Required feats???

[redoubt]

My sorc is my second oldest character. He is a drow with 36 CHA and a hodge podge of other stats.

For feats he has: Maximize, Heighten, Spell Pen, SF: Enchantment, GSF: Enchantment, SF: Illusion

For enhancements he has: spell pen 3, fire 4, fire crit 2, other fire crit 2 and other assorted stuff I can't remember off the top of my head.

He is at 2055sp and can last between most shrines okay. He is a little fragile and low on HP but I have a plan to get him up to 250.

There are two things that I have seen lately that make me wonder... one is the increased requests for greater heroism (which I only have on scrolls) and I've also been told that I MUST have extend to go with my haste spell.

It is usually only a complaint from people who won't wait for my slow butt to catch up and rehaste the group, which I am happy to do.

So what do you all think? (Both about my general enchanter build and the "extend requirement".)

Thanks.

[boldarblood]

Extend, Heighten, Empower, Maximize, Spell Pen 1, Spell Pen 2. Also be sure to max out your Spell Pen Enhancements.

[greystone306]

My sorc is my second oldest character. He is a drow with 36 CHA and a hodge podge of other stats.

For feats he has: Maximize, Heighten, Spell Pen, SF: Enchantment, GSF: Enchantment, SF: Illusion

For enhancements he has: spell pen 3, fire 4, fire crit 2, other fire crit 2 and other assorted stuff I can't remember off the top of my head.

He is at 2055sp and can last between most shrines okay. He is a little fragile and low on HP but I have a plan to get him up to 250.

There are two things that I have seen lately that make me wonder... one is the increased requests for greater heroism (which I only have on scrolls) and I've also been told that I MUST have extend to go with my haste spell.

It is usually only a complaint from people who won't wait for my slow butt to catch up and rehaste the group, which I am happy to do.

So what do you all think? (Both about my general enchanter build and the "extend requirement".)

Thanks.

There are no Must's for any class. If a player in a group tries to say you must have this feat or whatever, wish them well and say go find somebody who fits your mold to replace you in the group.. but that's just my opinion..Build what you like and if others have a problem with it tough luck to them.. Sorcerers are do not have to be haste bots and should not be considered such..

[Irongutz2000]

I would drop SF illusion an either take extend or empower. IMHO


P.S. I think that both of the feats in enchanment focus is a little over kill, i use charms alot, i mean alot an hardly ever have a problem landing them without any of the feats. Hope this helps.

[Noctus]

Extended haste is very nice, but it´s not a "better have it or leave". Just nice to have.

No Greater Heroism on the other hand is a big downer. Allmost all expect the group´s arcane caster to have this spell, because it is incredibly good.


Having GH or not reminds me of the discussions of old on "Why should my Sorc carry Haste if you can also just chug potions?"


For example i have seen a Hound-Raid fail because non of the 2 Sorcerers who were in the group had GH. Too many people got feared at the same time --> clerics + the bard got overstrained --> puppies died --> fail.

When asked why they didnt carry it one dropped group and the other just said: "Why should i carry it if you can just get yourself a Planar Gird. I have one."

[Aranticus]

Extended haste is very nice, but it´s not a "better have it or leave". Just nice to have.

No Greater Heroism on the other hand is a big downer. Allmost all expect the group´s arcane caster to have this spell, because it is incredibly good.


Having GH or not reminds me of the discussions of old on "Why should my Sorc carry Haste if you can also just chug potions?"


For example i have seen a Hound-Raid fail because non of the 2 Sorcerers who were in the group had GH. Too many people got feared at the same time --> clerics + the bard got overstrained --> puppies died --> fail.

When asked why they didnt carry it one dropped group and the other just said: "Why should i carry it if you can just get yourself a Planar Gird. I have one."

most bards have GH as a spell, this is not a failure on the sorc part alone

[Noctus]

most bards have GH as a spell, this is not a failure on the sorc part alone

Warchanter: Bard 12 , 2 Rogue , 2 Fighter --> no level 5 spells.

[Samadhi]

For extend, I pretty much live by it, and highly recommend it even if you only use it for haste ever.

GH is readily available in scrolls and - unless the mobs are casting fear in some fashion - not really necessary anyway. I definitely do not carry it as a spell.

I also don't think the spell focuses - any of them - are that good for a feat starved sorc; but that is more personal opinion the the above.

[Oreg]

Agreed with Samadhi. GH is not a spell I carry but I do carry scrolls for those who don't have girds and i'm more than happy to use them on folks. Extend I only use for haste, rage and fire/cold shield. IMO it is invaluable for those 3 things. I buff with extend off then turn it on for those 3.

[sephiroth1084]

What do you carry in place of GH?

[Samadhi]

What do you carry in place of GH?

Flesh to Stone, Mass Suggestion, Disintegrate.

Was considering flopping FTS for Acid Fog; but it's useful again

[redoubt]

What do you carry in place of GH?

Flesh to stone - seems a must in things like the TOR and Prey.

Acid Fog - No room for solid fog and it does some damage... most likely one to swap

Disintigrate

and... oh wait... we only get three...

P.S. all of my melees hit just fine without it (GH). I wonder, are people making builds that rely on GH to hit? Or is that fighter wanting it to umd a scroll? Seriously, I don't mind giving it to a rogue who is actually going to break out a scroll. Or if we are going to be somewhere that "fear" is being spammed, I'll spend the pp.

[Dktr]

For extend, I pretty much live by it, and highly recommend it even if you only use it for haste ever.

GH is readily available in scrolls and - unless the mobs are casting fear in some fashion - not really necessary anyway. I definitely do not carry it as a spell.

I also don't think the spell focuses - any of them - are that good for a feat starved sorc; but that is more personal opinion the the above.

I could not disagree more with not carrying Greater Hero for the simple fact that GH adds +4 to your use magic device skill. GH is the single spell that I cast the most often (more often than haste, and I'm casting it on myself). Being that umd is nearly a class skill for sorcerers, you can spec your sorcerer to be a back-up cleric.

I would also drop empower for skill focus use magic device. Things die very quickly in my firewalls using only maximize.. turning on both maximize and empower just makes me burn through my spell points faster.. hardly worth it to make a mob die one millisecond sooner...

Getting your umd skill to 39/40 would allow you to use a heal scroll on 1.. even if you're wf and do not need heal scrolls for yourself .. being able to heal your fellow party members can be highly useful in raids- especially when the clerics run out of mana or the clerics go down..... I have saved many groups from near partywipes.... UMD ftw!! 8)

[juniorpfactors]

Extended haste is very nice, but it´s not a "better have it or leave". Just nice to have.

No Greater Heroism on the other hand is a big downer. Allmost all expect the group´s arcane caster to have this spell, because it is incredibly good.


Having GH or not reminds me of the discussions of old on "Why should my Sorc carry Haste if you can also just chug potions?"


For example i have seen a Hound-Raid fail because non of the 2 Sorcerers who were in the group had GH. Too many people got feared at the same time --> clerics + the bard got overstrained --> puppies died --> fail.

When asked why they didnt carry it one dropped group and the other just said: "Why should i carry it if you can just get yourself a Planar Gird. I have one."

bad gimped toons , every toon at level 16 should have their own planar gird if not 2, and should have crafted gs fear immunity poison item, but yes I carry GH, if your really in a frenzy of GH go farm 3 or 4 planar girds and buff those beggars off those

SF: Enchantment, GSF: Enchantment, SF: Illusion DUMP these imho, Empower (must) extend, Necromancy if your human fit in UMD to hit 39-40 for Heal scrolls and Greater Restorations

jrp

[rimble]

My sorc is my second oldest character. He is a drow with 36 CHA and a hodge podge of other stats.

For feats he has: Maximize, Heighten, Spell Pen, SF: Enchantment, GSF: Enchantment, SF: Illusion

For enhancements he has: spell pen 3, fire 4, fire crit 2, other fire crit 2 and other assorted stuff I can't remember off the top of my head.

He is at 2055sp and can last between most shrines okay. He is a little fragile and low on HP but I have a plan to get him up to 250.

He sounds alot like my Drow Sorc, though a little better (1700ish sp, 205ish hp, his gear stinks). Levelling mine up I really enjoyed the Enchantment school. However, there just aren't enough Feats, and I migrated away from the Spell Focuses for other things.

First, I've found I need both Maximize and Empower. Sometimes you just need to blast your way through high Fire Resistance with a Max + Emp Wall of Fire...and on the big red nameds, most of them you can get a Max + Emp crit Acid Fog to tick away for over 100hp a pop. Makes me feel like I'm contributing a little more on the new big red nameds that aren't very arcane friendly.

I've ended up with Maximize, Empower, Heighten, Extend, Spell Pen 1, and Spell Pen 2. I wouldn't change a thing there.

I do carry, use, and love Greater Heroism. As someone else mentioned, I primarily want that +4 UMD, but the other benefits are of course awesome as well. I do miss Disintegrate sometimes (I carry Acid Fog, FtS, and GH) but such is the life of a Sorcerer.

I ended up going down both the Fire/Ice Enhancement lines and the Electricity/Acid Enhancement lines. I'm constantly considering backing down on the Electricity/Acid side, but for now my Enhancements are:

Enhancement: Sorcerer Improved Empowering I
Enhancement: Sorcerer Improved Maximizing I
Enhancement: Sorcerer Lineage of Energy I
Enhancement: Sorcerer Lineage of Energy II
Enhancement: Sorcerer Lineage of Energy III
Enhancement: Sorcerer Lineage of Elements I
Enhancement: Sorcerer Lineage of Elements II
Enhancement: Sorcerer Lineage of Elements III
Enhancement: Sorcerer Lineage of Deadly Energy I
Enhancement: Sorcerer Lineage of Deadly Energy II
Enhancement: Sorcerer Lineage of Deadly Energy III
Enhancement: Sorcerer Lineage of Deadly Elements I
Enhancement: Sorcerer Lineage of Deadly Elements II
Enhancement: Sorcerer Energy Manipulation I
Enhancement: Sorcerer Energy Manipulation II
Enhancement: Sorcerer Energy Manipulation III
Enhancement: Sorcerer Enerrgy Manipulation IV
Enhancement: Sorcerer Elemental Manipulation I
Enhancement: Sorcerer Elemental Manipulation II
Enhancement: Sorcerer Elemental Manipulation III
Enhancement: Sorcerer Elemental Manipulation IV
Enhancement: Sorcerer Spell Penetration I
Enhancement: Sorcerer Spell Penetration II
Enhancement: Sorcerer Energy of the Dragonblooded I
Enhancement: Sorcerer Charisma I
Enhancement: Sorcerer Charisma II
Enhancement: Sorcerer Charisma III

It's a weird Enhancement layout, I doubt most people would recommend it, but it works for me.

[miceelf88]

GH is very useful if you pug a lot or (say) have a group that doesn't twink or farm (one of my characters is in such a group) much. Honestly, the most frequent reguest I get for GH isn't from melees but from rogues who need a little boost to search or disable.

[Winded]

Ive always bleieved having Sell pent/Gtr Spell Pen was a great benefit, but after some testing in the vale , I really cant support needing it. The highest Spell pen mob in the vale(explorer area) is the Devil over by the Coal Chamber , 26. and yes Ive been out there that much to know. Most are in the 22-24 range. With Spell Pen feat and 2 enhancement with pen item, Im rolling 23.

Anyone convince me that Gtr Spell Pen is actual worth it?

[rimble]

Anyone convince me that Gtr Spell Pen is actual worth it?

Instead of...?

Run actual quests, Spell Resistances get higher than 26. If you don't run the end-game stuff, then yeah, don't bother with it. I haven't analyzed my logs in quests to figure out SR, but I still see that blue shield more than I'd like.

[~Bandage]

IMO, any buffs from a sorcerer are bonus, not required. Sorcerers have too few spell slots, and since it's a pain to swap, you want to cover all of your offenseive options first, then worry about buffs.

*Note: assuming your sorcerer, like most, is an offensive caster

Extend is a pure convenience feat. All it does is double the time before you need to cast the same spell again. Very nice, but I wouldn't call it a requirement.

If I had to recommend a spell of yours to drop for GH, though, it'd be disintegrate.

[Samadhi]

Instead of...?

Run actual quests, Spell Resistances get higher than 26. If you don't run the end-game stuff, then yeah, don't bother with it. I haven't analyzed my logs in quests to figure out SR, but I still see that blue shield more than I'd like.

Exactly, of course if you are running around an encounter area the mobs are chumps, but the SR goes up quickly inside end game.