yes, with aggro and litany you deal 7 more dps, ~1% or so. Whilst if you do not have aggro (the more common senario in powergamer groups) you are 30 dps behind, ~6% dps behind. And you lack perma true seeing, +15 spot, +15 search.
The choice is obvious; but there you have it. My unbiased facts posted once again. I will not try to deny the fact that Litany + goggles = more dps while having aggro, but I will not advocate it as a superior combination either, as max dps and the average senario dps will be lower.

Ah, after 5 pages you actually say it. And you're saying that we don't add anything to the discussion

Litany and mentau goggles is slightly more when you have aggro, but overall bloodstone and vod goggles are better.

So I was not wrong when I said that bloodstone is better than litany for DPS.

You should rest this case now, you were wrong. Just accept it.

I like how both of you say, Your right but still wrong. The benefits of true seeing are easily available on a clickie. The benefits of spot neglible to anyone familiar with the quests. For advocating lower DPS I must now pronounce you both as gimps and summarily insult your ancestry.

[Yargore]

Deny it all you want. It is more than just king that remembers how things progressed. You post opinion as fact and back it up with more opinion. You admitted that, when your wrong, you just edit your own posts and you admitted your angry because people flamed your builds.

Even after the CUBE your back under a new name with some dude equally as much of a troll as yourself. Thank you for attacking this build over and over and over again for no strong valid reason.

Well, then it's more than King who is wrong about it then.

Yea, I probably do that sometimes, but that is because it's so obvious that for example a monk splashed human ranger is better than a dwarven pure.
Most of the time I do back my statements up with facts, but people like you ignore it. Instead of admiting that you were wrong you toss an insult and more flames to hide it.

Yes, sometime I do edit my posts when I'm wrong, because I don't want people to see inaccurate information and think that it's accurate. But I don't do it without a clear admiting that I was wrong.
You are making it sound like I go back to my posts and edit them to hide that I was wrong. That is just not the case.

Aaxeyu was never banned, the sub just ran out occasionaly. No one was playing on that account at the time after all...

The strong valid reason to "attacK" this build is because it's a bad build that the OP states to be "as powerful, if not more powerful than almost every multiclassed melee build(in terms of dps, skills umd included, hp, AC, and saves)."

He have 50 AC in CE for crying out loud!
He havent even taken PA and all damage enhancements yet he calls it a DPS build. He use a +4 str item, no bloodstone, and a **** handaxe in his offhand!.

If those are not valid enough reason then I don't know what is.

[Yargore]

I like how both of you say, Your right but still wrong. The benefits of true seeing are easily available on a clickie. The benefits of spot neglible to anyone familiar with the quests. For advocating lower DPS I must now pronounce you both as gimps and summarily insult your ancestry.

Give up already will you?
Bloodstone is better than litany when it comes to DPS. There are situations that it's not, I admit that. But most of the time it's better to use bloodstone.
And your statement was that Litany was better than bloodstone for DPS.
You are wrong and it has been explained to you why already, so you're just making more of a fool out of yourself now.

Lol, you are not very consistent either, SS clickes where bad for your DPS, but TS clickes work aren't

[Yargore]

Not sure how starting str of 15 vs 17 = 4

I know he has 28 listed, but it seems to me he's not counting buffs ie. Ram's Might.

- PA and the enhancements however do make a large difference.

- Having 1d6acid, goodburst definitely hurts his damage vs well everything that matters. Especially considering he has WoPs for trash.

- I agree his post is very hard to read and makes pulling info out of difficult, it's been mentioned numerous times.

- As been stated in other threads your posting style provokes people. If you'd originally listed improvements within his parameters we wouldn't have 10 pages of back and forth with little actually being discussed. After all people will make characters however they want, but if they have good information to base their builds on even flavor builds can be effective.

The str difference comes from OPs +4 str item.

Sure people can play whatever they want. But if they come to the forums and defend their gimped builds they will be "attacked".

IMO this build is not any better than this paladin: http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=190155.

[Rhymer25]

IMO this build is not any better than this paladin: http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php?t=190155.

There you go comparing this build to other classes again ROFL. You such an idiot it is not even funny.

Dude just because people attack your builds does not mean you need to attack this one. You admitted that before now get the **** out.

[Seregon]

Well, then it's more than King who is wrong about it then.

Yea, I probably do that sometimes, but that is because it's so obvious that for example a monk splashed human ranger is better than a dwarven pure.
Most of the time I do back my statements up with facts, but people like you ignore it. Instead of admiting that you were wrong you toss an insult and more flames to hide it.

Yes, sometime I do edit my posts when I'm wrong, because I don't want people to see inaccurate information and think that it's accurate. But I don't do it without a clear admiting that I was wrong.
You are making it sound like I go back to my posts and edit them to hide that I was wrong. That is just not the case.

Aaxeyu was never banned, the sub just ran out occasionaly. No one was playing on that account at the time after all...

The strong valid reason to "attacK" this build is because it's a bad build that the OP states to be "as powerful, if not more powerful than almost every multiclassed melee build(in terms of dps, skills umd included, hp, AC, and saves)."

He have 50 AC in CE for crying out loud!As proven this person clearly has missed the AC breakdown that we have posted atleast 4 times. Otherwise they would know this build can get alot more than 50ac. I will post the AC breakdown again so maybe this person can read it.

Hey Seregon,
I thought I’d pass along a theoretical TWF AC breakdown for your build. This is all Mod 8 stuff. I went with Dragontouched leather only because you could get some item consolidation. If the Mod 9 combo items are awesome rings you may want to forgo the Chattering Ring in favor of a DT rune. The Kundarak Delving Suit could bring you up by 2 more but then you're stuck with the chattering ring. You have the UMD for the chaosguarde which could be another +2. However, I don't think you would want to give up the leviks braciers.
Mod 9: Add +2 for Tempest III, Subtract 4 for the lack of a Shield spell, +1 more from Max DEX (With +4 DEX Tome). (Net loss 1 AC)
And, as always, you can gain +4 AC by whipping out ye olde +5 Heavy Shield, +2 more/DR for Shield blocking, and +4 vs. Giants.

DEX: (26) 14 +2 Tome, +3 Ranger, +1 Exceptional (DT/Litany/Greensteel), +6 Item

AC:
10 - Base
08 - Armor (Dragontouched Leather)
08 - Max DEX (7 + Dwarven Armor Mastery I)
01 - Dodge Feat
02 - Tempest
05 - Combat Expertise
05 - Deflection (More than likely a Min II item)
04 - Insight (Weapon/DT Rune)
03 - Dodge Bonus (Chattering Ring/DT Rune)
01 - Ritual
-------------------------------------------
47 - Standing around

05 - Barkskin
04 - Shield Clickie
03 - FE
-------------------------------------------
59 - Incidentals

01 - Haste
02 - Recitation
05 - Aura
04 - Bard Song
-------------------------------------------
71 - With a little help from your friends

Enhancements:
Ranger DEX III
Dwarven Armor Mastery I
Tempest
FE: AC III


PS: Yargore I'm directly telling you the building prerequisittes for this build are Pure class, strength based, dwarven, tempest ranger. I made this build, those are the prereqs that I used. Stop saying otherwise.


He havent even taken PA and all damage enhancements yet he calls it a DPS build. He use a +4 str item, no bloodstone, and a **** handaxe in his offhand!.

If those are not valid enough reason then I don't know what is.

You clearly could careless about valid reasons, for example, I've posted my AC breakdown 4 times and you are still posting that this build has 50 AC, when infact its max AC is 71.