The Jumping Puzzles

[Junts]

I for one hate what has been done this year. It is a pain in the a$$ and based on previous year's loot not worth the effort. I'm collecting coins but I don't know if I'll even bother turning them in. If I do I'll likely ship all the gold ones to a single character and deposit all at once.

A colossal waste of time IMO and so negative an impression that I'm scarcely interested in finding out if I am wrong by going thru the effort.

marketplace?


or uh, go to the dinghy, up the ladder and talk to him:P

[Lorien_the_First_One]

Actually, that was DDO Japan, which I believe is still open. That was the second time they did something like that. The first was called Rangers' Assault and this was Rangers' Assault Returns.

My bad...

[Leyoni]

marketplace?


or uh, go to the dinghy, up the ladder and talk to him:P

That's not my point. My point is why do the coding and put it in the game at all unless there is some benefit to doing the work.

Contrary to other's views, I don't see jumping around just to do it as a lot of fun.

Probably a generational thing.

In fact, I was thinking about that generation gap earlier today while thinking about this thread. I realized that there must be a whole population of players that find doing the jumping puzzles fun -- exactly the opposite of my reaction.

So, I was thinking that there needed to be a server that was for us geriatrics -- an old school D&D player's server where you weren't allowed unless you were at least 45 years old and could prove it.

I've been thinking that some of the differences in what people think is fun, or right, or good is colored by their age. The younger the player, I'm thinking, the more they tend to the ultimate build, twitch skill, fun is hanging out with the guildies doing nothing type of player. The older the player, my thinking goes, the more they tend to the play whatever makes you happy, pillage and plunder, fun is hanging out with guildies while we kill orcs type of player.

Speaking of orcs, why so few of them? If we don't get a population explosion we'll never see half-orcs.

[Arianrhod]

That's not my point. My point is why do the coding and put it in the game at all unless there is some benefit to doing the work.

Contrary to other's views, I don't see jumping around just to do it as a lot of fun.

Probably a generational thing.

In fact, I was thinking about that generation gap earlier today while thinking about this thread. I realized that there must be a whole population of players that find doing the jumping puzzles fun -- exactly the opposite of my reaction.

So, I was thinking that there needed to be a server that was for us geriatrics -- an old school D&D player's server where you weren't allowed unless you were at least 45 years old and could prove it.

I've been thinking that some of the differences in what people think is fun, or right, or good is colored by their age. The younger the player, I'm thinking, the more they tend to the ultimate build, twitch skill, fun is hanging out with the guildies doing nothing type of player. The older the player, my thinking goes, the more they tend to the play whatever makes you happy, pillage and plunder, fun is hanging out with guildies while we kill orcs type of player.

Speaking of orcs, why so few of them? If we don't get a population explosion we'll never see half-orcs.

But some people do find all that jumping around to be a lot of fun. If nothing were ever added to the game unless EVERYONE loved it, well....nothing would ever get added. I like playing with my friends in a static group, and may never do any raids. I think there may be a lot of people who prefer playing this way. But I don't think no raids should ever be in the game; even if it's unlikely I'll ever run them, there are obviously people who do like them, and fun is good, even if it's someone else's fun.

[EightyFour]

That's not my point. My point is why do the coding and put it in the game at all unless there is some benefit to doing the work.

Contrary to other's views, I don't see jumping around just to do it as a lot of fun.

Probably a generational thing.

In fact, I was thinking about that generation gap earlier today while thinking about this thread. I realized that there must be a whole population of players that find doing the jumping puzzles fun -- exactly the opposite of my reaction.

So, I was thinking that there needed to be a server that was for us geriatrics -- an old school D&D player's server where you weren't allowed unless you were at least 45 years old and could prove it.

I've been thinking that some of the differences in what people think is fun, or right, or good is colored by their age. The younger the player, I'm thinking, the more they tend to the ultimate build, twitch skill, fun is hanging out with the guildies doing nothing type of player. The older the player, my thinking goes, the more they tend to the play whatever makes you happy, pillage and plunder, fun is hanging out with guildies while we kill orcs type of player.

Speaking of orcs, why so few of them? If we don't get a population explosion we'll never see half-orcs.

I don't agree that it has anything to do with age. I just think different people have fun in different ways. Maybe I have fun this way because my hand eye coordination is better? Maybe because during those times that nothing is going on I have fun jumping from table to table, and maybe this has developed into a skill where I can climb the pit furnaces in less than 10 seconds and now that there are no more challenges I wish for a new one.

[Anthios888]

Awesome idea, eightysix. That video is inspiring :P

[Leyoni]

I don't agree that it has anything to do with age. I just think different people have fun in different ways. Maybe I have fun this way because my hand eye coordination is better? Maybe because during those times that nothing is going on I have fun jumping from table to table, and maybe this has developed into a skill where I can climb the pit furnaces in less than 10 seconds and now that there are no more challenges I wish for a new one.

But some people do find all that jumping around to be a lot of fun. If nothing were ever added to the game unless EVERYONE loved it, well....nothing would ever get added. I like playing with my friends in a static group, and may never do any raids. I think there may be a lot of people who prefer playing this way. But I don't think no raids should ever be in the game; even if it's unlikely I'll ever run them, there are obviously people who do like them, and fun is good, even if it's someone else's fun.

Grudgingly I have to admit that you each make good points. And, that is the joy of D&D -- always has been -- that the same game can fit so many different types of people and personalities.

I withdraw my "I hate it" and just will leave it at "it's not my thing." Enjoy and happy holidays.

[Kraki]

Its fun for those who have the build that can jump, not for those who can't. Although I don't dislike it. So I would have to agree with the above that it would have to be optional. Either optional boss, chest, collectable or even experience. Another option is that i could be for one charcter to go up to pull a lever. Forcing parties to have at least one person with acrobatic abilities, monk or rogue usually can do so.

That's my feedback.

Just a comment. I was interested in seeing if a non jump character could do it, I took a lvl 2 wf sorc with 8 str onto the harbor jumpy puzzle. Did it with no problem.

It looks like that they took fairly sucky jump skill into account while building the bridges.

Kraki

[Zyklon]

Fun is the point. That's why I think most people would think it's a waste is because there is no chest, coins, or loot in general for that matter.

At the end of the video there looked like a chest. ???

-

[asdfss]

Why are there so many people who want to be a grouchy stick in the mud?

That obstacle course is cool and fairly easy to place into a story. Use a magic jester or a portal to a demi-plane of insanity or something.

This sort of stuff is unique to DDO. Most other MMOs refuse to even consider allowing ladder climbing or any 3D type stuff. Its also a common and well like game theme, jumping puzzles/skill tests.

I posted that on another forum before and some RP guy with no sense of humor got his panties in a wad. Made me sad.

How can you be against fun? Why do you hate the children *facetious*?

But seriously just because this is an MMO does not mean everything is about work. This is still a game, fun things are important. In fact they necessary.

Also people should consider that things like jumping etc that exist in some dungeons like The Pit need practice. So an obstacle course that lets everyone practice is actually a very good idea.

Play behavior is about learning and training, even if most people forget that. Why do you think the OP jumps around tables all the time? Because he is following is natural tendancy to learn the new stuff by creating a game. And for those of who think he is dumb or wasting his time well he is probably far far better at certain aspects of the game than you are. This sort of play behavior creates a game out something that takes repeition as most physical skill does.

So why does the OP want a cool obstacles course? Because he is actually smart. He needs to train. He thinks of it as a game, but in fact he is naturally doing everything he needs to excel at something that has been part of the game since its beginning and what he is asking for is some thing human have known is necessary for learning since time immemorial. Repetition and progressive challenge.


One of the reason's so many people suck at the jumping challenges is because there is nothing to practice on. Anyone who thinks anywhere even remotely close to enough people can get decent at such things without practice is just being silly and forgetting that every physical skill take repetition. And anyone who thinks these sorts of things do not draw people in to have fun is being silly. People do stuff like this all the time. I am quite sure people who are quite bad would go there in a group just to laugh at each other falling. And guess what? Even those bad people would slowly get better at some of the content in the game.

Progression more than just gear or RPG stats. It is getting better at whatever the game challenges you with. That is the entire point of Play behavior. The more playful a person the more the explore all aspects that the game challenges them with. Is it any wonder that the people with very little sense of humor are also the most narrow minded? Whenever you are able to reliably repeat something that used to be hard whether through gear or from physical practice you get a feeling of progress. Some people have completely abstracted out the idea of progress into stats and then tied their brain into knots and try to say that is the only kind of progress. Well they are clearly wrong. All gaming is about progression and progress because play behavior is about getting better at things. That is its entire purpose. People who are being a stick in the mud are just cutting off their nose to spite their face.

In fact Turbine could even pull a page from LOTRO and have session play so that you can get around the build problems (and simultaneously allow people to experiment with jump/FF to see what they want).

[query]

Now THAT is a worthy jumping puzzle because of its own existance!!!!

And yes, I think a bonus scenic view (think like "THANK YOU TURBINE" from the House D spire on the Y 2 anniversary with the Genies) would also be either a fair reward or part of the point/storyline.

Currently I don't understand how we see the floating things, do all those jumps THEN eat the mushrooms

Actually, that was DDO Japan, which I believe is still open. That was the second time they did something like that. The first was called Rangers' Assault and this was Rangers' Assault Returns.

[al73r]

That is an awesome video!

I have a guild member that says "I don't want to play any mario bros jumping puzzles and that is why I won't do the abbot. "

I think a statement like that takes out most of the game. I think jumping puzzles are a requirement for an MMO.

Alter

[EightyFour]

At the end of the video there looked like a chest. ???

-

Yeah there was a chest at the end of the video, I'm just saying that I would not ask for one, my reward is the obstacles course, which is much bigger than a chest of any kind.

[Keeper]

Thanks for the feedback, everyone!

[Gratch]

So how did DDO Japan change their marketplace to add such a jump-test? They know how to manipulate their content for events?

Hmmm... I'm now hoping that Vast and Mysterious has nothing to do with consoles, engines, crufting, or any of that other BS... and is instead either Player Created Content/Quest tools that everyone can play or adds a Randomly Created Quest setup. They did random dungeons back in the Diablos. NWN added a random quest/dungeon creator. Why can't DDO? That would really help us out with VAST... in terms of runnable content. Obviously either random or player created content would have to have a ton of oversite to stop from even further monty hauling the game.

[Kadagan]

So how did DDO Japan change their marketplace to add such a jump-test? They know how to manipulate their content for events?

Hmmm... I'm now hoping that Vast and Mysterious has nothing to do with consoles, engines, crufting, or any of that other BS... and is instead either Player Created Content/Quest tools that everyone can play or adds a Randomly Created Quest setup. They did random dungeons back in the Diablos. NWN added a random quest/dungeon creator. Why can't DDO? That would really help us out with VAST... in terms of runnable content. Obviously either random or player created content would have to have a ton of oversite to stop from even further monty hauling the game.

Quite some time ago the owners of Ultima Online were sued because they accepted and used player support... According to US courts this was decidedly anti-competative as it posed a barrier to market entry for other MMO's...

As a result the north american servers can not accept player assistance for any game... Least WoW or some other corp sues Turbine.. This is just one of the failings of the U.S. legal system..

my two CP

[Lorien_the_First_One]

Quite some time ago the owners of Ultima Online were sued because they accepted and used player support... According to US courts this was decidedly anti-competative as it posed a barrier to market entry for other MMO's...

As a result the north american servers can not accept player assistance for any game... Least WoW or some other corp sues Turbine.. This is just one of the failings of the U.S. legal system..

my two CP

No problem, move the servers to Canada

[Bindox]

No problem, move the servers to Canada

With Canada's communications infrastructure, the lag monster would take over and rule with an iron (lag)spike.

I have had way too much experience with broadband internet connectivity from Canada. Or internet disconnectivity, as it were.

Im sure you were joking when you said it, but it sent chills up my spine. The kind you get when someone with a big
knife is walking up behind you in a dark alley. (Please don't fail my save, please don't fail my save!!)

[Beherit_Baphomar]

Yeah, that video is DDO Japan and judging by the date on that (March 2008) it's the second time they've had that type of thing.

The last time they brought it out and someone posted the video here there were cries of 'we want now' and 'yes please!'.

We were told, quite bluntly if I remember correctly, we would never see something like that.

Why would we 'never' see something like that? Dunno.