Why are clerics a money sink in this game?

[Chaos000]

I bought 100 heal scrolls before my first Hound. I've since run 4 Hounds and 5 Shrouds (all PUGs) and have 98 left. My cleric only has about 2.5 million gold but that number's going up, not down. Now, I haven't healed a VoD-gone-wild yet and have seen clerics in there chugging pots and burning through scrolls only to delay the inevitable fail but outside of those, I think you have to work pretty hard to be a money sink.

4 successful hounds runs with pugs without any failures is pretty impressive... just wondering, you didn't run out of sp while on hound duty?

VoD can go smoothly without any (if much) resources. Had this happen like twice. Total scrolls burned between all the clerics 4-5, bard used 15 heal scrolls total, no mana pots, raid finished with half our mana bar left. Won't ever happen on elite but even VoD can be non-resource intensive. Most fun I've had in a while and the dps was awe-inspiring.

You'll find yourself getting much richer if you're more selective as to which groups you cleric for. Avoid people that make comments like "you're a cleric do your job and heal me" or those that send you tells asking if you will join their group because the only person they need is a cleric. Groups that are fine without one and don't go stupid the moment one joins the group are the ones that will net you plat in the long run.

[Dktr]

I think there is a matter of perspective to take into account. To most of the group, being aggressive and reckless pays off. If you do tougher quests than intended and you do them faster it is more profitable. It usually pays off for the group as a whole. It isn't good for the cleric though.

It isn't a big deal for capped clerics. There's only a little bit higher than target level that exists. They're also doing quests with other capped characters with good equipment.

A lot of people have a lot of capped characters. They see nothing wrong with this philosoophy. They might lose money on their clerics but make it on other characters. The benefits generally outweigh the losses. It's easy to assume everyone is like yourself, it's natural. If you have a pile of plat that never dips below a few million, heal scrolls are like newspapers. That cleric you're with probably doesn't even want to be bothered with an offer to defray the cost of 10-20 heal scrolls.

The problem occurs when a group of 9th level alts decide they need a cleric to do 12th level quests on elite, and get a guy whose only character above 2nd level is his 9th level cleric. If he saved every coin he ever had he wouldn't be able to afford the heal scrolls this group will need.

I just think this is such an important point- I do not want it to get lost in all the useless drivel of people bragging about how uber their clerics are.

[weyoun]

I can now. I'm on with Trissa

I run by everything tossing blade barriers and kill the end boss. I'll heal anyone who can keep up with me.

[Fenrisulven6]

I run by everything tossing blade barriers and kill the end boss. I'll heal anyone who can keep up with me.

We had someone like that tonight. After asking him if he was going to let the rest of us play the game, he continued to spoil the quest for us.

Of course, his zerging caught up with him [after causing 2 party wipes] so the 3rd time through I carried him in my pack most the way. He complained he wasn't having fun just riding along. Imagine that.

[Fenrisulven6]

ugh. Apologies if I was too harsh. Guess I'm still ticked off at that loser.

[Zenako]

ugh. Apologies if I was too harsh. Guess I'm still ticked off at that loser.

Nah, might well have done the same....

(But harder to do on higher level quests where so many characters can Raise Dead these days and can be eager to do so, just to show they can do so...)

[Kalari]

My perspective doesnt come from having capped characters, even though I have 2 under my belt now. It comes from hands on learning that if I worry about people who cannot play right that I only end up broke and annoyed and not wanting to play a healer for a long time.

The op asked why playing a Cleric is a money sink. Point blank I believe that many of us when we take on this class and role get the mentality that the mission is in our hands. When things dont go smooth and wipes who is the first person they look at? The cleric, why? Because were supposed to keep the party up. A lot of people try to come on here and say they dont behave this way or act that way but ive seen it. People getting mad cause they didnt get that heal even though they pulled a bone head move. Or expecting a new cleric to go into quests levels above them and pull off miracle feats. Even getting my first character a wizard to level 16 never fully prepared me for what it would be like playing a healer to cap.

I had to learn the hard way not to consume resources from guilt. Not to constantly worry about mana sponges who refuse to believe their characters are not invincible.

I also had to learn and this was the hardest for me, to let a player die if they were costing too much sp to heal. I hate letting people go down on my watch but if my bar is going down because they cant take a hit, casters who draw too much aggro with a spell or dont use cc because they are nukers only but dont have the knowledge on when to nuke and when to hang back (my favorites those who finger things at a sliver a of health all the time and not just to be funny cause we do have some that do that to **** off fighters for a laugh). Or those who by the time they are in the higher level quests still have no clue about resists, poof against poison items, disease immunity or pots and the like. People like that who expect me to have infinite mana to not only buff them and protect them from every ailment but keep them up as well and use my scrolls and pots willy nilly. After months of playing like that and draining both my mage and my clerics funds I knew I had to change my ways and trust me it was the best thing I ever did.

So while you can take some posts as bragging on what they dont do and sure many clerics have other characters to fund them. Or how to some clericing is easy, I know that its not you have to have patience and the mentality to want to help your party the best you can. But if you try to be a super cleric your going to be broke and burnt out and its just not worth it. Clericing doesnt have to be pricey if you dont wish it to be. Getting players to change up tactics when your in a group is easier then you think. With many healers who dont pug anymore due to bad attitudes youd be surprise what speaking up will do for your sp and consumables.

So seriously if your having problems with money and I stress this to anyone making a cleric remember do what you can and only what you can. Dont throw consumables at a party thats in over its head or doesnt work well together. If you feel that you have to keep a party up use your sp first then once it comes down to having to use consumables make yourself vocal about it. A good party will recognize your effort and help out. And the jerks who do not will be apart of that happy little list you wont bother grouping with to heal again. It will be easier on your nerves and your pockets then trying to play the perfect heal bot.

[jmonty]

my clerics make money. since i don't have a caster leveled up all the way yet if i want some plat i can always solo the vale or orchard with my 'healer.'

[ShrewMage]

As a player who has capped out 4 differnt builds of clerics all I sincerely ask for is some kind of sprint boost to keep up with all the monks and barbs who move similarly to a straight guy fleeing from the police in a gay neighborhood :P

Seriously though, I have sunk hundreds of thousands of plat into buying Heal, mass cure mod, restoration & resurrection scrolls. Over the years it's probably been more in the millions that have been wasted on supplies but quite honestly, what more is the ingame virtual money good for other than playing the game. Some may choose to spend it on WoP rapiers, others may need to buy every scale from the AH. But as far as I'm concerned I can't relly take it to the grave to me, so what better use than to keep someone else from going to the grave

[Fenrisulven6]

I had to learn the hard way not to consume resources from guilt. Not to constantly worry about mana sponges who refuse to believe their characters are not invincible.

I'm still learning this. My current irritation is the perp who zergs off at half-strength, causing me to focus more time & mana on him instead of the rest of the group. I especially hate wasting wand whips on someone who is constantly blocked b/c they won't slow down. I'm of a mind to simply deny heals to anyone who is blocked 3 consecutive times.

Anyways, my point is that when feeling guilty about letting the idiot die, try to remember that he's wasting time that you could better spend on more deserving peeps in your group who are considerate enough to play smart.

[Mhykke]

I'm still learning this. My current irritation is the perp who zergs off at half-strength, causing me to focus more time & mana on him instead of the rest of the group. I especially hate wasting wand whips on someone who is constantly blocked b/c they won't slow down. I'm of a mind to simply deny heals to anyone who is blocked 3 consecutive times.

Anyways, my point is that when feeling guilty about letting the idiot die, try to remember that he's wasting time that you could better spend on more deserving peeps in your group who are considerate enough to play smart.

"Zerging" and "smart" aren't necessarily mutually exclusive.

[Fenrisulven6]

"Zerging" and "smart" aren't necessarily mutually exclusive.

Yes Mhykke, I'm seeing that now. Point to you.

Unfortunately, only a small fraction [5%] that I've seen meet your definition of Zerger [uppercase Z]

The rest are all wanna-be's zergers [lowercase z] who are mana parasites that distract me from more deserving players. But not for much longer.

[Mhykke]

Yes Mhykke, I'm seeing that now. Point to you.

Unfortunately, only a small fraction [5%] that I've seen meet your definition of Zerger [uppercase Z]

The rest are all wanna-be's zergers [lowercase z] who are mana parasites that distract me from more deserving players. But not for much longer.

A bad player is a bad player, whether he runs ahead or sticks with the group. The fact he runs ahead doesn't necessarily make him bad. If he's getting damaged a lot/killed/being a drain/not killing mobs when ahead of the party, that makes him bad. He can do all that with the party. He can stay right next to everyone, and still get damaged a lot/killed/drain/not killing......

[Fenrisulven6]

Agreed, but a bad zerger sticks out like a sore thumb. The others can skate by with little if any notice.

Regardless, I blame you for not teaching all the wanna-be's the art of a proper Zerg.

Its all your fault. So there.


/everyone pls forward your expense reports to Mhykke for compensation

[Frodo_Lives]

I have a perfect example of how and why clerics can be a money sink, but only if you let them.

Just the other night I ran a Feast or Famine run in a PuG, on elite with my level 13 cleric. He is less than an AP from 14th and really trying to get him there, and it was my first time doing this quest on elite so it was going to be good xp.

The party consists of a rogue, wizard, human paladin, WF paladin, WF ranger, and myself.

Now I will say for the first part of the quest I was running with some technical difficulties, so running low on SP before we got to the first shrine was understandable. However, later I ran out of SP again and recalled and used the shrine outside (which cost about 2k xp) and continued on.

The 2 WF were being such sponges that I blew through over 1300 sp in no time at all. Again. I mean really, 1300 sp in mostly healing (with some Greater Commands thrown in) for one area that consisted of 4 rooms? Even on elite that is beyond excessive.

The WF paladin was among the worst sponges I have run with in almost 3 years of clericing. The ranger wasn't much better.

However, I wanted the favor and xp so I shrugged my shoulders and carried on. I used probably about 2k worth of wands, but I refused to use even one scroll on these guys because quite frankly they were horrible with no thought to aggro management, tactics, damage prevention, or even taking care of themselves.

We did succeed after I gathered up 4 soul stones to take them back to the shrine during the end fight. I proceeded to wand whip the human paladin and fight the end boss and we took him out thanks in large part to the wizard who had recalled for sp as well.

Bottom line is I could have spent a small fortune doing a routine quest at a level that we should have been able to handle easily, and one that I have run numerous times on my first cleric and haven't had anywhere near the sp problems. But I didn't simply because I don't spend my plat on bad players.

As a cleric I don't feel any extra pressure for the group to successfully finish a quest. If the group (or certain members therein) are not up to the task then we don't get a completion. The reason groups have problems is not because of the cleric, and it's not up to the cleric (or more accurately the clerics money pouch) to bail them out.

[daniel7]

I have done shroud groups with just one other cleric and we both had spell points left over and I have done the shroud before and I had to drink a couple pots.

I have done VOD and made a profit of 3 pots and I have done vod with a loss of 7 pots (if you drink more then 5 pots on VOD you are probably going to wipe).

I use very little resources on SOS, however I will not join just any SOS party. I almost always build my own party for SOS, its not that you need experienced player in SOS it's just that you need a balanced party for it.

As a good ddo player you learn all the quests requirements. Meaning you know how to balance your party for that particular quest and hopefully you start remembering the names of people who are so uber that they rarely need healing. Also you might want to start to remember some of the names of people who constantly have the same lfm up. For instance in Ghallanda, Amalaf, Amalaph, Mannick, and a couple others are always doing SOS and are very good at it so I try to party with these people because I know they aren't going to build an unbalanced party. I rarely use more then a few scrolls in a quest. But as a cleric I tend to pick my groups better. I only join pugs if they look like a balanced party. As a cleric you can probably wait until the group almost fills up before you join since people are usually waiting on a cleric (this is an option I dont have on my rogue since parties tend to only one one in a party).

It's less frustrating when you are prepared for losses. Most of the time I know when I am going to take some losses and I am prepared for it. I will allow an unbalanced party to form for instance if its people that are on my friends list or in my guild. I dont mind dishing out some plat on these people. I know that VOD is a gamble before I do it, unfortunately for you fighters I got my armor on my first VOD run and I don't ever want to do it again....but I will do it again...but only for guildies and friends.

-Venerate level 16 clr