disappointment

[Sirea]

Sorry to single you out, but this type of comment infuriates me. WHY? Because nobody needs to be taught to run the new quest, go in knowing nothing and learn it yourself. I did not run on Risia either. I went into the new quests knowing nothing. The first time we ran kobold, it was quit dificult, but we kept at it, adjust our method and came up with a way to make it easy on elite. If you always have someone teach you, you are never really learning how to think for yourself.

And some of us have that soloing capability. Some don't. What i don't appreciate is the attitude that you need to know the quest to join, you need to have grinded it on Risia if you want to group with people, and if you ask questions or can't find your way to the group in a quest you don't know, you feel like you're "inconveniencing" them or slowing them down. Maybe I've just had a string of bad groups.

I don't know how to build uber toons that I can solo everything with. And I *enjoy* partying with other people and learning together, not feeling like a burden. I don't expect someone to hold my hand through everything, I just don't appreciate being make to feel like a fool.

I don't want to pick a fight with you, because I know Cerialkiller thinks highly of you.

[Samadhi]

"bring the right equipment" usually means WoPs. I sent a polite tell to such a group once and they wouldn't let me join because I didn't have a WoP. So yeah...

Sorry to single out this one comment - but I am frequently annoyed by players on this issue.

1) I have never "required" WoP's. WoP is a rare weapon, and GOOD WoP's with a decent crit ranger are even rarer yet.

2) Conversely, I get extremely infuriated when a melee has NO CON DAMAGE WEAPON AT ALL. I have been using wounders on my melees since the level cap was 10. They have always been effective, and are even more effective when used in groups (i.e. everyone in group is using con damage). Wounders are not rare and they are effective. If you are trying to vorpal while everyone else is doing con damage - you are a waste of the healer's mana.

Sirea, as stated, this comment is not meant to inflame you in anyway, but hopefully can be a wake up call for the melees out there that think just because they aren't "uber enough" (often said in a snide/mocking way) to dual-wield WoP rapiers - that they have an excuse to run around complaining about how overpowered and unbalanced the game is when they don't even have a wounding weapon easily available at level 8.

Teamwork = working together. For melees, this usually means using similar types of weapons. Con damage has rocked in this game for a long time - you don't need a WoP rapier for it to continue to do so.

/rant off and back to the bard forums

[oogly54]

And some of us have that soloing capability. Some don't. What i don't appreciate is the attitude that you need to know the quest to join, you need to have grinded it on Risia if you want to group with people, and if you ask questions or can't find your way to the group in a quest you don't know, you feel like you're "inconveniencing" them or slowing them down. Maybe I've just had a string of bad groups.

I don't know how to build uber toons that I can solo everything with. And I *enjoy* partying with other people and learning together, not feeling like a burden. I don't expect someone to hold my hand through everything, I just don't appreciate being make to feel like a fool.

I don't want to pick a fight with you, because I know Cerialkiller thinks highly of you.

Like I said in my last post, I did not put any criteria in any LFM I made. If I made someone feel unwelcome by making them feel like they were inconveinencing me, I apologize, I did not mean to.

I would rather learn new quests with others that knew nothing than run in there with 5 others that have beaten it 6 times already. Cerialkiller was in my group when we ran the white dragon on hard. And we failed numerous times, but each time we got better and better and came up with a method that I think any casual player could use to defeat it. I admit, I have all the gear in the world, but I would not say tha about the rest of the party.

I think you and I are on the same page, unless you have other information about me I am unaware of.

[Sirea]

Sirea, as stated, this comment is not meant to inflame you in anyway, but hopefully can be a wake up call for the melees out there that think just because they aren't "uber enough" (often said in a snide/mocking way) to dual-wield WoP rapiers - that they have an excuse to run around complaining about how overpowered and unbalanced the game is when they don't even have a wounding weapon easily available at level 8.

Believe me, I'm far from complaining about the game being unbalanced, for the most part I'm happy with the game and while I might not be happy with some of the raid changes I'm willing to learn new strategies and get input rather than sit here and flame Turbine. I understand that some people have all these uber pretty weapons because they play a lot more than I do and have either grinded enough quests to be lucky enough to pull one or have the plat to afford one. Although now that I know that just a Wounder isn't completely useless I'll have to shop around for one for my pally, or start being more careful about what I sell to the vendor, so thanks for that tip

Like I said in my last post, I did not put any criteria in any LFM I made. If I made someone feel unwelcome by making them feel like they were inconveinencing me, I apologize, I did not mean to.

I would rather learn new quests with others that knew nothing than run in there with 5 others that have beaten it 6 times already. Cerialkiller was in my group when we ran the white dragon on hard. And we failed numerous times, but each time we got better and better and came up with a method that I think any casual player could use to defeat it. I admit, I have all the gear in the world, but I would not say tha about the rest of the party.

I think you and I are on the same page, unless you have other information about me I am unaware of.

I personally didn't see your LFM yesterday so it wasn't directed at you personally, and if I'd been on the game I'm sure Cerial would have dragged me along for the ride

Like I said, I don't expect hand-holding, I just want to be given a chance, I might have some tricks up my sleeve

[yeoleADD]

Tons of new content being ran all weekend- was almost impossible to get a shroud in. Don't know when you're playing, but I saw constant gem, rune, essence runs all weekend on Ghallanda with almost no VOD or Shroud.

... and some of us still want to craft loot for which we can predict the result the first time -lol.

"In yet, when new content comes out, you STILL run the Shroud over and over." How do you know that the same people who are complaining about Shroud being boring are the ones still running it over and again?

Just have fun doing the runs/quests that you like- no need to goad other players or make assumptions about others who are simply doing what they enjoy. There are tons of people just learning the new content- that may be the most significant reason why you cannot find companions for White Dragon on elite...

[Gratch]

I was trying to make the content last longer by not running it. That or I was trying to key 4 characters and also noticed the lack of new content PUG'ing. I did see a lot of guild groups running stuff while I waited though.... even got into a few of them.

Also got hit by a few of the bugs... like the walls that never fall in Prey for The Walls to Fall and the kobold endboss who jumped into the side of the mountain and had to be acid fog'ed to death - though he could still cast at us... evil sploiting kobolds!

I do find the new outdoor areas easily soloable with the wizard and annoying with the melee.

[ChaelaAnne]

While it'd be nice if it really worked like that, I have to disagree. "know the way" usually means "we're halfway thru the quest already and we don't want to hold your hand thru the explorer area and half the quest cuz we don't wanna babysit a noob." "know what's up" means they get annoyed if you dare ask what buffs you should throw or what spells work best against a certain enemy. "bring the right equipment" usually means WoPs. I sent a polite tell to such a group once and they wouldn't let me join because I didn't have a WoP. So yeah...

I don't appreciate being treated like a noob when I'm working on my third capped toon, and when I go out of my way to play different classes to increase my knowledge...

Would you please post something I don't agree with please, because it's starting to freak me out a LOT.

(I read the post, then say EXACTLY! and then look at who wrote it, and it's almost always you.)

[BattleCircle]

I had fun pugging the new stuff. It was costly sure, but there is no greater fun than a group sticking together and wondering what will happen next.

It seems to me that there were few lfms because most were runnging guild groups, and lots of shroud and subterrane groups because,,, well some guilds have enough for a good start on a raid group but not enough for two 6 man groups. That and the sub loot is awesome and easily obtained.

I think I am ready to unlock Sorjek, but not sure... my dragon essence took alot of damage, may have to run it again,

ok, I'm done rambling

[Thriand]

I think I have a good method for it and am posivite a group of puggers could go in and defeat it. The real point is that nobody seems to want to try.

Also Thri, you are in a great guild with lots of exceptional players. It may be easy to run the new content with 5 other very good players all with decks out equipment. The real question is whether it is hard running with your average pugger that doesn't know what you mean when you ask if they have a WOP, let alone having any teir three shroud items.

wait there are people out there without wops? Its true though I tend to opt to solo and short man things before I take puggers along, especially with newer content. I'm fairly confident that I could take your average group of people in any of the new content on elite and beat it so long as they are willing to listen and follow directions.

[ChaelaAnne]

Sorry to single out this one comment - but I am frequently annoyed by players on this issue.

1) I have never "required" WoP's. WoP is a rare weapon, and GOOD WoP's with a decent crit ranger are even rarer yet.

2) Conversely, I get extremely infuriated when a melee has NO CON DAMAGE WEAPON AT ALL. I have been using wounders on my melees since the level cap was 10. They have always been effective, and are even more effective when used in groups (i.e. everyone in group is using con damage). Wounders are not rare and they are effective. If you are trying to vorpal while everyone else is doing con damage - you are a waste of the healer's mana.

Sirea, as stated, this comment is not meant to inflame you in anyway, but hopefully can be a wake up call for the melees out there that think just because they aren't "uber enough" (often said in a snide/mocking way) to dual-wield WoP rapiers - that they have an excuse to run around complaining about how overpowered and unbalanced the game is when they don't even have a wounding weapon easily available at level 8.

Teamwork = working together. For melees, this usually means using similar types of weapons. Con damage has rocked in this game for a long time - you don't need a WoP rapier for it to continue to do so.

/rant off and back to the bard forums

Samadhi, I just recently pulled my first wounder, and sadly they are just SO freakin' expensive on the AH. I think it's more important to keep enough heal pots to go from just res'd to full health three times, and enough scrolls to try and make up a really bad party to a cleric. This keeps me relativly broke all the time.

I think there are other things to do.... A general DPS weapon can be useful as well. I'm just sayin', people shouldn't have to feel like they have to spend a fortune on the auction house.

[shane1122]

Oogly (and others),
I have been reading all the new Mod 8 threads with great interest since I have yet to be able to try it. Sadly Mod 8 was just more than my old computer could take and downloading the Mod killed her. New computer ordered and in the mail... until then I will enjoy the new content through the forums.

Anyway, just wanted to comment that I noticed the same phenomenon several Mods ago. Just days before Mod 8 went live I was still seeing postings in the forums where people stated they had yet to run VoD, or would not try it until the lvl cap was raised. Way into Mod 7 there were still plenty of "Reaver 3 of 12" LFMs. I completely understand leveling new characters through raids like the Reaver, but still cycling lvl 16 characters through every three days after two years?

For whatever reasons, there seem to be plenty of players that enjoy running old, comfortable content vice venturing into unknown quests and raids. On the positive side the changes to old quests, like the Reaver, may help some of these folks to move on. On the negative side, a fun lvl 14 appropriate raid had to be re-written so it was relevant to lvl 16 characters that should have been filling Shroud, VoD, and Hound raids.

-Shane

[Blue_Whale]

Dude, I saw a couple of your LFM's and want to join soooo bad. But I was helping grind gems and loot the skellie.

I will totally hit you up tonight thou..

This said it all for me.

First though, you made a lot of valid point Oogly and am sorry to hear your disappointment of lack of lfm for new content. I can't speak for everyone but for me, I wasn't impressed with new mod 8 at all. In fact, I was quite disappointed with it. The tactic of time-sink the dev keep using is getting boring. Making us run ALL over the place just to get 6 gems and then another 3 essense to be flagged? For a quest at that and NOT a raid. I don't like being told to jump through hoops. To me it's like being told "if you wash my car, go fill up with gas, go to the liquor store to get a keg, stop by and pick up some food, THEN you can come to my party". Wow, thanks for the invite. I can pick up the keg and stop by for food to come to your party but if I have to do all of that, well I can just throw my own party then. Getting the 3 essence is bad enough but to make us all run all over GH, orchard and the sand for gems...geesh why not add finding a needle in a haystack to the mix? Not my idea of fun or creativity. I can understand why some would not rush to run all over the place searching for gems to be flagged. And say you need gems (all of them) and put an lfm up: "gem hunting in all area starting with GH". You may get people to join then someone in party got his/her gem. What you think will happen next? I got my gem in this area thanks for the grp and drop. 5 more gems to go, I don't have time to stick around. We've all complained about this before: The party helped you get your stuff and as soon as you got it, you don't want to stick around to help everyone else in the party. Fortunately, my guildies are great. We all helped each other getting the gems needed. Some didn't even need the gem but went ahead to another instance (say GH) and cleared all of the names and found 5 chests. Didn't even open one of the chest and just sat there waiting for me to finish up with my current instance (say the sand) and then send me an invite so we can go loot the 5 chests in GH. Some guildies helped out a lot doing it like this many, many time over of "rinse and repeat". On top of that, some are flagged but can't go on the new quest because they feel guilty for the remaining guildies who have yet to be flagged and don't want to leave them behind. And then there were some, who did help flag but after a few times of "rinse and repeat" and cannot wait any longer to try out the new quest, went ahead with those already flagged. And then there were those who just recently logged on and not aware of those who have been through a few cycles of "rinse and repeat" and felt leftout of the new quest and blamed them for going ahead with the new quest. This is why I am not a fan of "being told to jump through hoops". It's even worse for those who are not as fortunate as I am to be in great guild so I can understand for the lack of lfm for the new content. The time-sink tactic the dev keep subjecting us to is getting old and excessive. Again, getting the 3 essense and maybe the 3 gems from the new area is bad enough. But to add 3 more gems collecting from GH, sand and orchard, it sure made me loose interest in the new quests. For mod 9, how about topping the time-sink tactic and make us get 6 gems, 3 essence AND 20 of each relics in GH in order to be flagged. Like I said earlier, it is as much fun as finding a needle in a haystack. I'm willing to do some of it to be flagged but it's getting too much.

Here's a thought for you and everyone else on the server. For the 4th new quest, there is no timer after you complete it but you do have to get flagged again. Say a couple of weeks down the road after all this novelty wears off, how many of us will be willing to keep doing that 4th quest then? Queen raid is dead because people hate doing the flagging for it. Getting the blood bowl and wiz king is ok but chains of flame is too long of a run just to get to the entrance and the quest itself is too long to flag. Do you think many of us will continue to flag to do this new 4th quest? All 3 of the essence collecting quests are long with lots of running by everything to reach the end boss fight for completion (like chain of flames). What's worse, this 4th quest we have to keep flagging is not even a raid. After the novelty wears off, I see mod 8 to be as dead as the queen raid.

I share your disappointment, Oogly. There are some great new content, great graphics addition, new quests are interesting and different but the dev keeps spoiling it for me with all this flagging, jumping through hoops for the sake of time-sink effect. Keep rinsing and repeating? "Are we there yet", dev?

[BattleCircle]

Django
Developer Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 37



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You should be able to access the Eerie Forest as long as someone in your group has the required items to open the portal.







Does this mean that not everyone in the group would have to re-flag?

[Killbilly]

Does this mean that not everyone in the group would have to re-flag?

No, it just means that you can take a group into the adventure area without everyone having gotten all six gems. Everyone still needs to turn in all 3 essences to get into the actual quest.

[Bronko]

Sorry, Oogly. I'm getting in late on the reply but here are my two coppers.

With such a small amount of new high-level content for Mod 8 I am simply not surprised nobody is running it. There simply isn't much of a draw. This Mod was all about the NPE with these new quests and the limited amount of new crafting added in as sort of a rubber bone for the high-level gamers it would seem.

Speaking of crafting, I'd be happy to avoid the Shroud for a whole year but the grind of crafting pretty much forces me to be in there.

As for the uberness of Ghallanda and the excitement of taking out the new material first you need only look at Ravensgard to see that some of us are doing it.

Be patient my friend. Heck, I still have 6 other characters to flag for the new quest so it might be a bit before I even step foot in there.

[cornelius]

"As for the uberness of Ghallanda and the excitement of taking out the new material first you need only look at Ravensgard to see that some of us are doing it."

Good for you. Fortunately, Ravensguard only groups with Ravensguard. Maybe you should post some screen shots so you can brag about your accomplishments. The arrogance spewing from Ravensguards makes me want to throw up.

News flash. There are other things in life more important that tooting your own horn on the DDO forums. Does anyone from Ravensguard have a life?

[Dogchair]

"As for the uberness of Ghallanda and the excitement of taking out the new material first you need only look at Ravensgard to see that some of us are doing it."

Good for you. Fortunately, Ravensguard only groups with Ravensguard. Maybe you should post some screen shots so you can brag about your accomplishments. The arrogance spewing from Ravensguards makes me want to throw up.

News flash. There are other things in life more important that tooting your own horn on the DDO forums. Does anyone from Ravensguard have a life?

I'm not in RG and I've many a raid with them. If you are mostly prepared, have better than average ability to LISTEN and use your head, running with them isn't hard. I can even say after getting into an embarrassing argument/debate over politics with a RG member the FIRST time i ran with them, I STILL run things with them if I'm on.

Confidence and arrogance seem the same to those misinformed.

Katet, RG, Souls, TIP, THACO, etc. Every guild has an idiot, with a mouth. Judging a guild by the loudest or the minority, is asking to be judged by one misinformed post on the forums, which as we all know isn't cool or fair.

I'm tired of people lumping EVRYONE, or EVERYTHING, or using all inclusive words to make a point best made by being truthful and accurate.

I'm far from uber, but I run with uber and non-uber alike. You want to run with good/great players? Ask them what would make you better. Ask them how you can fit into the team that kicks ass. When I started playing my cleric, I asked every group, how was i doing, what to do better, etc. My tank rat? poor build, i make it work, i listen to others, I try new ideas. Little ole me ran the first known elite hound by using everything I knew and listening to those failed runs, and sucessful runs on norm.

I'm really not trying to berate you here. I'm trying to help you understand. Being uber or good is really about adaptation and awareness and observation. The gear helps, but I know lots of crappy players with uber gear. Thats why in raids you tend to pick the player over the build first, well I do anyhow. Create a team.

RG is a team. Find your team and elevate your game, like they did....or do.

my 2 cents

-Dogchair

[geoffhanna]

We have the same on Sarlona.

I think everyone was trying to loot the subterrane before today's downtime. I am guessing it is better tonight.

Meaning... already! Guess I'd better log in and find out

[Dirac]

Oogly, I would have taken you up in a second. Unfortunately, I haven't been able to play much recently because of RL obligations. Also, more guildies coming back for MOD 8 (yay!) had me playing in guild when I was able to get on.

Count me as one who wants to do the new stuff. Also, as one very impressed with the new stuff I've seen (with the exception of the white dragon timer).

[cornelius]

I'm not in RG and I've many a raid with them. If you are mostly prepared, have better than average ability to LISTEN and use your head, running with them isn't hard. I can even say after getting into an embarrassing argument/debate over politics with a RG member the FIRST time i ran with them, I STILL run things with them if I'm on.

Confidence and arrogance seem the same to those misinformed.

Katet, RG, Souls, TIP, THACO, etc. Every guild has an idiot, with a mouth. Judging a guild by the loudest or the minority, is asking to be judged by one misinformed post on the forums, which as we all know isn't cool or fair.

I'm tired of people lumping EVRYONE, or EVERYTHING, or using all inclusive words to make a point best made by being truthful and accurate.

I'm far from uber, but I run with uber and non-uber alike. You want to run with good/great players? Ask them what would make you better. Ask them how you can fit into the team that kicks ass. When I started playing my cleric, I asked every group, how was i doing, what to do better, etc. My tank rat? poor build, i make it work, i listen to others, I try new ideas. Little ole me ran the first known elite hound by using everything I knew and listening to those failed runs, and sucessful runs on norm.

I'm really not trying to berate you here. I'm trying to help you understand. Being uber or good is really about adaptation and awareness and observation. The gear helps, but I know lots of crappy players with uber gear. Thats why in raids you tend to pick the player over the build first, well I do anyhow. Create a team.

RG is a team. Find your team and elevate your game, like they did....or do.

my 2 cents

-Dogchair

I have run with them many times too. I was in a guild with half of Ravensguard. I ran with them for 3.5 hours one night and FAILED over and over again on the Abbot. I ran with them and FAILED on the Shroud on Elite. My point is that there are plenty of other groups of people out there that run quests on elite all the time, but don't feel the need to come to these forums and brag themselves up all the time. Those same people also don't feel the need to put down other people whom they feel are inferior or tell other people their builds are ****. Ravensguard is full of people who are arrogant, not confident. I know the difference Chair. They act like they have never failed a quest and we all know that is not true.

I especially loved this part," I'm trying to help you understand. Being uber or good is really about adaptation and awareness and observation." Thanks for the definition. And although I agree with you, it has nothing to do with my point. My point was that RG is full of people that think way too highly of themselves and treat other people poorly for no reason. I have seen it on many occasions. I could list names or examples, but I won't do it. Yes, running with Ravensguard is easy, just be prepared to hear some world class whining if the quest is failed.

I have seen examples of this same behavior with you Chair. I have run with you many times. In fact I ran the Shroud on hard with you and your cleric and we failed. You berated several other people during that run when in reality you held just as much blame if not more than the people you were berating. So get off your high horse and stop trying to help me understand simple definitions.