Mod 9 Is The Ranged Character Killer

[Milolyen]

This... is one of the reasons I quit playing DDO.

I was in a raid group gianthold.

My bow was doing more damage than the tank.

I got told to put away my toy.

I quit DDO that day.

I'm sorry to hear that.

Ranged chars are fun and when played well they are very powerfull. It is just a shame people don't really understand.

Milolyen

[moorewr]

This... is one of the reasons I quit playing DDO.

I was in a raid group gianthold.

My bow was doing more damage than the tank.

I got told to put away my toy.

I quit DDO that day.

You quit because of what someone told you in a party? You quit and you're still posting?

I'm sorry you had a bad experience in a group.. but grow a spine and go play how you like to play with like minded players.

[nbhs275]

You mean after you have dodged and hopped over the non-casting mobs, right? Me, I just plunk them the moment I see them no matter what mob is between myself and them. The other nice thing is I will agro them and swing wide from the group or hang back so if they throw Comet Falls or other AoE it doesn't hit the whole group instead of 3 Melee characters charging, in a group at the caster and getting all whacked by a spell.

Or we could just agree you are uber and do things the game engine doesn't make possible like moving through mobs, instantly teleporting to casters, and killing them in one swing.

UM, so your saying that because a melee has to take 2 seconds to close with a distant group, that somehow makes the pitiful damage and attack speed of ranged combat better? When you attack 2-3 times faster and hit for 10-20 more damage, then maybe ranged is a better option then "once every 2 minutes".

[nbhs275]

This... is one of the reasons I quit playing DDO.

I was in a raid group gianthold.

My bow was doing more damage than the tank.

I got told to put away my toy.

I quit DDO that day.

try WoW. Ranged combat is heavily supported.

[bobbryan2]

I'm sorry to hear that.

Ranged chars are fun and when played well they are very powerfull. It is just a shame people don't really understand.

Milolyen

Just remember, everytime someone says something like this, you do your part in keeping ranged gimped.

[Milolyen]

Just remember, everytime someone says something like this, you do your part in keeping ranged gimped.

How bout I specify then as ranged rangers are very effective? I will conceed the fact that any other type of ranged char is hard to make viable if not a repeater build. But I will argue that a ranged ranger is very effective and leave it at that.

Milolyen

[SqtYork]

FE damage III/IV and appropriate ranger level FE damage bonus.

[esoitl]

What are ranged people getting in Mod 9?

You will see an extra attack for melees at BAB20. Extra attack for TWF tempest rangers. Improved glancing blows for THF fighters and WF. And the list goes on for melee getting better (as it should when you get higher level).

My question is... What will ranged characters get?

You are going to get laughed out of a group if you are a ranger and you start plinking away with a bow. I'm not just talking about rangers, I'm including all classes that want to use a ranged weapon (like that repeater bard, etc).

Does anyone laugh a WoP longbow out of the Reaver?
Don't think so....

Have your been a Cleric in a Shroud where there are very few ranged attackers?
It's not as nice.....

While it isn't a source of DPS ranged combat still has its time and its place. I switch back and forth between ranged and melee on my Ranger depending on the situation. Ranged is sometimes a more viable and easier method even if the DPS is lackluster.

Anyone who says there is no place for ranged combat obviously doesn't know enough about the game.

[Angelus_dead]

How bout I specify then as ranged rangers are very effective?

That's not true either.

Even in a situation like Shroud 4, where Arraetrikos cannot move so that ranged attackers risk neither suffering melee assault nor pulling the monster away from the melee guys, it's still not a good idea to fight the boss with ranged.

[Angelus_dead]

Does anyone laugh a WoP longbow out of the Reaver?
Don't think so....

Some very special and rare monsters who have both a high degree of melee-immunity AND special saving throws providing nigh-immunity to many kinds of spells.

Have your been a Cleric in a Shroud where there are very few ranged attackers?
It's not as nice.....

Totally untrue. On normal mode, if you see someone using a bow or repeater, you know your boss DPS is going to be low.

Anyone who says there is no place for ranged combat obviously doesn't know enough about the game.

There are a handful of special situations that make it difficult to aproach to melee range. They are insufficient to call ranged combat adequately effective. It'd be better if it could have a good role in any random quest.

[Dorian]

That's not true either.

Even in a situation like Shroud 4, where Arraetrikos cannot move so that ranged attackers risk neither suffering melee assault nor pulling the monster away from the melee guys, it's still not a good idea to fight the boss with ranged.

I always think its best to use up multi-shot before going into melee on part4. You can usually cycle though and start each round with a multi-shot depending on the group. I guess that goes back to knowing when to range and when to melee.

Again, this thread is more about ranged combat falling behind even more when Mod 9 is released.

[Cyr]

Can someone explain to me what 'a raid group gianthold' is? Really, they quit DDO because of what someone said in what raid? The only one in gianthold I know of has air elementals all over and those are really annoying to hit with melee.

Oh and OP has a point. Ranged in general needs a boost. Not one specific classes ranged combat, but all ranged combat.

[Angelus_dead]

I always think its best to use up multi-shot before going into melee on part4. You can usually cycle though and start each round with a multi-shot depending on the group.

Or it might be better to save manyshot for later, when the density of blades could make it too damaging to remain in the center.

But either way, if you're not manyshotting, then ranged isn't helping kill that boss.

[Rog]

They don't already?

its not what u use it how you use it!

[itsmezed72]

*Rolls d20*

*Disbelieves that any archer can plink for 200+ at a clip*

Unless by clip you mean "stack of 100".

Granted, I'm talking on on critical hit, and including the good damage. Purely physical damage was high 180s, iirc

Figure a 32 strength, favored enemy bonus + enhancements, elf enhancements, and weapon specialization, and it all adds up. Plus there's a bump form Deepwood Sniper.

[Ranmaru2]

While I will agree that firing speed is not optimal:

1) It's amazing how much easier it is for casters to PK/FoD elementals in the reaver when someone's firing a Wounding/WoP bow/Repeater

2) It's amazing how much easier it is to keep moving in coal chamber when a ranger gets aggro with a bow to pull them away, has haste/drinks a haste pot, and speed boosts through

3) It's amazing how easy it is to manyshot the eladrin to death in Devils, or even kite the mobs in monastery if they're getting to be too cluttered (lots of low con/hp drow). Quite simple to get giant aggro in prey and not get hit much too.

4) narrow corridors of Kobold allow for quite the damage to be dished out (maybe even a call lightning replication) by firing straight ahead

5) Stormcleave even goes a lot easier when mobs are hit for a bunch with a bow shot and then dragged to a caster's FW or Web

6) Gwylan's on elite is so much easier with stuff being kited while tanks (if they even have a head on their shoulder) take out the priests first

7) Feast/PoP/Trial/Cabal all have narrow corridors where one can easily mow lots of mobs down.

8) Relic/Made to Order all go very well when a good archer is there to help, especially made to order where the ranger would buy some time to get the trap so the tanks can fight the duergar without stepping on the mines (as the idiots so often do..)

9) Sleeping dust allows for easy pickins of the magi while kiting the spiders to keep them out of the way

10) weakening beholders on the way to hound is done so much easier from range

11) Too many Protectors/Drones in Hound? Ranger can keep em occupied (or a caster with FW, but that's just how I roll in there )

12) (insert other example here where the ranger makes the cleric happy by controlling how much damage the buffoon fighters/tanks, who don't move, take while still taking them down)

Sorry realizing versatility is not your specialty Angelus, do you not kite mobs in part V?

[Angelus_dead]

Sorry realizing versatility is not your specialty Angelus, do you not kite mobs in part V?

Sorry you think that a melee or caster can't do that.

[Ranmaru2]

Sorry you think that a melee or caster can't do that.

melee..nope they need to keep aggro while being in range...

casters..hell yes they can. Been doing it on my main since lvl 9. Though they usually have bigger fish to fry or dont need to waste sp on trash (like stupid sorcs who FoD or PK EVERYTHING in ritual...)

[Angelus_dead]

melee..nope they need to keep aggro while being in range...

You don't know what you're talking about.

[itsmezed72]

yes, I would like to see those numbers as well.

Seeing as you asked...

Under optimal conditions, the numbers break down thusly:

Strength: 30 (w/ +6 item). +2 Ram's Might, +2 Rage, +4 Double Madstone = 38

Damage Bonus: +14 Strength, +2 Ram's Might, +2 Specialization, +7 Favored Enemy/Enhancement, +2 Elf Racial Bonus, +5 Mineral Bow, and +10 Bard Buff = +42

Damage: d10 +42 = 52 x4 (Deepwood Sniper) = 208 + 6 Good + 30 Good Blast = 244


Sooooo... optimal conditions, yes. But heck, that's what all these high ac building people quote their stats at, too