Quote Originally Posted by Borror0 View Post
Your complaint would be somewhat valid if it would be phrased differently.

Something like "Two-handed and two-weapon fighting characters are getting more out of these enhancements than characters than characters fighting with a weapon in their main hand and a shield in their offhand. That shouldn't be allowed." would be more valid than your current complaint. Thank you Borror0, thats exactly my complaint rephrased. (It's good to know somebody is at least 'getting where you're coming from'.

However, then, a case could be made about two-handed and two-weapon fighting being more DPS-centric than S&B. Here I have to disagree. This goes back to the idea of benefits and sacrifices. Both TWF and THF are 'advanced' styles and supposed to be more DPS centric than S&B (which should be considred 'basic' style)

And if nothing would have been done, it would hurt both the THF and the S&B characters at the gain (once more) of TWF. I agree. I, however, do not see the need to widen the disadvantage of the S&B crew yet more.

What do you mean? I orginally meant that I didn't care as to how the PrE affected the TWFs. I've since 'seen the light' to realize that the 2HF and the 'One Hand weapon' issue was split to keep the TWF in check.. But believe they failed to consider the S&B Crew. Especially when one more Sub-Enchancement line would have resolved the issue.

If I got what you suggest right, you suggest making the enhancements cheaper to the weaker styles and than adding other enhancements, that would be stronger and specialized for them, in order to make up the difference. How is that any different than what you are complaining about?! It is different in that it would not be further hurting any one Style. All styles would be addressed and slight bumps given to those who needed it. Balance.

You are simply moving how it is done. Yes and No. My ideas would keep from hurting any one style, while helping those that need it. Current design advance both TWF and THF styles more so than Ranged or S&B. Breaking them apart further would help 3 styles instead of mostly helping 2.
Results are the same, except it requires more work from Turbine. Um.. Results not the same, check the above Red for clarification. More work for Turbine. Yes. Yes it would. More work for Eladrin and his cohorts of Coding. But I think the changes would make for a better game in the long run, by not advancing any single style more so than any other.

That is just silly. What ever. Thanks for belittling valid ideas, concerns and suggestions.

Like all the doctors that I have seen in the last year, you are trying to ignore the real problem and simply work around it instead of fixing it. The same way they try to prescribe me sleeping pills when I talk to them about my sleeping disorders problem (and by sleeping disorders I mean that when I wake up every morning with the feeling someone had a lot of fun involving a shovel and my head while I slept),
A really.. uh.. 'heart warming' analogy or something. Sorry for your sleeping problems. I would suggest not ****ing off the person your sleeping with as they seem to be hitting you on the head with a shovel while you sleep soundly and deeply under the heavy medication prescribed by your doctors. (A joke folks. If you can't make fun somebody's medical issues sleeping.. then what can you poke fun at?)

you are trying to modify the enhancement so that S&B aren't so left behind rather than attacking what you would see as the real problem. Yes and No. I'm trying to stop the placement of a PrE that would advance the current trend of their only being 2FWers and 2HFers because S&D crew are so vastly 'inferior' in most ways. (Can't get the High AC, Can't get the high DPS.) Or one that would pigeon hole all S&B Crew to resort to having to go the 'Defender' route because it's the only benefit they can get.

A more personal comment that has little to do with the current conversation: But since you obviously know what I see as the 'real problem'.. Then you know the 'real problem' I see is the Enhancement system as a whole. But it's not like they're going to just rip it out... So I'm focusing on the proposed PrE and trying to get some 'balance' installed so that it doesn't cause further problems in the whole 'balance' concept.

(Oh and puh-lease.. Nobody say something stupid like 'You don't -have-' to take Enhancements. The game has been designed around them, making them required. Eample: A rogue w/o enhancement lines is near useless on higher level traps.)

Oh. And another problem is the liberal usage of 'Dodge' bonuses on certain items in the game which allow for extreme AC bonuses. Dodge should be rare as it's the only stacking bonus type... But again.. It's highly unlikely to get something removed/altered thats been in the game for ages.



The modifications that have been with THF in mind were to make sure THF would gain as much as TWF while keeping the spirit of the enhancement. Eladrin could have done it differently, but it would have the feeling he desired.Yes. And I'm trying to get him to double think and perhaps come to the realization that while it's good to help 2HF, it shouldn't be done in the same enhancement line as S&B who get nothing 'extra'. I am calling for a slight redesign of the PrE line, so that individual styles can be addressed if any single style is going to receive freebies... I see nothing wrong with this request.

But then, we get to the point where you are simply trying to make S&B be good in a way that can't happen. No. I don't believe I am. I see myself as only trying to stop a PrE that as is favors some fighting styles over others. (As well as give freebies to an individual style.) I'm trying to bring light to the view that perhaps this PrE could be redesigned in a different way and have better results for the game as w whole.

That would be extremely silly because two-weapon is getting as much out of it as THF...Yes. As I said above THF and TWF are getting nearly the same benefits when all considered. However as you aptly put it: My issue it the PrE favors 2WF and 2HF too much, while giving too little to S&B. (And possibly Range. I keep forgetting the other 'red headed step child of the Kensia possibilities.)
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