Upcoming Minos Legens Fix.

[EKKM]

Actually, I have to disagree with you; exploits should be fixed promptly. If they are being abused, then that is the devs fault, not the players; if they don't like it, they can fix it. Instead, they're acting like whiny 12-year-old dungeon masters whose dungeon wasn't as tricky as they thought it was, so they blue-bolt the entire party. Color me unimpressed.

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the underlined sentence seems to contradict your diatribe...

[Desteria]

Makes it work? Right, OK.


My Sorc won't have the 45HP item. I might make a Min2 Helmet just to dump the Legens (another 25HP and two Stoneskin clickies), but that's questionable.

bah I'v shown you how to get the minos and a +45 shroud item you will only lose 2 points of concentration over your +15 con ring.

[Desteria]

But let's put it this way: Even if I had been on when they announced the change, is there any evidence to suggest that the devs listen to anything the playerbase has to say? The next argument is obviously "Well, then why say anything at all?", but that's missing the point.

yes see frensied beserker, the dev's made changes to that PRC for barbs that appear to be based on exacly what players said about it favoring barbs useign very no barb weapon types, i belive hte change implemented is actuly excaly the same as oen of the player suggestions!!!

[Desteria]

With the helm, I get close to 200, and my feats are max, emp, MT, spell pen, and FoP; which of those can I live without? (hint: the answer is not "max," "emp," "MT," "spell pen," or "FoP.")

It's fantastic that your build wasn't based on the helm; what are you going to say when they decide to "balance" whatever it is that makes your sorc exceptional, if he is?

A drow sorc and you have MT..... thats oen feat that shoudl be swaped
FoP on a drow shoudl also be swaped you have soem nice racial bonuses to will saves any way.....

Of course they both shoudl have bene Extend and GTR spell pen...

The the question would be out of Extend, Emp, Max, Spell pen, GTR spell pen what shoudl you drop and tbh then i woudl be HARD pressed to answere. I would havce to say yay humans, they can aford it giving drow the short stick on HP but then that makes sense, mroe HP less cha = human less hp more cha = drow.

Quick note the aboev was also only 5 feats the 6th should be highten, you get 6 feats at current cap.

[Desteria]

Yea, funny? Two of the best feats in the game, and you're dissing. Buh-bye.

MT is an utterly usless feat for a sorc just about EVERY other remnotly caster feat is better then it!!!!!!!!!!!!

see the various posts in the sorc forms for explinations on this.

[Desteria]

85 SP is negligible?



Yea, and heighten was already on the list; one more feat to agonize over.



Anyone else notice how many mobs in the new zones like to cast greater command?

Yes 85 SP is 2 SPELLLS

Extend saves you that mainy SP after 9 castings of levle 3 + spells (haste displacment, fireshild) or after 1-2 casts of a emped maxed WoF.

YOu listed 5 feats you shoudl have 6 feats, and you should have highten aws well.

yes BUT betwene your natural drow will bonuses and a strong will save class, and G-hero, and nightsheild(or a resist item), your will save will still be plenty strong, frankly i find it;s the commit falls that are more of a problem.

[Desteria]

Who uses con as a dump stat?

MY srow paladin when the cap was level 10 and Paladin AC+saves+ self cast resist buffs made you untouchable, he has a 9 starting con... hes still over 350 hp now!

[Desteria]

So now I have to swap out a level 6 spell; ever hear of infinite regression?



No, 38 HP was good, 20 is not worth wasting the head slot on; granted that most of the other helmets suck, too, but I could take a 6 cha helm and get a decent cloak. My plan was to keep the minos and get a 6 cha GS weapon, but now that's hosed as well.

LEvel 6 spell or SCROLLS that last 11 misn OR planer grids that last 11 mins.....

20 hp AND HEAVY FORT.... don't tell me your not planing to have no heavy fort item or wase another slot on a heavy for item!!!!!

[Borror0]

This may come off as a stupid question but... why do you guys give him any attention?

[Desteria]

This may come off as a stupid question but... why do you guys give him any attention?

because I worry other players, newer players will read his posts and think he has good ideas abotu what feats are good and take the same ones thus reducing the avalible pool of better sorcs to fill my grousp when i need to pug out a few spots.

I realize hes purty much beyond all hope of salvage but other arnt yet so i argue for there sakes.

[Borror0]

because I worry other players, newer players will read his posts and think he has good ideas abotu what feats are good and take the same ones thus reducing the avalible pool of better sorcs to fill my grousp when i need to pug out a few spots.

Oh, that's the reason I argue about with beyond salvation as well.

But, I think that if a new player still thinks he has a good idea, the new player might be beyond salvation as well at this point.

[Desteria]

Oh, that's the reason I argue about with beyond salvation as well.

But, I think that if a new player still thinks he has a good idea, the new player might be beyond salvation as well at this point.

True but most fo the post happened while i was on my day off soo I didnt; get to replie till the end, and i just had to get in on it sicne it was stuf fi fell strongly about

[feynman]

because I worry other players, newer players will read his posts and think he has good ideas abotu what feats are good and take the same ones thus reducing the avalible pool of better sorcs to fill my grousp when i need to pug out a few spots.

I realize hes purty much beyond all hope of salvage but other arnt yet so i argue for there sakes.

Yea, there's a reason TA doesn't get many good players in their PUGs; no offense to the couple of good players in the guild.

In the meantime, if you have an argument other than "I know better than you, nyah-nyah!", then bring it; otherwise, keep your insults to yourself or join Boring0 on ignore.

[Desteria]

Yea, there's a reason TA doesn't get many good players in their PUGs; no offense to the couple of good players in the guild.

In the meantime, if you have an argument other than "I know better than you, nyah-nyah!", then bring it; otherwise, keep your insults to yourself or join Boring0 on ignore.

um ok if your goign to be callign out my guild, I'll ask you to state your character and guild as well, and the we can discuss that, but from my experance AND i was the main raid leader for a good year, filling guild raids with pugs, I had a tone of pugs sending me tells as soon as my lfm's went up, and tones of complements fro a smoth and succefull and cheap raids, our rule for VoD elite was no clerics should NOT have to use pots unlike half the vod normal pugs i see that always needed them.


See my posts above, where i tear MT a new one I give a detailed break down and have on other ocation how for eg. extend saves you more the 85 SP in no time at all.
Check out the sorc forms there are toens of my arguments backed by numbers in there for what MT/IMT are abotu the 2 most usless feats a sorc cna take.

[feynman]

the underlined sentence seems to contradict your diatribe...

How so? It's really simple: You cannot hold players accountable for the developers' mistakes. Off-hand, I can think of a dozen better ways to handle situations like this than the way they do, if their goal was truly to "stop exploits," starting with allowing public discussion of things that aren't working right and ending with adding walls to block exploit spots until they figure out how to fix them.

Instead, they're using it as an opportunity to reign in "overpowered" classes; worse, it seems like they are intentionally delaying the fixes so that they will be available the next time they screw up the balance.

Again, why is the solution not to simply make the enhancement HP go away when you take off the helm?

[vainangel]

thank the gods

i thought that was a BIG oversight in the implementation of the helm

[Desteria]

How so? It's really simple: You cannot hold players accountable for the developers' mistakes. Off-hand, I can think of a dozen better ways to handle situations like this than the way they do, if their goal was truly to "stop exploits," starting with allowing public discussion of things that aren't working right and ending with adding walls to block exploit spots until they figure out how to fix them.

Instead, they're using it as an opportunity to reign in "overpowered" classes; worse, it seems like they are intentionally delaying the fixes so that they will be available the next time they screw up the balance.

Again, why is the solution not to simply make the enhancement HP go away when you take off the helm?

Becasue that requies major changes to the games base code, which = possiblites for massive bugs, (game imploding bugs), and problems + huge lag spikes every tiem any oen swaps items to check though all the AP's etc... this fix is a change to one item, to how it grants HP, and basicaly has no change to case game impoding bugs, or any lag.

[Aspenor]

Wow, somebody is complaining about a fix that everybody has known will take place for months and months?

Go figure. People will always find something to cry about.

[Aspenor]

Again, why is the solution not to simply make the enhancement HP go away when you take off the helm?

Because the helm was never meant to allow access to the enhancements in the first place. In DDO, items do not allow access to feats, nor enhancements. Minos Legens was the only notable exception. Eladrin clearly stated months ago that this was not intended, and that those utilizing the bug might be disappointed with the results when the fix goes live.

At least he's giving us a warning, so people that want to can take the toughness feat. People's characters could theoretically have been irreversibly broken if the fix didn't go in 100% smoothly.

Be honest with yourself, if you're so dependent on the 20 hit points from the enhancements that the helm currently offers, your build was gimped before and will remain so.

[feynman]

No one feat or feature can make or break a decent build. MT is a good example of a feat that isn't critical, most sorcs have more SP than they use in most situations. Given that the game is less of a nukefest than it used to be, you could also chose either max or emp. You could also live with 200 HP - which should really be enough anyway in most situations.

Maybe after I get 4 GS items and an inventory full of raid loot, but not all of us play 8 hours a day. And I only hit 200 HP with the helm and all the enhancements, but the difference in survivability is significant.

Yes, it is. You should be sitting at a minimum of 2400 without it. It might add one or two casts at best, it should rarely matter. Staying alive matters more.

85 SP = 3 PKs

This is often meaningful in the sense of "staying alive". In any case, if I had 2400 SP, it might be different, but I only top 2k w/ MT. Again, after I get the GS codpiece, things may be different.

With a con of 12, you pretty much did.

Started with:

STR 10
DEX 12
CON 12
INT 12
WIS 8
CHA 20

The only dump stat there is WIS, unless you are using "dump stat" in the sense of "You didn't buy a stack of +2 tomes for your character," in which case, we are talking at cross-purposes.

Something is wrong with your build... GS doesn't generate anything close to 400SP, although you seem to have a hate on for it as you blame GS for everything. Do you not have any SP items on you? Not even a magi item?

1. Triple positive GS item with all SP should give 600 SP, no? Wiz VI + 50 + 100 = 300 x 2 = 600
2. Currently using Wiz V ring; best I can reasonably afford until GS
3. Have 8 GS items on other toons, but also went broke making them, especially for my monk; ingredients aren't cheap and, again, some of us have lives.

Ever hear of scrolls?

Ever hear of people that don't spend all day loot farming? So far, all the recommendations amount to "You should be spending 60 hours a week grinding loot!"

The helm gives you 18HP AND greater fort, which is a must have in some slot anyway. Aside from rare items, this is your best fort item available.

Heavy fort robes and rings are all over the place. In the short run, I can use a 6 cha helm, switch out my cloak, etc, but it's still going to suck.

Basically, everyone here is saying that, because I do not live in game and built my sorc based on the rules in effect at the time, that I will have to reroll; but when does that end? Am I doomed to playing gimped "balance" builds just so I will be immune to the future whims of the devs? If so, there are other games coming out. That's all I'm saying.