Drow, Human, or WF---Sorc

[Rholt25]

So let me get this strait. There is a trinket you can get from the abbot that can only be used by neutral aligned characters? That is also a good thing to know.

As for using heal items, I do agree that switching to a wand/scroll does take, or rather "feels" a buttload longer then just hitting a repair spell.


I've decided to go WF and give it a try. The best part about this game is that if i dont like him.. I'll just roll another character.

Thanks to everyone for all the advice and help.

Oh yes, one more quick question. Is diplomacy worth it on a caster? I have been messing around with it at low lvls and it seems to be working fine. However, will it work when I have a few firewalls going and the mobs are constantly getting aggro'd on me? Will I even want to get the aggro off of me?

I know I am derailing my own thread, so by all means keep going with the discussion.

[HeavenlyCloud]

So let me get this strait. There is a trinket you can get from the abbot that can only be used by neutral aligned characters? That is also a good thing to know.

As for using heal items, I do agree that switching to a wand/scroll does take, or rather "feels" a buttload longer then just hitting a repair spell.


I've decided to go WF and give it a try. The best part about this game is that if i dont like him.. I'll just roll another character.

Thanks to everyone for all the advice and help.

Oh yes, one more quick question. Is diplomacy worth it on a caster? I have been messing around with it at low lvls and it seems to be working fine. However, will it work when I have a few firewalls going and the mobs are constantly getting aggro'd on me? Will I even want to get the aggro off of me?

I know I am derailing my own thread, so by all means keep going with the discussion.

Diplomacy works even at cap... but the really good skill is intimidate :O nothing better than shield blocking with the torc sitting on firewalls getting your sp back .

[bigj1608]

Solid choice going Warforged.

If I decide to make another caster, that will be what I do, just for a change.

Sorry to steal the topic, but what would be the blocking DR with the Madstone shield and Stoneskin? (I don't know if they're related)

[vtecfiend99]

Solid choice going Warforged.

If I decide to make another caster, that will be what I do, just for a change.

Sorry to steal the topic, but what would be the blocking DR with the Madstone shield and Stoneskin? (I don't know if they're related)

I dont remember the numbers but it is amazing. Then go and try the docent of defiance. sit there shield blocking taking NO damage, slap ur torq on and call it a day. endless spell points.

[Rholt25]

ok whats this Torc thing?

[Desteria]

This was my 1st mmo, and the 2nd character I rolled up was a 28 point human sorc. I still have her now almost 3 years later.

Yea she started with 14 con and an 18 charisma.

she has a 38 charisma, 2380 sp, 337 hp, and a 40 umd.

I don't really think race will make a much difference of a difference at end game. It's all about your equipment.

YOu bring up a VERY good point about it being mostly abotu equipment IF you maxed cha and didn;t dump con most well equiped sorcs WILL play about the same end game the KEY difrences are humans get an extra FEAT that can be HUGE, drow have no real way to make up for that, drow will have a few mroe AP's to spend but realyl with the current ap's that's not much of an issue, WF will get self healign Via SP rather then scroll only, a valuable item for sure BUT is it worht a feat???? imo no.

[Desteria]

From someone with the point of view of a lame arcane caster with great self healing traits, I don't doubt you identify with clerics. However, a pure sorcerer is a DPS character. He kills things fast and efficiently. Self healing is a secondary bonus. Perhaps your sorc resembles a cleric, but a pure sorcerer typically has more in common with a Barbarian than a Cleric. I am not at all surprised that you dont understand the analogy.

A WF sorc lose NO DPS it's the CC/insta kill that takes a hit really all the best nuke spells have NO SAVE anyway.

AS for the cleric comparison i though it was GOOD, because frankly the last 4 tiems my cleric pugged shroud I HAD ther TOP kill count beating out 1 or 2 arcanes each TIME!!!! that was from mostly destruction Wich is exacly the same as a sorcs FoD... So imo the cleric anology was very accurate.

All that said I like my human for the extra feat the most atm ESPECALY with teh racial toughess&minos Fix upcomming, having a spair feat to take tougheness possibly means a LOT more HP, compared to a WF who say does nto take toughness, your looking at END game +4 tomes taken in to consideration, but not abbot triket because we dotn know what the changes to that are, A WF gets +40 HP from CON, a humian gets +42 form feat + less AP's, spent OR they spend a few mroe AP's and onyl need a +3 tome, so humna have the option ot use the feat to otatly negate any WF HP advantage, the WF still hase soem nice imunities and self healing btu at that point the human has no fial umd really any way... human can chose to have a few less HP and and a diferent feat though.

[Desteria]

Try scrolling when you have 4 named Orthons on you and tell me how that works out.

Done it not hard at all, I love orthoin aggro in VoD gets me LOTS of SP back ;0

[Desteria]

ok whats this Torc thing?

i forget the exact name, but it;s raid loot from the demon Queen, GTR SPELL pen 6!, wiz3, and the special ability Transform Kentic energy Wich is somethign like a %5 chance every time your hit to give you back 22ish SP.

[Uska]

YOu bring up a VERY good point about it being mostly abotu equipment IF you maxed cha and didn;t dump con most well equiped sorcs WILL play about the same end game the KEY difrences are humans get an extra FEAT that can be HUGE, drow have no real way to make up for that, drow will have a few mroe AP's to spend but realyl with the current ap's that's not much of an issue, WF will get self healign Via SP rather then scroll only, a valuable item for sure BUT is it worht a feat???? imo no.

yes but wf also get immunity to hold, poison,disease, dont really need a underwater item, all great stuff along the way to cap.

[Blind_Skwerl]

The Warforged is already a feat short of the Human, and I doubt many Humans take Quicken, so in order to be at your best, the Warforged is going to be two feats short of the Human.

I am confused here. The warforged is down a feat compared to the human, yes. What's the deal with the quicken feat? Why do you say a warforged sorc needs this?

[Desteria]

yes but wf also get immunity to hold, poison,disease, dont really need a underwater item, all great stuff along the way to cap.

tbh my human sorc has nto botherd to equip her UWA item in a LONG LONG tiem now either , the hodl immunity is onyl to hold person at high levels mobs use mold monster and it gets ya still, (STILL ROCKS in WW etc ie while elvelign till soem time after 10th level), Posin is a pot or item not that big a deal imo, desise OK that oens good though desise imunity does come with tier one NEG for the NEG POS POS&NEG SP GS SP item, Wich is my standard SP item for casters/clerics....

NOW the imunity you did NOT mention that does ROCK your socks off if the neg level imunity IE enervate+beholder eyes!!!!

IMO it;ls easly betwene WF and human atm EVEN given the choice to turn my current 28pt humna sorc in to a drow I never would, the 0-1 DC is NOT worth the feat imo.

[Blind_Skwerl]

I agree that the 32 point human is a better choice than a drow. I think the argument can easily go either way with WF vs. human though. Do them both!

[ForwardWu]

1 advantage of wf is that even my human soccy can scroll heal, but when emergency happens (e.g. fail a save in coc/dbf), it takes a lot more times for me to self heal to full (2 heal scrolls, , each heals 121, and usually a total of 6 secs to recover), while a wf can easily self cast reconstruct in 1 sec to almost full (240 something). Dont argue that emergency happens only because of poor skills, as we all know that happens sometimes in an adventure.....


On the + side, a human soccy can act as a healer for short man questing...tried once we 4 man gianthold tor with 1 human ranger and 2 wf fighters, and my soccy is the healer with reconstruction loaded. its fun to get all the 3 dragons without a cleric

[arcani]

Hey all. Ok so I've played a numbers of Wizzies up (straight wizzy, wizzy + 1 rog). Ready to make a sorc. I have 28pt build or Drow open. I do NOT raid. Mainly join LFG groups or duo with a friend (and just starting playing around with hirelings).

Below are some mainly stat-oriented questions that would be greatly helpful to be answered, and that I think work well in this thread (since those are the three races i am considering). And I've read through all messages on the 4 pages of this thread, and have gone through most of the threads in the lengthly
sorc forum.

Con:
Ok. I KNOW I'm missing something here. Each +2 con gets you an extra +2 hp a level? So by Level 16 you have +30 HP per +2 levels of Con? Obviously there is more to it, as everyone talks about WAY higher HP for WF vs. Hu vs. Drow?
Are the other peripherial bonuses significant? I.e. the higher Fortitude save?
In particular, also trying to figure out why going crazy on Con in the 18/18 build is worth lower Int (skill points), Dex, etc.

Dex:
I know high Dex sorcs are unpopular, but in the past there were some AC fieds who loved high Dex Sorcs. And obviously if you liked high Dex you liked Drow. Higher Reflex Save + AC sounds like everyone agrees is not worthwhile to put points into Con? I can see some wisdom from a save perspective of decent Dex + high Cha + Force of Pers for good overall saves? Or just not relevant in the later game?

Int:
When I'm spending 1 point into Concentration each level, and 1 point into UMD every level, that means I get only 1 point to distribute here and there to anything else (Haggle, Diplo, Balance, Tumble, etc) -- and that's assuming I bumped Int up to 12 on non-Human. And I know that I can raised skills miscellaneous through items (except first level of Tumble?). With previous builds like Wiz+Rog obviously skill points were crucial, but seems like with Sorc after Conc+UMD that spending in skills is not a big deal?

I know, this thread was originally Hu+WF+Drow, but those are the three I'm vacilating between. And I understand the Hu feat and WF resistances and Wizzy-based heals side, so it is the racial starting distribution of the racial stats that are tripping me up.

Again keeping in mind that I have 28pt Hu vs. 28Pt WF vs. Drow, and that I don't raidand so am looking at being limited to group gear for the most part.

For playstyle, I do tend to grab aggro more than I should (I know the WF rational for that). I do tend to do CC more often than burns (except on bosses obviously). And traditionally my modest bankroll does get eaten up with heal pots.

Any advice, insight, etc., is greatly appreciated.


Arc

[Strykersz]

tbh my human sorc has nto botherd to equip her UWA item in a LONG LONG tiem now either , the hodl immunity is onyl to hold person at high levels mobs use mold monster and it gets ya still, (STILL ROCKS in WW etc ie while elvelign till soem time after 10th level), Posin is a pot or item not that big a deal imo, desise OK that oens good though desise imunity does come with tier one NEG for the NEG POS POS&NEG SP GS SP item, Wich is my standard SP item for casters/clerics....

NOW the imunity you did NOT mention that does ROCK your socks off if the neg level imunity IE enervate+beholder eyes!!!!

IMO it;ls easly betwene WF and human atm EVEN given the choice to turn my current 28pt humna sorc in to a drow I never would, the 0-1 DC is NOT worth the feat imo.

WF are immune to all paralysis effects, which includes earthgrab, all holds, ghoultouch, the abbot touch, encasement, and gcube paralyze.

[bobbryan2]

WF are immune to all paralysis effects, which includes earthgrab, all holds, ghoultouch, the abbot touch, encasement, and gcube paralyze.

But not flesh to stone from stone scorpion statues.

[Strykersz]

But not flesh to stone from stone scorpion statues.

That's a different immunity(wf are immune to flesh to stone but not petrification).

[Osharan_Tregarth]

Hey all. Ok so I've played a numbers of Wizzies up (straight wizzy, wizzy + 1 rog). Ready to make a sorc. I have 28pt build or Drow open. I do NOT raid. Mainly join LFG groups or duo with a friend (and just starting playing around with hirelings).

Below are some mainly stat-oriented questions that would be greatly helpful to be answered, and that I think work well in this thread (since those are the three races i am considering). And I've read through all messages on the 4 pages of this thread, and have gone through most of the threads in the lengthly
sorc forum.

Con:
Ok. I KNOW I'm missing something here. Each +2 con gets you an extra +2 hp a level? So by Level 16 you have +30 HP per +2 levels of Con? Obviously there is more to it, as everyone talks about WAY higher HP for WF vs. Hu vs. Drow?
Are the other peripherial bonuses significant? I.e. the higher Fortitude save?
In particular, also trying to figure out why going crazy on Con in the 18/18 build is worth lower Int (skill points), Dex, etc.
Every two points of con gives you 1 extra hp per level. So only +16 per +2 levels of con.

The hp thing is just because of the different starting con scores between the three races, and the access to the racial toughness enhancements. Right now there is an existing bug that lets pretty much every character pick up the racial toughness enhancements at level 11, if they are the correct race. This will be getting fixed in a future update. Otherwise, you'd need to fit in a toughness feat to get more hp's between one race and another.


Dex:
I know high Dex sorcs are unpopular, but in the past there were some AC fieds who loved high Dex Sorcs. And obviously if you liked high Dex you liked Drow. Higher Reflex Save + AC sounds like everyone agrees is not worthwhile to put points into Con? I can see some wisdom from a save perspective of decent Dex + high Cha + Force of Pers for good overall saves? Or just not relevant in the later game?
End game, your ac won't be horribly relavent without some specialized gear. For myself, I wouldn't bother.
You'll run across the occasional person on the forums with a fanatical devotion to their ac build caster, but those are generally isolated people who tend to disagree with almost everyone else.
Force of personality will (if I understand it correctly) REPLACE your wisdom bonus to will save with your cha bonus, not add them together. So not much point in adding any points to wisdom if you are thinking about getting force of personality.

Int:
When I'm spending 1 point into Concentration each level, and 1 point into UMD every level, that means I get only 1 point to distribute here and there to anything else (Haggle, Diplo, Balance, Tumble, etc) -- and that's assuming I bumped Int up to 12 on non-Human. And I know that I can raised skills miscellaneous through items (except first level of Tumble?). With previous builds like Wiz+Rog obviously skill points were crucial, but seems like with Sorc after Conc+UMD that spending in skills is not a big deal?
Pretty much. I like to aim for a 12 int on my sorcs... It just seems to work out fairly well that way. Human could stay at a 10.(I'm counting tomes here, to be eaten after creation before hitting level 2)

I know, this thread was originally Hu+WF+Drow, but those are the three I'm vacilating between. And I understand the Hu feat and WF resistances and Wizzy-based heals side, so it is the racial starting distribution of the racial stats that are tripping me up.

Again keeping in mind that I have 28pt Hu vs. 28Pt WF vs. Drow, and that I don't raidand so am looking at being limited to group gear for the most part.

For playstyle, I do tend to grab aggro more than I should (I know the WF rational for that). I do tend to do CC more often than burns (except on bosses obviously). And traditionally my modest bankroll does get eaten up with heal pots.

Any advice, insight, etc., is greatly appreciated.


Arc

responses in red

[Desteria]

1 advantage of wf is that even my human soccy can scroll heal, but when emergency happens (e.g. fail a save in coc/dbf), it takes a lot more times for me to self heal to full (2 heal scrolls, , each heals 121, and usually a total of 6 secs to recover), while a wf can easily self cast reconstruct in 1 sec to almost full (240 something). Dont argue that emergency happens only because of poor skills, as we all know that happens sometimes in an adventure.....


On the + side, a human soccy can act as a healer for short man questing...tried once we 4 man gianthold tor with 1 human ranger and 2 wf fighters, and my soccy is the healer with reconstruction loaded. its fun to get all the 3 dragons without a cleric

My humans heals scroll hit opther peopel for 154 and my self for 169!!! beign thats about half my HP it;s a good tiem to hti a scroll and unles si'm REALLLLLLY low it puts me as full as i need to be for the moment