Big Can of Worms!

[Impaqt]

Willphase... You Forgot the Change in HV from Static to Clicky.


Fortification is working as Per PnP... Puncturing is not.... Which one needs to be fixed again?

[Turial]

It would be interesting to know what % of a mob's hitpoints are made up of the CON score, and what % are made up of the magic DDO extra HP? I imagine for Harry - the number is close to 1% CON and 99% extra, but what about for trash mobs?

Garth

Taken from Mrcow's database on monsters.

CR 19 Beholders have 594 hp, a con score of 26, and 16 HD. Abberations use 1d8 as HD so 16x8 = 128 starting HP. 26 con = +8 *16 = 128 hp from con. 594 -128 -128 = 338 bonus HP.

128/594 = 21%

It has been shown that mobs in ddo have similar stats to their pnp counterparts of similar CR value. The % of hp from con is less important then the % derived from the bonus hp.

For raid bosses I would imagine the con % is very low. Not that it really matters because we can't figure it out.

[Healemup]

...Turbine could add 30 or 40 to the con of a few key mobs...

This is the solution I would most like to get behind. To bring WoP back in to line, calculate how many swings it would take a non-uber, reasonably equiped melee type to take down a mob using DPS, then add in that much con (or some less to make them still attractive). I think keeping them as a nice weapon to have is a good idea, but I think that some of the higher-end DPS weapons should have their day in the sun as well.

[Laith]

while possibly not a complete solution, teaching mobs to notice & remove ability damage might have a large impact on how useful ability damage is.

i'm still surprised that mobs don't have any form of Restoration and only throw Heal due to HP damage: not for the laundry list of conditions it can cure.

[Garth_of_Sarlona]

while possibly not a complete solution, teaching mobs to notice & remove ability damage might have a large impact on how useful ability damage is.

i'm still surprised that mobs don't have any form of Restoration and only throw Heal due to HP damage: not for the laundry list of conditions it can cure.

well they only recently learnt to cast mass deathward on each other in mod 8 - so maybe mod 9 they learn to cast mass restoration too.

Garth

[Laith]

well they only recently learnt to cast mass deathward on each other in mod 8 - so maybe mod 9 they learn to cast mass restoration too.

more likely they'll start throwing around Mass Heal... to similar effect. They really need to start triggering the spells on low abilities though, in addition to low health.

[Maegin]

Ya. What if mob clerics acted like clerics for once? Instead of a lame flame strike, how about a recitation? or Mass resistance? or a mass resoration?

The dependency on WoP's is nothing more than the need for efficiency. Im pretty sure you can survive most, if not all, quests on normal and there is still a bit of challange, too.

But on the other hand, casters can 1 shot mobs and mass dps, so I think melees should have just as an efficient edge as well; wops and gs. Seeing how its much easier to utilize the caster instakill, but its limited by sp. Now melees can keep up to the caster potential, but they have to earn the weapon/grind shroud. Its all a fair trade, its just everyone expects everyone to have teh 1337 gear, but not everyone has it, I'd say 2 out of 5(6) players on average in the party.

I know plenty of fun players who don't have all the awesome stuff, and gaming with them is just as fun

[Maegin]

And as for inflated mob hp? Well, it would be lame if everything was a pushover. Since everyone has access to gs stuff, don't you think if the devs put powerful stuff in the game for us to use, don't you think they would also put powerful mobs in the game to use them on? Stuff like WoP? or Min2 or LS? It may not be easy to come by, but anything good having is worth working hard for.

And now since they heightened the +hit for mobs, or atleast gave them a few lvls, don't you think a cr 17-20 mob is going to be tough? I mean look at us with our 40+ STR barbs and (soon) 42 INT Wizzys? Thats really close to demi god stuff, you'd think you'd want a challenge with your 70+ ac, too.

And even more to compensate for the fact that not everyone has above average ac, they added DT armors that have things like Disinigration guard, so if you know your going to get hit, you might aswell make them pay for it, effectivly adding to your dps.

You guys gotta remember. In most cases, its 6 vs 1 mob at a time, (unless you zerg) not to mention 12 vs 1 in raids. Imagin if you had 3-4 gtwf greensteel, lit strike, with min 2's, khopesh wielding tempest rangers as YOU as their favorite enemy gang up on you in a split second, outta nowhere, all buffed and hasted? Scary sh*t. You'd want some HP too.

Like, what if Sorjek, Harry, The Abbot, Sullo, Titian, and Xxyzzx decided to raid us as once, all buffed and ready to rock? Id think you as a mob would want all the HP you can get, god forbid if the DQ queen hit you with 4 WoP's at once!!! :O

And on that, mobs are just ment to slow us down, and drain us to make the end fight more exciting ^_^

I think they made the game fun and challanging, but still in the advantage to the player (ie wops, gs, now dt) so everyone always feels empowered, but there is always a reason to keep going to see if you can push just a little bit more. Overall, a pretty fun game, just stop the nit picking. No game is ever perfect.

[baddax]

Personally, I feel it would be worth it. You can't build an house on rotten foundations.

But that is my opinion.

/sarcasm on
Ok, so dont hold back tell us how you Really Feal!!

[baddax]

This is the solution I would most like to get behind. To bring WoP back in to line, calculate how many swings it would take a non-uber, reasonably equiped melee type to take down a mob using DPS, then add in that much con (or some less to make them still attractive). I think keeping them as a nice weapon to have is a good idea, but I think that some of the higher-end DPS weapons should have their day in the sun as well.

What would said mob have for a Fort Save if they added that much con???

[baddax]

while possibly not a complete solution, teaching mobs to notice & remove ability damage might have a large impact on how useful ability damage is.

i'm still surprised that mobs don't have any form of Restoration and only throw Heal due to HP damage: not for the laundry list of conditions it can cure.

im sorry, please dont post here anymore! lol

[baddax]

And as for inflated mob hp? Well, it would be lame if everything was a pushover. Since everyone has access to gs stuff, don't you think if the devs put powerful stuff in the game for us to use, don't you think they would also put powerful mobs in the game to use them on? Stuff like WoP? or Min2 or LS? It may not be easy to come by, but anything good having is worth working hard for.

And now since they heightened the +hit for mobs, or atleast gave them a few lvls, don't you think a cr 17-20 mob is going to be tough? I mean look at us with our 40+ STR barbs and (soon) 42 INT Wizzys? Thats really close to demi god stuff, you'd think you'd want a challenge with your 70+ ac, too.

And even more to compensate for the fact that not everyone has above average ac, they added DT armors that have things like Disinigration guard, so if you know your going to get hit, you might aswell make them pay for it, effectivly adding to your dps.

You guys gotta remember. In most cases, its 6 vs 1 mob at a time, (unless you zerg) not to mention 12 vs 1 in raids. Imagin if you had 3-4 gtwf greensteel, lit strike, with min 2's, khopesh wielding tempest rangers as YOU as their favorite enemy gang up on you in a split second, outta nowhere, all buffed and hasted? Scary sh*t. You'd want some HP too.

Like, what if Sorjek, Harry, The Abbot, Sullo, Titian, and Xxyzzx decided to raid us as once, all buffed and ready to rock? Id think you as a mob would want all the HP you can get, god forbid if the DQ queen hit you with 4 WoP's at once!!! :O

And on that, mobs are just ment to slow us down, and drain us to make the end fight more exciting ^_^

I think they made the game fun and challanging, but still in the advantage to the player (ie wops, gs, now dt) so everyone always feels empowered, but there is always a reason to keep going to see if you can push just a little bit more. Overall, a pretty fun game, just stop the nit picking. No game is ever perfect.

QFT!! best post ive seen in a long time.
Reminds me of last year with the Devil Invasion I was sitting there respecing my action points on my fighter when 2-3 cr 18 Orthons decided to say Hi!! Talk about being caught with your pants down! I even spilled coke all over my chair trying to get my weapons out and pull down my Enhancemnt screen, and the Dumb A__ fighter trainer just stood there and watched my get my head handed to me with No Enhancements and no vorpal out! What a jerkoff he was, which reminds me to got house D for any enhancemnt respec's on all my fighters. Thx for reminding me maegin.

[Borror0]

Overall, a pretty fun game, just stop the nit picking. No game is ever perfect.

http://forums.ddo.com/showthread.php...39#post1978839

[krud]

Like i said my Fighter/Rogue splash hits for 60 a pop dual wielding, i do dont see how that will be effective.

which usually kills the mob faster for you, the con damage or the DPS? I bet many of the mobs die with quite a bit of HP remaining. If the HP were lowered you would end up killing the mob with con damage in about the same time it takes to kill it with DPS. It would end up being a wash as far as what type of damage to choose.

[Tharris]

playing Pnp isn't the Wounding effect on a Weapon only able to be used 3 times a day????

If this is correct, and if people think WoP is too powerful, why not limit its use per rest. Maybe a stance for that weapon so it can only be used for 50 hits, there after your only hitting your Mob with a +1 weapon, with no additional effects.

No idea on how hard it would be to code etc, and if people have enough of these types of weapons to just swap to the next one, but IMHO is how it "could" be fixed, if people see it as that much of a problem.

[Maegin]

Imagin if in DnD, you proc puncturing to crit range instead of times per day ^_^ ddo all over again. I like the idea of a clicky, 3x per day that adds -d6 CON to your next (touch) attack, like it should if off PnP err something like that, dun quote that... But then again, this isn't PnP, its a game based of PnP, so they have all the rights to deviate all they want.

Its like ramen noodles, but Turbine just took out the noodles, added their own flavor packet, re-packaged it, and sold it to us in the form of 15$ a month, just like everyone else does with everything else.

But, I guess to make it more appealing to those that arn't into roleplaying and simple fantasy adventuring, and having competition on WoW where you can crit with something for 3000+ damage, they have to scale everything, including mobs, our powers, their hp, our weapon damage, their CR, our cunning, their blanket immunities, they have to scale with everyone else. :/

Like, imagin if mobs used WoP's verse us? or had a blanket of immunities like we do? God forbbid they even the playing field, like how WoW did it by saying,

Blizzard - "Ok, we obviously can't create AI that is able to outsmart or out do a player, so why not make mobs into players and call it Alliance vs Horde? That way, its not our fault that if we create something that nobody can kill, its another player instead, thus fueling competition, and keeping the game going forever, while we just rake in the money?"

Turbine - "Well, I think that's retar...Uh... hm...omg wait... I know! DT Armor!"

Blizzard - "But...you didn't get my point? It's our unique pvp system that is an endless cycle of refenu-"

Turbine - "Who wants food!? Lunch Break!"

Blizzard - "-_-' ....But you guys have such an awesome combat system, but with a turn based system applied to spell casting, ya think you would capitalize on that? Not to menti--"

Turbine - *Kate pulls Blizzard over to the side* "Listen up! first off, shhhhhhh! Our game runs off of pure nostolgic players who THINK this is actual d&d, ok, so don't fu*k that up or I swear I will cut you >=( Secondly, I don't think we have the revenue to hire 'tards like Mr. T or William Shatner to make commercials for our game to attract a bigger fan base ok?! We are working with what we got, and thank god our subscribers have heart and are patient, otherwise we'd be up sh*t creek without a pad--"

Turbine Worker - "Who wants cheese fries?!?!?!one!1!"

Turbine - "--ah, I'll take an order!!... What? No, I said an order!... What?! Boarders? No, one order!! ugh-- dang it, I swear some times... Anywho, did I ever tell you how much I like Ramen...? Let me explain..."

You can't replace the original. 3.5 RIP.

[Maegin]

Thats me nit picking, borr.